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"Macho-ness"

#41
mike_v_s said:
I clearly stated that I found your use of the term amusing, not insulting to me. Let's get this out of the way. If I want to personally attack you, there won't be any tiptoeing around rules. I'll call you a cock-knocker, back it up with a bit of empirical evidence that involves both cocks and knocking, and be done with it. When that post shows up, feel free to say that I'm personally attacking you.

Until then, let's assume that I don't get worked up enough about most of this crap to get to the point of personally insulting anyone, with one exception I won't waste time here on.
Without putting words in your mouth, it seems as though you're saying it's OK to run with the stereotype of a subset of a race? More on this later.... Yes. Subset stereotyoes are fair game. Ya got that, Jews?

You must be tired carrying that grudge all the way from August.

Oddly, it's still applicable, so I guess your efforts weren't for naught. My point was simply that I find it fairly amusing that you would use a term that negatively refers to a cultural group. I still do.:)

Mike
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No, no grudge. I merely find you thinking of me as "not being able to see the forest through the trees" amusing.;)

My key point is that although yes, most "guidos" are white (though I have met Asian and Hispanic versions of these types before, believe it or not), the "guido" stereotype is not race-based. It's making fun of the personality flaws (cockiness, chauvinistic, etc) of these particular people. The fact that they are a "subset" of white males is a moot point. Similarly, the "ricer" term has seemed to now include any guys who do those things to their cars and have an attitude problem to boot. My arguments against stereotypes called out media painting Asians with a broad brush, such as portraying ALL Asian males as either nerds, martial arts experts, or spineless losers.
 
#42
mike_v_s said:
Saw it.

Although you made mention that it applied to "any race", your description pretty much solidly fit a particularily annoying subset of white males. Surely you can see how it would look if someone else casually explained that, where they are from, it's OK to refer to a subset of annoying people from a particular race (this one without the orange tan, propped up collars and greasy spiked hair) by a derogatory term. Add to this your previous posts/threads, some of them quite heated, about race and stereotypes, and you should see where I'm headed.

I'm not much for apologies but here goes: Sorry, I find this funny on a few levels.

Mike
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+2
 
#45
Okay, how's this sound:

I am an overly-politically correct idiot. Stereotypes are funny, let's laugh at them. If I get offended at a stereotype of an Asian male, I am being too sensitive and should just shut the **** up:rolleyes:. I should just accept it, despite there being almost no positive or non-stereotypical portrayals of Asian men (or women for that matter) on television or in the movies. Of course this doesn't reflect real life, nor does it have an impact in the way people treat me and others like me in real life:rolleyes:. People never pull their eyes back and say "ching chong" to me. People never call me a "chink", "gook", or tell me go "go back to China" despite the fact that I was born and raised here. Of course I've never been pursued or nearly beaten by a group of white thugs just for being Asian in an all white town. (oh oh oh! he mentioned race! somebody call the thought police!;)).

And of course, if I make a joke or bring up a stereotype about another race, I am being a hypocrite! Of course! Because everything is so black and white like that! ...Oh my, was that a pun?!

Oh, and tonight my suitemates had a couple of girls over and they were talking about how their roommate had ordered Chinese food, and when the restaurant got the order wrong the girl *****ed out the delivery guy calling him racial slurs. They then proceeded to comment on how much they hate Asian people. Boy, their faces sure changed color when I stepped out into the room. But I shouldn't get mad at these girls, should I? After all, I am just "being too sensitive".
 
#54
Okay, final post I'm going to make on this subject in this thread because it's been derailed to Hell and back:

Not everything is black and white. Have I made race-based jokes before? Of course. Have I laughed at race-based jokes about MY race? Yes I have. Have I laughed at race-based jokes about other races? Yes.

When I talk about stereotypes and racism, I am not trying to stop people from making racist jokes. You want to tell racist jokes, go ahead, who am I to stop you? What I talked about in previous threads was that the media stereotypes Asians in a negative and broad way. While whites are portrayed as multi-faceted and dynamic characters, Asian men are always either the martial arts expert, the nerd, or the loser, and Asian women are either the hyper-sexualized whore or conniving "dragon-lady".

Furthermore, there's a difference between jokes and actual hate speech. I'm sure the guy telling me to "go back to China you ****ing chink" is just playing around:rolleyes:.

And as I said before Mike, "guido" is a reference to a subset of mostly white guys, as "ricer" refers to a subset of mostly Asian guys, and as "gangstas" seem to refer to a subset of mostly Black guys. However, the point is that race is a moot point in this case. I've seen white "gangstas", Asian "guidos" and Black "ricers". These terms are making fun of the particular personality traits and behaviors of these people.
 
#55
Vince S. said:
Very typical response; the second somebody brings up racism that response always comes up.
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Not sure if you're having a go or not.
Basically, I think common sense should be applied to communication. What I don't like is everyone tip toeing around and being overly sensitive; some people obviously have too much time on their hands and too little in their lives that's meaningful. Say what you think, take responsibility for what effect those words may have, and suck it up and apologise if you're wrong. If I'm speaking with you in person, and I use a non-PC word or expression, obviously with no intent to cause harm, then get over it. Example: On another forum, I used the expression "calling a spade a spade" and was soundly berated for it. To me it means "calling it as I see it" and that was absolutely clear from context that I used it in. The etymology backs up it's use in these terms. If you were to say "as an African American that expression is considered racist" I would apologise and counter with "as an Aussie, it's generally not, so I'm going to continue to use it where I feel it appropriate. However, I meant no offence to you".
Amusing to see the responses.

Vince S. said:
Hey, I'm no fan of being PC either. I think taking "under God" out of the Pledge and banning manger scenes at Christmas is ridiculous.
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Not a Yank, so I don't understand the Pledge: I know what it is but I don't have the reference point for it's significance to an American. Hell, I'd happily ban Xmas altogether. Bah humbug.
 
#60
Vince S. said:
Okay, how's this sound:

I am an overly-politically correct idiot. Stereotypes are funny, let's laugh at them. If I get offended at a stereotype of an Asian male, I am being too sensitive and should just shut the **** up:rolleyes:. I should just accept it, despite there being almost no positive or non-stereotypical portrayals of Asian men (or women for that matter) on television or in the movies. Of course this doesn't reflect real life, nor does it have an impact in the way people treat me and others like me in real life:rolleyes:. People never pull their eyes back and say "ching chong" to me. People never call me a "chink", "gook", or tell me go "go back to China" despite the fact that I was born and raised here. Of course I've never been pursued or nearly beaten by a group of white thugs just for being Asian in an all white town. (oh oh oh! he mentioned race! somebody call the thought police!;)).

And of course, if I make a joke or bring up a stereotype about another race, I am being a hypocrite! Of course! Because everything is so black and white like that! ...Oh my, was that a pun?!
Click to expand...
For the most part, my response to this is leaning heavily towards the "Get over it." line.
Oh, and tonight my suitemates had a couple of girls over and they were talking about how their roommate had ordered Chinese food, and when the restaurant got the order wrong the girl *****ed out the delivery guy calling him racial slurs. They then proceeded to comment on how much they hate Asian people. Boy, their faces sure changed color when I stepped out into the room. But I shouldn't get mad at these girls, should I? After all, I am just "being too sensitive".
Click to expand...

But for the part where you catch your roomates girlfriends with their feet in their mouth, then you don't have to say anything. You just have to hang around and see how incredibly awkward and uncomfortable you can make the feel. And if you make them leave early out of embarrassment, your roommates have to let you slide on it this time.

Those are the rules.
 

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