buldog5151bass
Kibble, milkbones, and P Basses. And redheads.
If I were to drop that kind of coin, I'd either want to go and check out the specific instrument, or take to the builder to get what I want.
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Ken smith
- Thread starter vegemite
- Start date
I had a CR 5 in the 90’s and I grew to dislike it for many reasons mentioned by others. The sound in my head is a jazz bass and the smith does not do that. I moved on but boy should have held on to it for appreciation 
I have to agree with this! KS is a big enough brand and has been around long enough where I imagine you could find a used one in Australia, or possibly even a new one in a shop. I'm sure you'll get many recommendations on high end basses here (I would suggest Elrick for build quality, ergonomics and sound) but with most you are going to run into similar price issues and none with be a KS, which is what you want. Good luck and let us know what you end up with.
Mark Jones’ basses do sound very similar to a Ken Smith bass. I own a Jones SM2 6 (Jones SM2 Brown Bass) and Mark is building a slightly modified SM2 Single Cut 6 (longer upper horn now called the SM2e). IMHO, the SM2 looks more like an Alembic than a Smith, and it sounds just like a Smith, not an Alembic.
FWIW, Jones basses are totally top notch, with high quality woods and craftsmanship. Likewise, Ken builds fantastic basses and I’ve played a few of them up until a few years ago.
I would tend to disagree a bit on the lack of lows from either Jones or Smith basses. The lows are definitely there if you want them. They’re just not muddy and are more pristine throughout the range.
Again, IMHO the Japanese Smiths, while similar, are not true Ken Smith basses. I’ve played a couple but it’s been a minute since I did. Necks are not as good as Ken’s shop builds. Woods aren’t the same, and craftsmanship is close, but Ken’s shop builds are better.
What I like about both Smith and Jones basses is the tone. No, it’s not a Fender P or Jazz, but they cut in a mix just as well. I find the allure of the Smith sound has more to do with the treble and upper mids (and bass) than the lower mids of other basses. Again, IMHO the Smith sound also comes from Smith strings - both being stainless and the gauge accentuate the upper mids and treble.
Truly, one can get close with Smith pickups from Dan Armstrong - he sells Ken the pickups - and a Smith similar preamp, installed in another bass. But the woods and construction will be the final factor. Smith tone in his neck through instruments is more naturally compressed than any sort of bolt on bass.
Know that some Smiths (and Jones) balance exceptionally well while seated but neck dive just a bit while standing. I ended up putting an extra strap button (Dunlop recessed version) on my Jones and it’s much better while standing now. Just do your homework and test them out as you would play them before buying.
Look, I get it, bass players are a passionate bunch. There’s something about a Smith. Whether it is the woods, the tone, craftsmanship, sound or the price - there’s a draw to them. The Jones currently scratches my former Smith itch. For me, they play better, are more versatile and are in my current budget.
John
FWIW, Jones basses are totally top notch, with high quality woods and craftsmanship. Likewise, Ken builds fantastic basses and I’ve played a few of them up until a few years ago.
I would tend to disagree a bit on the lack of lows from either Jones or Smith basses. The lows are definitely there if you want them. They’re just not muddy and are more pristine throughout the range.
Again, IMHO the Japanese Smiths, while similar, are not true Ken Smith basses. I’ve played a couple but it’s been a minute since I did. Necks are not as good as Ken’s shop builds. Woods aren’t the same, and craftsmanship is close, but Ken’s shop builds are better.
What I like about both Smith and Jones basses is the tone. No, it’s not a Fender P or Jazz, but they cut in a mix just as well. I find the allure of the Smith sound has more to do with the treble and upper mids (and bass) than the lower mids of other basses. Again, IMHO the Smith sound also comes from Smith strings - both being stainless and the gauge accentuate the upper mids and treble.
Truly, one can get close with Smith pickups from Dan Armstrong - he sells Ken the pickups - and a Smith similar preamp, installed in another bass. But the woods and construction will be the final factor. Smith tone in his neck through instruments is more naturally compressed than any sort of bolt on bass.
Know that some Smiths (and Jones) balance exceptionally well while seated but neck dive just a bit while standing. I ended up putting an extra strap button (Dunlop recessed version) on my Jones and it’s much better while standing now. Just do your homework and test them out as you would play them before buying.
Look, I get it, bass players are a passionate bunch. There’s something about a Smith. Whether it is the woods, the tone, craftsmanship, sound or the price - there’s a draw to them. The Jones currently scratches my former Smith itch. For me, they play better, are more versatile and are in my current budget.
John
Check with Danny at Bass Japan Direct. If he doesn't have any Smiths, he may have something else that would interest you.
He posts a lot of clips of himself playing the basses he has in stock. You might get a decent idea of what to expect.
I don't know what the actual numbers are, but seems like a bass going from Japan to Australia would be less costly than buying from the US.
He posts a lot of clips of himself playing the basses he has in stock. You might get a decent idea of what to expect.
I don't know what the actual numbers are, but seems like a bass going from Japan to Australia would be less costly than buying from the US.
My first encounter with a Smith bass was around 1992 and it had immediately became clear this is what I want, however way out of reach. A decade later I made the mistake and invested in a custom order from another builder, instead of putting down a bit more on a Smith. It took almost another decade and in 2010 I finally got myself a used BSR5GN. That was it. I've since switched to a 4 string model as the 5 became too heavy for me. That's the only down side. Besides that it's the perfect bass. Nothing plays, feels, sounds like it. Some others may come close, maybe, but never really get there. It's all about in those 10% @jharms80439 has mentioned. Got to admit though, with current prices the decision going that route is harder then ever.
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The USA made Peavey Cirrus are sometimes talked about as “Smith-ish”. They certainly have similar pickup placement (closer to the bridge) which is definitely a big part of why Ken Smiths sound that way. The Cirrus is also a gorgeously built neck through design. I love my Cirrus 5. The craftsmanship is like boutique/handmade. Maybe the best production line bass of all time- but that could be me just trying to throw out a dramatic hot take claim haha.
You might be able to get a used Cirrus shipped to you for far less than a Smith. Maybe worth a try anyway!
You might be able to get a used Cirrus shipped to you for far less than a Smith. Maybe worth a try anyway!
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Was this recently? Rose coloured memories and all - please be sure it's really what you want before forking out that sort of money, because if there's any buyer's regret, moving it on is going to take a lot of time as the market is soft and you have a small potential buyer base in Australia.
Best wishes and I hope you love it if you get it.
Depends how much magic your budget allows...... The OP is talking about costs and worries about spending too much, I was just giving options
The Smith Sound is Kent Armstrong usa (Vermont made, and he makes Ken's pickups) in parallel in the Smith pickup positions, an ebony fingerboard and a HazLab pre. HazLab is a no-go commercially available pre, but the Trickfish Flex Core gets you darn close. You can get pickups that do the Smith thing from Kent.
Have someone you respect locally build out a bass to your spec with those pickups, pre and an ebony board. It could be a Smithemite!
I am having him make me a set as we speak. Dropping into a bass with the Trickfish already installed. Doing the same with a new Cliff Bordwell CB that is on order and due in the fall.
Or, get on a plane, fly to PA and pick up from Ken in person. He'd probably be helpful price wise since you'd travel that far. Cheaper.
Have someone you respect locally build out a bass to your spec with those pickups, pre and an ebony board. It could be a Smithemite!
I am having him make me a set as we speak. Dropping into a bass with the Trickfish already installed. Doing the same with a new Cliff Bordwell CB that is on order and due in the fall.
Or, get on a plane, fly to PA and pick up from Ken in person. He'd probably be helpful price wise since you'd travel that far. Cheaper.
This nebulous 'magic' is a wonderful thing to justify any purchase, especially when the cost disparity between 90 and 100% is vast. Can be substituted with 'cool' or 'mojo'.
That was a serious concern that I had, given my short stature with short arms and small hands. It has never been a problem for me on either my four or five string U.S. Cirrus basses. They play like magic in my opinion and sound incredible…especially with the versatility added by the mid sweep from the Millenium preamp. I admit that I have never played a Ken Smith bass (or an NYC Sadowsky, or Jones bass), so I can’t make any comparisons there. However, from a cost perspective, I believe they are an incredible value.
Kim
