Learning a large set of songs with different difficulty

[Session1969]

I'd start learning with an emphasis on the difficult ones but I'd reward myself with a medium and easy one as well . If you could learn a song a day or more, that would be great. If the gig is 60 days away and you learn them in 40, you'll have 20 fays to really solidify them in your memory.

 

[boamedt]

Cmon, i suck, and i learned 20 songs in one week, no charts, and we didnt get to even practice with the singer, we met him an hour before we played. It was all original reggae i had a a cd to listen to learn. And he expeected perfection. messenjah selah. It was a fun gig i learned alot from. I definitely suggest starting with easy ones as others have suggested. I at least only had to learn one bass players style so the harder songs became easier after i had already learned the easy ones. Best of luck. You cana do it! (Rob schnieder voice)

 

[nolaguy]

Hello!

Once again I search the wisdom of Talkbass

I need to learn a pretty large set (around forty songs) in 2 months. There are song that are rather easy (1 practice session), some are medium (2 or 3 practice sessions), some are difficult (4 to 5 practice sessions) and some are really difficult (4 to 5 sessions with regular palying after that to bump up the tempo up to original).

How would you take on it? Start with most complicated, or the easy ones, or mix them up?

I need to be efficient and not lose the grip

Does the band have charts of these tunes or would you have to make your own?

 

[1954bassman]

Lots of good advice here, my approach would include getting a set list and learning entire sets all the way through. I also concur with making a CD, mp3 or whatever, and listen to the songs exclusively anytime you have a chance.

Check with the band you are joining (maybe even the old bass player) for any cheat sheets that are available. Also, find out what their "money" songs are - and make sure you have them nailed down, even the "simple" ones.

Also, most times groove and feel trump precision.

 

[hintz]

I'd just go for quantity before anything else!! I'd chart out the easier songs 1st then *everything else * before even practicing any song!! I would then double check, refine and shrink down the charts with rhythmic slashes for the grooves.


After
charting out everything I'd then systematically run through *everything* in the set everyday (preferably in order of set) and for the more difficult songs just get the form down more so than the individual parts, like maybe run "what is hip?" with 8th notes (or "broken 16ths")as your running down the songs!


After running the whole set id sit with the metronome and focus on getting that up to speed and any other problem spots or whole songs, then id run everything another few times! Eventually taking away the charts as familiarity sinks in...

I do it this way because I don't want to overlook anything no matter the skill level needed, so I wouldn't focus on the hard tunes first but rather all the song's forms and pure quantity just to get it outta the way to get everything polished, IME when I focused more on difficult songs I always felt like it was "down to the wire" with a majority of songs that I neglected because they were "easy"!

Of course YMMV, but I have to do this on a regular basis often with little notice(sometimes only hours if that) where I'm not provided sheet music or charts!!

But you got 2 months, you'll be fine!! Hell, use a pick if you need to for the T.O.P. song....

 

[dreamadream99]

I had to learn 40 songs for a cover band once, in 4 weeks--10 per week. I just transcribed them, and read the music the first few gigs. After a few gigs I had them memorized and didn't need the charts anymore.

 

[hintz]

. Also, find out what their "money" songs are - and make sure you have them nailed down, even the "simple" ones.

Also, most times groove and feel trump precision.

Exactly!! Like notes in a good bass line, you said what I was trying to convey with many words you said in a few!

I do ramble alot *and* overplay sometimes LOL

 

[bikeplate]

First thing I always do is listen to what I need to learn a number of times. Gets the arrangements etched into my brain and conditions me for the chord changes or places where there are riffs. I then proceed to play along. Really makes nailing songs much easier in my opinion

 

[drakson]

Personally when learning something I listen to the song, look at tab, then watch a live performance if available, sometimes a "lesson" on YouTube and then make up my own mind and take pieces of what I think sounds good.
I had to learn about 80 songs and learned about 10 "easier one" first just to have something to play before I start "practicing". When practicing if I get tired of
trying to learn a certain song I take a break and play the "easier ones" I already know just to have a little fun before "practicing" the harder song again. Learning the harder song in parts seem to help. If I don't have a song "perfect" but still get the main parts well I will play it live but still practice on the certain
parts to get them better next time. I don't like to play live without being comfortable and playing the whole song "right" but sometimes time is the factor and if all the other bandmates have the song and want to play it I will but again I will practice on the parts at home so next time live it sounds even better to me.

 

[bigfatbass]

While never a cover band guy, in recent years I have been asked to do 3 different 1-off tribute night sets. First was to learn the entire movie versions of all the music from The Band's "The Last Waltz". That was pretty cool damn cool. Since then I've done The Black Crowes "Southern Harmony And Musical Companion", and I am currently working on learning Springsteen's "Born To Run" in it's entirety for a show the end of January. Man does Garry Tallent play some cool lines!

While I do sometimes get assistance from online charts and sheet music, I prefer to create my own charts, and I try to avoid tab unless I am REALLY stuck on a fingering. I find it hampers my ability to think about the parts musically, and I just end up memorizing shapes by rote.

+1 to putting the hardest stuff first. "What Is Hip" is serious business.

 

[james condino]

The difficult tunes will take the most effort to learn, but you should make a strong effort to learn the majority of the easy ones early on. That way then rest of the band can see that you are making an honest effort working towards the end goal and you'll have plenty to rehearse in the two months. Remember that it is highly likely that the rest of the band will have their own individual struggles, often with tunes that are not so difficult for you.

 

[Groove Doctor]

Time management and working your plan is essential. What has worked best for you in the past??

My approach...
- smash 10 easy ones as quick as you can. Restrict to 15mins per song: write down basic song structure, first note you play, first chord of each section, finishing note, plus any chords progressions you can't wing-it by ear. (25% songs done in one night).

- do 'scaled down' versions of 6 medium songs the next night, 20 mins each. Basic structure & feel only, plus tips above. (15% + 25% above = 40% done).

- session three. Hit the hardest two songs, 30 mins each (tips above). Then play once thru without stopping all songs you've already learned.

- session 4: same as session 3. (20 songs, 50% done in 4 days).

- Sessions 5-8: hit the next 20 songs, as per 1-4. (each song has been looked at in the first week).

You really need to get the basics into your head as fast as possible.

Allow plenty of time for them to stew in your subconscious over the coming weeks.


THEN....

You're free to go into detail on the hardest songs and work backwards to the easiest songs.

Make sure you run thru ALL the songs at least once every week. Repetition is your friend for memorising them.

 

[Groove Doctor]

+1 to all tips above: MP3 playlists, listen in car, headphones during day, etc.

I've found to really concentrate best on one specific song, I practice it before work, listen on repeat in the car to work, play fingering on 'air bass', and just let it go around in my brain all day and come night time it's firmly sunk in.

 

[belzebass]

But you got 2 months, you'll be fine!! Hell, use a pick if you need to for the T.O.P. song....

Hell, I might. Those straight 16th are hard to make sound clean and even.

+1 to putting the hardest stuff first. "What Is Hip" is serious business.

That's what I was thinking. Hardest stuff (at least the songs with the bass lines that cannot be really altered, or with lots of unison lines) first, so I have repeated it as many times as I can. For songs that don't have fixed/signature lines,, less repetition is needed.

Remember that it is highly likely that the rest of the band will have their own individual struggles, often with tunes that are not so difficult for you.

By the way, I don't rehearse with the band yet. The bass player would like to have a sub in case of impossibility of making the gig. So I'm free to organise as I wish. And the band is tight, I've seen them live.

+1 to all tips above: MP3 playlists, listen in car, headphones during day, etc.

Yeah, it's done!

 

[jazzyvee]

My approach has been this. Before I even try to play any of them I put them on the CD player in the car and listen to it every day to and from work and all my other journeys. Also listen to them on my iPod when at my desk or pottering around. This helps me to learn and absorb the arrangement of each of songs which is really the key. Generally I find it's not the technical ability that is the difficult part it's really understanding the arrangement and dynamics. Doing it this way I find I can rehearse the bass lines in my head visually so that when I eventually pick up my instrument to play , my fingers pretty much are in the right ball park of where to go. If there are any really technically challenging parts on any song that's where I tend to go to first when I start to play them.

 

[jazzyvee]

Yes, it is over my head. But that's the challenge. As an example of a quite hard song is "What is hip" by Tower of Power. Than there are other in 120 bpm range with lots of 16th note grooves :-/
I was thinking if it really is not achievable, I could always dumb down some basslines to keep the feel, cut out variations, and see if it's enough to begin with . And than, learn gradually the real deal. Plus As I work on one difficult song, the whole skillset should increase and it should get easier... At least in theory
.

I remember putting Marcus Miller's version of What is Hip? into my set list a few years back when I'd never done any double thumbing and not much slapping either. That was a real challenge to play. I found it so hard to maintain a consistent stream of 16th notes and keep good time. It's still a challenge now especially when the pace is faster than normal but I keep it on the set list as it's become our encore track. But I would find it much more difficult to play the original finger style version.

 

[obimark]

Yes, it is over my head. But that's the challenge. As an example of a quite hard song is "What is hip" by Tower of Power. Than there are other in 120 bpm range with lots of 16th note grooves :-/
I was thinking if it really is not achievable, I could always dumb down some basslines to keep the feel, cut out variations, and see if it's enough to begin with . And than, learn gradually the real deal. Plus As I work on one difficult song, the whole skillset should increase and it should get easier... At least in theory

Plus, some lines are not really signature lines so I can extract the backbone of the groove, and improvise over it. In the end, I still want to learn the lines as they are, at least very close, but the end date is not so close.



Yes, defenitely, I've done downloading bass covers of most songs. I also make bassless (I equalize the bass out) versions on songs at different tempos to gradually increase it.

You have to be up to that level playing on your instrument to begin with.

No offense, but most bassist are not up to the What is Hip playing level- primarily because Rocco plays with a unique technique developed through 1000s of hours of practice.

Even after 25 years of playing EVERY day I could barely do that song justice. (And then to get it tight with a BAND, entirely different problems)

My one band covered "Nightmare" by Avenged Sevenfold, and while my picking technique is pretty good, those intro extreme speed triplets are beyond me.

 

[interp]

I refer you to my go-to guy, Lee Sklar. When he got the call to fill in for Mike Porcaro of Toto in the middle of their world tour he had five days to learn their entire set. He said that luckily he had tapes of their current show. He spent two days doing nothing but listening to those tapes while driving around LA. Then he spent two more days with his bass learning the parts.

Of course, Lee is the consummate studio ace and quick learner and probably none of us will ever reach that level, but the principle is valid: listen to that poopie, all of it, constantly.

 

[interp]

I remember putting Marcus Miller's version of What is Hip? into my set list a few years back when I'd never done any double thumbing and not much slapping either. That was a real challenge to play. I found it so hard to maintain a consistent stream of 16th notes and keep good time. It's still a challenge now especially when the pace is faster than normal but I keep it on the set list as it's become our encore track. But I would find it much more difficult to play the original finger style version.

I played WIH back in the 70s and of course never reached the facility of Rocco on that tune. I've watched him play it live from a very close distance several times and still don't understand how he does it (other than the fact that he's devoted thousands of hours of practicing that technique, of course). It doesn't hurt to be playing it with Dave Garibaldi.

 

[belzebass]

I remember putting Marcus Miller's version of What is Hip? into my set list a few years back when I'd never done any double thumbing and not much slapping either. That was a real challenge to play. I found it so hard to maintain a consistent stream of 16th notes and keep good time. It's still a challenge now especially when the pace is faster than normal but I keep it on the set list as it's become our encore track. But I would find it much more difficult to play the original finger style version.

You have to be up to that level playing on your instrument to begin with.

No offense, but most bassist are not up to the What is Hip playing level- primarily because Rocco plays with a unique technique developed through 1000s of hours of practice.

Even after 25 years of playing EVERY day I could barely do that song justice. (And then to get it tight with a BAND, entirely different problems)

My one band covered "Nightmare" by Avenged Sevenfold, and while my picking technique is pretty good, those intro extreme speed triplets are beyond me.

I played WIH back in the 70s and of course never reached the facility of Rocco on that tune. I've watched him play it live from a very close distance several times and still don't understand how he does it (other than the fact that he's devoted thousands of hours of practicing that technique, of course). It doesn't hurt to be playing it with Dave Garibaldi.

There's "Only so much oil in the ground" on the list too, but I find it easier. Somehow an unholy mix of 8th and 16th is easier than straight 16th, even at a higher tempo.