Just look in any electronics textbook for the equations where the behavior of a component depends on its weight.
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Let's talk about weight
- Thread starter corinpills
- Start date
BurningSkies
CRAZY BALDHEAD
- Feb 20, 2005
- 27,956
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- Endorsing artist: Dingwall Guitars
I had a Tone Hammer 500 feeding a Bergantino CN212. 5 pound head and a 45 pound cabinet was great. I actually loved the sound of that combo. Then I heard my CN212 being fed by a Mesa Boogie Strategy all tube head. That was a game changer for me. I now run a 50 pound head and a 45 pound cabinet and wouldn't change it for the world. Granted right now I am a bedroom bassist. My Church gig has no backline setup so I am not hauling it around right now but when that time comes I think I will be alright. I too have a bad back but regularly get injections so I don't feel that it is going to be a huge deal in the future. I have a cart and I work out regularly so it should be a fair compromise to get the huge tone that I now get. I say all that to say this.....Play what you like. Play what sounds good to you. Play what you can handle. If you are risking injury by schlepping around a 150 pound rig then don't do it. If you are able and love your tone go for it. The tone is where it's at.
You pretty much have to be what I highlighted if you actually believe that.
My 7 pound Genz benz 12.0 will get louder than an 80 pound svt, at least on Paper.
I'm fortunate in that I have easy access to storing my cab, in my garage. My NV610 is close to 90lbs. My Marshall VBA400 is roughly the same. So far, I our gigs, I have not had to load in up any stairs, just wheel the cab in on it's wheels and I have a folding hand cart for the head. The tone is worth twice the weight, for me.
At our rehearsal space, I keep my 2x10 and 1x15 cab. I don't usually schlep the Marshall and use either my Hartke 3500 or most times, my RH450. Neither of those heads holds a candle to the Marshall, but as it's only practice, I don't care a bit. Easy load in at rehearsal, one trip in.
I had back surgery in the 90's for a herniated disc. All is well now and has been for a long time. As far as I'm concerned, weight is part of the gig.
Fishheadjoe
At our rehearsal space, I keep my 2x10 and 1x15 cab. I don't usually schlep the Marshall and use either my Hartke 3500 or most times, my RH450. Neither of those heads holds a candle to the Marshall, but as it's only practice, I don't care a bit. Easy load in at rehearsal, one trip in.
I had back surgery in the 90's for a herniated disc. All is well now and has been for a long time. As far as I'm concerned, weight is part of the gig.
Fishheadjoe
Jim Carr
Dr. Jim
- Jan 21, 2006
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I do lots of gigs with stairs or long carries. Bringing a 50+ lb cab or two up the stairs on a hand truck is not a problem—though for weekly rehearsals, I'll pass .
However, if a 4 lb. 800 watt head that slips in a gig bag does the job just as well as the 30 lb. one, the light one is going to save me a trip down to the car and back up the stairs. To me it is about making music, not about making a lot of trips to load in or out.
.However, if a 4 lb. 800 watt head that slips in a gig bag does the job just as well as the 30 lb. one, the light one is going to save me a trip down to the car and back up the stairs. To me it is about making music, not about making a lot of trips to load in or out.
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Jim Carr
Dr. Jim
- Jan 21, 2006
- 16,223
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- fEARful Kool-Aid dispensing liberal academic card-carrying union member Musicians Local 72-147
Really? Maybe a decade ago. Check this 4 lb. head. It pushes these fairly light fEARful cabs as well as my (retired) 44 lb. Crest CA6 did.
Last edited:
- Feb 3, 2005
- 7,331
- 10,197
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- Endorsing artist: Bergantino Audio Systems and GHS Strings
I have a Fender Bassman 100t. Honestly, the biggest factor for getting the 100t over the Super Bassman was weight. I had neck surgery in 2005, so there is a finite amount I can carry without causing myself pain that last a few days.
I do think that where you gig can make a difference too. Stairs, long distances from the car, etc. all make a difference. The great thing about all the Class D stuff and NEO cabs is that they make those situations so much easier for the gigging musician. I agree that an all tube head into an 810 is a thing of beauty, but 99% of don't have roadies, trucks, loading docks, etc. to help move it.
I do think that where you gig can make a difference too. Stairs, long distances from the car, etc. all make a difference. The great thing about all the Class D stuff and NEO cabs is that they make those situations so much easier for the gigging musician. I agree that an all tube head into an 810 is a thing of beauty, but 99% of don't have roadies, trucks, loading docks, etc. to help move it.
my reasons for being concerned about the weight of an amp:
1. back problems
2. it allows me to take public transportation to a gig, which i prefer because our car is not in great shape.
3. makes carpooling easier
4. small form factor leaves stage room.
1. back problems
2. it allows me to take public transportation to a gig, which i prefer because our car is not in great shape.
3. makes carpooling easier
4. small form factor leaves stage room.
Big Hoss
Up note, down note, blue note, brown note...
- Sep 5, 2014
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I am one of those players with severe back problems. In 2000 I got rear ended in my then new truck. A 1985 Pontiac Parisienne (or whatever they called the full size monstrosity they used to build) filled with a construction crew decided that even though I was stopped on the freeway for an accident in front of me, they didn't need to touch their brakes from 70 mph.
I am lucky to be alive at all, let alone able to walk, lift, whatever.
Needless to say I have had back problems ever since then. The back issues, combined with bad reactions to certain medications, and I put a mess of weight on, guess what, that causes even more back problems...
As the years went on, more and more issues would creep up. Muscle tears, while they heal, the muscles are never quite right afterwards, lots of therapy can only do so much...
So yeah, I have to be extra careful. Even standing in one location for long periods will cause severe pain. I MUST move...
I know among musicians, like everyone else, there is a certain crowd that actually wants to get drugged up and numb. I am not one of those people. I despise the pain relievers / anti inflamatory drugs the doc has me on, I have to be mentally sharp to do my job, and honestly, enjoy life. So I take every precaution I know about to avoid causing flare ups, or treating them without drugs when they take place. (I recently found TENS therapy and it is helping a LOT). To that extent, yes, weight IS a consideration for my gear.
Even without the back problems being current and active, knowing now what I know about back problems, I don't understand why someone young, strong, with a good back would want to do anything to risk causing yourself back problems. VERY few young musicians I have seen schlepping huge heavy old gear out of their vans / trailers and onto the stage are lifting anywhere near safely... Those guys (and gals) WILL be seeing the same specialists I have had to put up with for nearly 14 years now, and I wish they knew now, what I know, when they can take measures to protect themselves...
I am lucky to be alive at all, let alone able to walk, lift, whatever.
Needless to say I have had back problems ever since then. The back issues, combined with bad reactions to certain medications, and I put a mess of weight on, guess what, that causes even more back problems...
As the years went on, more and more issues would creep up. Muscle tears, while they heal, the muscles are never quite right afterwards, lots of therapy can only do so much...
So yeah, I have to be extra careful. Even standing in one location for long periods will cause severe pain. I MUST move...
I know among musicians, like everyone else, there is a certain crowd that actually wants to get drugged up and numb. I am not one of those people. I despise the pain relievers / anti inflamatory drugs the doc has me on, I have to be mentally sharp to do my job, and honestly, enjoy life. So I take every precaution I know about to avoid causing flare ups, or treating them without drugs when they take place. (I recently found TENS therapy and it is helping a LOT). To that extent, yes, weight IS a consideration for my gear.
Even without the back problems being current and active, knowing now what I know about back problems, I don't understand why someone young, strong, with a good back would want to do anything to risk causing yourself back problems. VERY few young musicians I have seen schlepping huge heavy old gear out of their vans / trailers and onto the stage are lifting anywhere near safely... Those guys (and gals) WILL be seeing the same specialists I have had to put up with for nearly 14 years now, and I wish they knew now, what I know, when they can take measures to protect themselves...
I stopped at a Goodwill a couple days ago, and under a table in the back were not one but TWO Sunn folded horn speaker cabinets. (no tolex, baffles painted red...) $49 each.
So I slid one out from under the table. No feet, so it was hard sliding it across the linoleum floor. No casters either.
I wouldn't have hesitated 20-30 years ago. I had trouble lifting one edge off the floor. Even with a cart, or casters, the size would make stairs or getting it onto a stage difficult for most, impossible for me at my age and condition.
Light and/or compact is my middle name.
They also had a pair of 18" scoops w/Black Widows ($79 each) and a pair of Peavey FH type horns for $29 each. Somebody's PA system. The lack of crossovers tells me the PA was likely bi or tri-amped.
BTW, the Goodwill was in Weston WI, in northcentral WI near Wausau.
So I slid one out from under the table. No feet, so it was hard sliding it across the linoleum floor. No casters either.
I wouldn't have hesitated 20-30 years ago. I had trouble lifting one edge off the floor. Even with a cart, or casters, the size would make stairs or getting it onto a stage difficult for most, impossible for me at my age and condition.
Light and/or compact is my middle name.
They also had a pair of 18" scoops w/Black Widows ($79 each) and a pair of Peavey FH type horns for $29 each. Somebody's PA system. The lack of crossovers tells me the PA was likely bi or tri-amped.
BTW, the Goodwill was in Weston WI, in northcentral WI near Wausau.
For me weight is only a secondary consideration - I look for tone, quality construction, features then size/weight. Right now, for me, all tube is the tone I want, so weight is the most obvious trade-off. That said, I tend to not have to haul gear long distances or up/down lots of stairs or take public transportation. All of my equipment either has wheels or is under about 65lbs (per component), which is manageable. I had an SVT for a while and that thing was a beast to move...
Due to a neck injury, weight has been a driving force in my gear purchases for the past few years. I have gone from a ridiculously heavy 2x10 (Eden D-AH, totaled easily over 110 lbs with a 30lb WT-500 installed in the airhead) to a 6lb head and 2x37lb cabs. Personally I don't think I've ever sounded better, and my bandmates agree.
I also won't play a bass over 9lbs for our usual 4 hour show.
I also won't play a bass over 9lbs for our usual 4 hour show.
Gaolee
Official leathers tester and crash dummy
Really? Maybe a decade ago. Check this 4 lb. head. It pushes these fairly light fEARful cabs as well as my (retired) 44 lb. Crest CA6 did.
That photo makes it look like you have ginormous speakers in those cabinets! Gotta love weird perspective in digital photographs.
I suppose if I was doing lots of gigs up multiple flights of stairs with no elevator, and that required schlepping all kinds of stuff several blocks down a crowded sidewalk, I might reconsider what I use, but I'm very happy using big folded horn cabinets that weight a zillion pounds but have wheels and convenient tilt-back handles. It's not the weight so much as geometry for me. Yeah, they weigh a ton, but I never, ever have to bend over to lift them. Usually, I don't have to lift them at all, since they tilt back and slide right into the van with a bit of leverage and go up and down stairs like an appliance hand truck. Plus, I like how they sound.
My heavy @ss equipment is all solid state, too. We all have our quirks.
What kills me is the reliance on smaller and/or fewer cabs, again with the weight thing. There seem to be a similar thread every week, someone asking if a 1x10 or 1x12 will be loud enough for their band. (Unless it's an acoustic bluegrass band, probably not) Sure, electronic technology has gotten better. So people seem almost to expect a 500 or 700 watt amp that fits in your coat pocket, but people forget that there hasn't been a corresponding improvement in bass speaker technology. Yes, neodymium magnets and improved cone materials have helped a lot, but you still need a 'big' speaker in a big enclosure to push a lot of bass at band volume, this is just physics. It's still a paper cone pushed by an electromagnet in a plywood box, that hasn't changed in 50 years.
I guess people now expect the PA to do the 'heavy lifting' for them, but when I started playing in the early 90s PAs were still mostly for vocals. The bass amp & cab had to 'carry' the room, and in any case I want to be able to hear myself regardless of where the soundman thinks I belong in the mix.
4x10 cab lifted up on a chair is the ticket for me. I can't imagine playing with anything less than a 4x10 or 2x12 cab in a band situation.
I guess people now expect the PA to do the 'heavy lifting' for them, but when I started playing in the early 90s PAs were still mostly for vocals. The bass amp & cab had to 'carry' the room, and in any case I want to be able to hear myself regardless of where the soundman thinks I belong in the mix.
4x10 cab lifted up on a chair is the ticket for me. I can't imagine playing with anything less than a 4x10 or 2x12 cab in a band situation.
After spinal surgery, I have been using a Fender Rumble 500 V3 head with the older Rumble 410 for gigs, Hartke Transporter 410 at rehearsal. Does it sound as good as the old SVT? Nope. But with the help of a Sans Amp, it gets pretty close. Doc also said no guitars over 10lbs, so my gigging bass is a Squier P body with a MIM Fender Neck that is light as all heck.
Even though I'm in my 40's, I'm in really good shape. Still hunt in Alaska every year, run marathons, etc... Not saying that to brag, but even though I can carry the big stuff, there's no reason for ME to do it. I love the tone I get out of my 30lb GK combo. The big thing for me for whatever reason is 1 trip from the car for my bass and rig. With that combo and my bass on my back I actually have a free hand to open doors. Heck at my PW gig we have IEM's and a good PA so I don't even bring an amp anymore.
I have back problems and my car isn't very big. It's just easier in every sense to deal with a smaller, more modular setup. I prefer tube tone, but I prefer a micro head in all other regards.
I have a bad back. I've thrown out my back and been unable to move more times than I can remember anymore. Never really been due to weight though. I feel that pain after the fact in the form of some soreness, but when I go down for the count it's usually a sudden/not smart movement that does it. I've had my back go out reaching for something on a shelf, or twisting in a chair to reach a file cabinet.
My biggest problem is my home has a very narrow staircase leading to my practice space in the basement. So I will have to twist my body while carrying large things, or otherwise hold them in awkward ways going around a corner at the bottom. Tube amp heads aren't just heavy but BIG in size, which makes them an ergonomic challenge in tight spaces for my back. If I'm carrying any real weight and twist my upper body around, I'm going down hard. If I do throw out my back, I can always drag my cabs up/down the stairs if need be. Tube amp would not like that. You can shockmount a tube head but that is a huge expense.
I play guitar too, but guitar tube heads are nothing compared to tube bass heads. Never had a problem moving my guitar gear due to weight or bulk.
My biggest problem is my home has a very narrow staircase leading to my practice space in the basement. So I will have to twist my body while carrying large things, or otherwise hold them in awkward ways going around a corner at the bottom. Tube amp heads aren't just heavy but BIG in size, which makes them an ergonomic challenge in tight spaces for my back. If I'm carrying any real weight and twist my upper body around, I'm going down hard. If I do throw out my back, I can always drag my cabs up/down the stairs if need be. Tube amp would not like that. You can shockmount a tube head but that is a huge expense.
I play guitar too, but guitar tube heads are nothing compared to tube bass heads. Never had a problem moving my guitar gear due to weight or bulk.
