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Make YOUR own "bass tone" pie chart!

#41
OP, quite simply, it would be different for everyone.

What about the guy who runs nothing but a straight DI to the board? You can't exactly attribute amps and cabs to his tone.

What about the guy who has 45 pedals? His cab or strings may barely play into the mix.

I have been told by my long-time guitarist that I sound like me no matter what bass or amp I play through..... and he has heard me through a hundred different provided back line amps.

Yes, we could EACH make a pie chart. No, we can't ALL make ONE piece chart together.
 
#44
In the book American Basses, Philip Kubicki stated, "90% of your tone comes from electronics."

He was a master builder, and few, are qualified to argue with his opinion. (except the guy that says my squire sounds better then your Alembic)
Fresh strings and fancy tone woods don't matter unless the pickups are able to hear and translate that tone.
 
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#45
What tone are we making this pie chart for? digging in at the bridge? softly using my thumb at the 12th fret? Slap and pop? First there is no bass-tone without a player. Secondly the influence of all factors can differ greatly for the different tones and certain aspects of tone you get out of your bass. Maybe one could make seperate pie charts for sustain, attack, root content, overtones, thump, etc. But even then there's a lot of overlap. One sometimes can achieve the same sonic goals with either pickups, setup, technique, construction or string choice.
 
#46
SpazzTheBassist said:
Youre speaking from a point of view that the bass itself is static.... not true: Pole-pieces can be set different, string height/action, etc.... a lot can come into play to make the bass itself not static....then, of course, there is the string variable: One player may favor using nylon tapewound strings and finger at the neck while another may favor roundwounds and slap bass.
Click to expand...

Thats exactly my point. All of those things contribute to the sound of the bass, the player should not have any portion on the pie chart because he doesnt give the bass its inheritated unique sound.
 
#47
It's interesting that no-one has brought up age, old wood, mojo, weakened magnets or any of the other BS brought up to justify the outrageous prices for old instruments yet. Doesn't that count? What if that fretboard wood is old fretboard wood? If that made a difference surely someone's pie would have old mould on it? Oooooooh, get me a towel, Matron!
 
#50
Ok, guys... I get it. But from the few people that actually answered the question and attempted to make a chart, strings and pickups seem to have a bigger influence on a basses tone than the body wood or whatnot. Like I said, I left out technique because it was about the character of the bass not a specific player's signature tone. Also I left out amps and cabs because... Well, it's about the character of the bass ITSELF :P

Thanks to the guys that tried :)
 
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#52
LanOsb133 said:
I dont agree. The player contributes to the players tone. The player doesnt contribute to the bass's tone. The bass has a tone that is not factored by a human. Same player, same technique different basses yield different tones and I dont think the OP was talking about player tone because thats obviously a big factor no matter what bass it is
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Thankyou :D
 
#53
A pie chart would be meaningless except for the specific instrument used to make the chart. Due to the inherent variability in every bass each chart would be different.

"We need pie" - Agent K
 
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#54
LanOsb133 said:
Thats exactly my point. All of those things contribute to the sound of the bass, the player should not have any portion on the pie chart because he doesnt give the bass its inheritated unique sound.
Click to expand...

So, you are saying that if I play my bass, my 4 year old kid plays my bass, and Victor Wooden plays my bass all without touching a knob or switch we will all sound the same plucking a note? Ridiculous.

Again, a guy who has played with me for 20 years, and a total tone snob, ruins any new gear for me. Why? Because I will show up with a new bass or a new amp and ask him how it sounds. His answer is always "Man, it always sound exactly like you playing bass". His point is that my fingers are so much a part of my sound that it almost doesn't matter what I play.

And to prove that point an engineer played back two tracks for me once and asked which one I prefer. I said "They both sound the same to me". He said "Yeah no kidn. That's my point." When I asked why he was making such a big deal out of it he explained that one track was recorded with a 5 string standard passive P bass. The other was recorded with an active Ibanez BTB with Barts. One bass is alder (8 pounds) and a one piece maple neck and one passive pickup. One is mahogany with a 5 piece laminated neck, two truss rods, active Barts and weighs almost 12 pounds. And without the labeling we couldn't tell the difference in the two tracks.

What does that do to a "bass tone Puerto chart"?

The notion that you would have the same tone as Marcus Miller, Flea, Jamerson, Wooten, Sheehan, Hamm, or Squire on the same exact bass with the tone knobs set the same is nothing short of laughable. The player makes all the difference. Attack, where you pluck, how you move the string (pick, thumb, index finger, any other finger, tap), how hard you play, and even how calloused your fingers are will all have a huge impact on tone.

Try this. Go out and buy a Sire bass and whatever amp Miller happens to be advertising for this week and see if you sound like him. By the same token, he has changed amp companies half a dozen times and changed basses several times. And guess what. It always sounds exactly like Marcus Miller playing the bass. He could play a Sadowsky through an SWR or a vintage 70s J through an EBS and it still sounds exactly like him.

Sorry for the rant. But that whole bit about the player not giving a bass its unique sound set me off a little. Why do we bother with all of this if it isn't the player? If it weren't the player, anybody could do it.
 
#56
This is not to start arguments, which I'm sure it will but that is not my intention;

So if technique is the biggest factor (not saying it's not A factor) in the basses overall sound, why do we have so many basses available? They sound different, right? If technique alone could make a Precision sound just like a Stingray or a Jazz, we wouldnt buy anything besides a P.

I'm just interested in others opinions on this, again my intent is not to start anything.
 
#57
organworthyplayer337 said:
This is not to start arguments, which I'm sure it will but that is not my intention;

So if technique is the biggest factor (not saying it's not A factor) in the basses overall sound, why do we have so many basses available? They sound different, right? If technique alone could make a Precision sound just like a Stingray or a Jazz, we wouldnt buy anything besides a P.

I'm just interested in others opinions on this, again my intent is not to start anything.
Click to expand...

The point is not that there are no differences between basses, the point is that no bass delivers one tone. What contributes to the tone you are trying to get out of your bass differs greatly from situation to situation.

When I'm really digging in close to the bridge I know as long as there's a bridge pickup most of the tone is me and even strings don't really matter. When I'm playing long sustaining notes with a light touch over the neck pickup I know pickup and strings make a big difference. Also IME when playing fretless with medium high action the whole construction and setup (including wood type) plays a bigger part compared to other tones.

I just can't stuff all that in one pie
 
#59
Let's put it this way... Let's put together a p-bass passive with some standard pick-ups, alder body and rosewood fingerboard. If i change the body for an ash one how does it affects the sound? If I keep the alder and change the neck for a maple one is there a real difference? How about pick-ups? Or pots? or hi-mass bridge vs vintage one? This is what i think OP wants to chart... YMMV :bassist::bassist:
 
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#60
organworthyplayer337 said:
... If technique alone could make a Precision sound just like a Stingray or a Jazz, we wouldnt buy anything besides a P.
...
Click to expand...

Even if this was true, which it clearly isn't, aesthetics, ergonomics and personal taste (for better or worse) will ensure that this will never be the case. As it happens, I think technique is still the most significant factor, and the trick is to find instruments that best suit your individual style in the context of the music being played.

I've just been in a store playing an SR500. My usual fretted bass is a Ray, and even though I could not get my normal 'Ray tones from the Ibanez, it still sounded like me. The pressure and positioning of my right hand, the way I apply vibrato, the way I apply my dynamics all ensure that my 'tone' sits over the inherent tone of the instrument.

As it happens, whilst I was in the store I picked up some Chromes to go on my fretless, to replace my pressure-wound Solo 55's. The tone across all settings is warmer and thicker, the mwah is still there when I want it and the mid-range bite of the J-pickup is slightly enhanced, my attack sounds cleaner and notes seem better articulated at speed. But in spite of these differences, it still sounds like me playing, and I am pleased about that.

BTW, I think I'm going to like the Chromes. :-)
 

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