Hello all, Going through some of my favs on YouTube today. I have a lot of Claypool/Primus videos. Not a single video on there has someone in the comments section saying "Claypool sucks" "Primus is shat". What gives? Is it just YT haters or something I`m not aware of? I mean the dude is out there, funny at times. I mean he is loaded with talent and is my favorite soloist as far as bass players go. Wanted to get the opinions of real bass players, not the usual youtube haters. Lord the man makes music with one string! What more do they want? I saw him on his acoustic tour and he blew my mind!
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Les Claypool/Primus...........were is the love?
- Thread starter RicKee
- Start date
"Primus sucks" is kind of their thing- that is showing the love if I'm getting your question correctly.
Fat Steve
The poodle bites, the poodle chews it.
Keep in mind also that youtube commenters are some of the most vile, mean-spirited folks in the world.
I've been playing Primus songs for about 17 years now, so I'm likely as qualified as anyone to break down Les' style. Please note all of my comments are being made as a person that's loved this band for about 25 years, have seen them over 10 times, and learned most of their catalog up to 2002 by 2003 or so.
Les is a divisive bass player because he specifically has developed a style that is incredibly unique, but flies in the face of conventional playing.
His strumming technique, for example, is extremely uncommon. To the point that when I heard Alex/Dirk from Incubus use it on a track of theirs (Privilege IIRC), in 2001, on the radio I literally had to stop and figure out what band it was. When I realized it was Incubus and Alex (who I went to school with) I was relieved as only he, myself, Stanley Clarke and a handful of guys that have studied either Stanley or Les actually do that and I was worried about additional competition.
Again, it's an incredibly uncommon technique. I broke it out at a jam at the Baked Potato a week or two ago and a few guys ***'d on me. Stanley invented it in the 70s, but it is simply not mainstream.
Once you get past the "man that looks amazing" factor, and actually break down the parts a few patterns emerge:
1) Melodically Les can be a bit limited. Lots of flat seconds and minor thirds in his stuff. You do not get a lot of Primus songs in a major key. This isn't a problem, but it does limit their variety.
2) Since they're a trio, their tonal center is often somewhat ambiguous so he just tosses in a lot of chromatic stuff as well. It *works* because he doesn't clash with big chords coming off of Ler. In a larger band context he either has to hold back on that stuff, or pulls it out when other guys are laying *waaaay* back.
3) Unless you plan to write everything in your band, play bass, and sing, he's a bad example to follow too closely. I'm speaking from experience as someone that was the musically dominant force in a band that was nearly signed. His style is so very dominant musically, that I'd speculate if he had not developed as a singer or primary song writer for Primus, he probably would be a guy with a day job, playing kick ass bass in a cover band a few times a month for fun. He would have eventually clashed with the singer, guitarist, or producer otherwise.
4) Les uses three fingers in a galloping style strum, for triplets. Once you get that technique down a lot of his triplet work becomes really simple. e.g the solo on Those Damn Blue Collar Tweekers. If you use a traditional pick or two finger approach those licks take a lot of extra work to get down right. I picked up his three finger technique 14 years ago and fall back on that whenever I need to do quick triplets. It's just easier.
So...I'm still a big fan, and still go to shows, but after studying his techniques for as long as I have the "magic" factor is less present. You eventually start to realize there are guys playing bass, that you can barely hear, that are a bit more creative melodically, have a cleaner technique, and are maybe "better" bassists, but are clearly not being paid to be a "rock star".
From what I've read here, I'm not alone, as there are a lot of bassist on this forum that have enjoyed Primus for as long as I have, or longer, but have also studied Les to that extent.
So, lots of love from my end, but the worship factor has died off as I've grown up.
YMMV.
Les is a divisive bass player because he specifically has developed a style that is incredibly unique, but flies in the face of conventional playing.
His strumming technique, for example, is extremely uncommon. To the point that when I heard Alex/Dirk from Incubus use it on a track of theirs (Privilege IIRC), in 2001, on the radio I literally had to stop and figure out what band it was. When I realized it was Incubus and Alex (who I went to school with) I was relieved as only he, myself, Stanley Clarke and a handful of guys that have studied either Stanley or Les actually do that and I was worried about additional competition.
Again, it's an incredibly uncommon technique. I broke it out at a jam at the Baked Potato a week or two ago and a few guys ***'d on me. Stanley invented it in the 70s, but it is simply not mainstream.
Once you get past the "man that looks amazing" factor, and actually break down the parts a few patterns emerge:
1) Melodically Les can be a bit limited. Lots of flat seconds and minor thirds in his stuff. You do not get a lot of Primus songs in a major key. This isn't a problem, but it does limit their variety.
2) Since they're a trio, their tonal center is often somewhat ambiguous so he just tosses in a lot of chromatic stuff as well. It *works* because he doesn't clash with big chords coming off of Ler. In a larger band context he either has to hold back on that stuff, or pulls it out when other guys are laying *waaaay* back.
3) Unless you plan to write everything in your band, play bass, and sing, he's a bad example to follow too closely. I'm speaking from experience as someone that was the musically dominant force in a band that was nearly signed. His style is so very dominant musically, that I'd speculate if he had not developed as a singer or primary song writer for Primus, he probably would be a guy with a day job, playing kick ass bass in a cover band a few times a month for fun. He would have eventually clashed with the singer, guitarist, or producer otherwise.
4) Les uses three fingers in a galloping style strum, for triplets. Once you get that technique down a lot of his triplet work becomes really simple. e.g the solo on Those Damn Blue Collar Tweekers. If you use a traditional pick or two finger approach those licks take a lot of extra work to get down right. I picked up his three finger technique 14 years ago and fall back on that whenever I need to do quick triplets. It's just easier.
So...I'm still a big fan, and still go to shows, but after studying his techniques for as long as I have the "magic" factor is less present. You eventually start to realize there are guys playing bass, that you can barely hear, that are a bit more creative melodically, have a cleaner technique, and are maybe "better" bassists, but are clearly not being paid to be a "rock star".
From what I've read here, I'm not alone, as there are a lot of bassist on this forum that have enjoyed Primus for as long as I have, or longer, but have also studied Les to that extent.
So, lots of love from my end, but the worship factor has died off as I've grown up.
YMMV.
I just read that, googled it LOL, I guess I should research more before posting a thread. Funny at his acoustic show I did not here a single person scream that? Maybe just for the outside, electrified concerts? Live and learn. I guess Primus SUCKS
I think Les is a supremely talented individual. However I can't stand the majority of the stuff he does. Talent does not always equal good songs. I would say that Les Claypool is more of an acquired taste.
Also worth noting is that he only picked up the double thump technique after Primus went on break in 2003. A very good example of him double thumping is in Duo De Twan, it's used quite a bit. Before that, it's all single slap fro him.
He's also a fan of doing a quick Pop/hammer on/pull off trill type of thing, as well as using a ton of muted notes.
That is what art is all about.
As far as your analysis on his technique, I have decided that just about anybody can be broken down to that level. Look at guys like Joe Satriani. Everyone has patterns, especially after releasing several albums.
However, that it is not to say your analysis is not well-written or uninteresting or incorrect. I certainly found it to be very informative.
Love Primus and Les .....Primus Sucks!
I need to actually catch up on the DDT stuff; I stopped keeping up with his non-Primus work around 2006 or 2007.
Good call though. Pre-2003 or so he did a lot of quick single thumb stuff, but definitely did not do any noticeable double thumb work from what I saw.
I'm in a band with a drummer that loves primus. He gave me some CD's. I wanted to like it. Some of the songs have some cool grooves. I think they should hire a singer. That's all I have to say about that.
He also gave me some Tool CD's. I made it through the first bits of a couple of songs.
He also gave me some Tool CD's. I made it through the first bits of a couple of songs.
I just read that, googled it LOL, I guess I should research more before posting a thread. Funny at his acoustic show I did not here a single person scream that? Maybe just for the outside, electrified concerts? Live and learn. I guess Primus SUCKS
To be honest I've found that to be less and less common as the years went on. My first Primus show was Ozzfest 99 and there was a LOT of Primus Sucks chants then.
At the last few I've seen it's been yelled by a rare crowd member here or there, but it's NOT the same lol.
I went to a TOOL concert with my nephew a few years back. I didn't really know their music - his GF couldn't make it so I went. What a mistake LOL.
Roland GR 88
Commercial User
I really like Primus not so much for their kitschy songs but because nobody's ever sounded like them before or since.
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Now that you know the inside joke, you are officially a Primus fan 
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Excuse me, this is a "Primus sucks" thread, not a "Tool sucks" thread.
Ive seen Les over 50 times. He is great no doubt. Every group is different and original. Anybody else see the Frog Brigade do Animals? That was sick. The Primus 3d tour? Awesome. DDT? Lots of fun. I've seen primus so many times I can tell when they're having an off night, which isn't often.
I've seen them in the west coast, east coast, and have got on a plane three times to see them at Red Rocks.
So yes, Primus suuuuucks.
I've seen them in the west coast, east coast, and have got on a plane three times to see them at Red Rocks.
So yes, Primus suuuuucks.
