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Manring or Jaco?

Manring Or Jaco

  • Jaco Pastorious

    Votes: 52 71.2%

  • Michael Manring

    Votes: 21 28.8%
  • Total voters
    73
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#21
Gentlemen, I seriously think this is a futile thread. The fact remains that no matter who is better technically, the guy that done it first always gets the credit. The same can be said when comparing Phil Keaggy to Jimi Hendrix. Keaggy was and is better than Hendrix while he was alive, yet Jimi did everything first, so therefore he is recognized as being better. Starting to get the picture?

Personally, I like Manring's stuff better. Jaco should have done a little more slapping and tapping in my humble opinion.
Feel free to disagree.
 
#24
It is really nice to see each of us expressing our feelings with grace and civility. It is wonderful to see the mutual respect. But, in all honesty who cares! Both Michael and Jaco added so much to all of us as players and musicians. Each has pushed the limits and redefined the bass in the era in which we live. I would respectfully submit that we celebrate the music and lives of each of these players without comparison.

Mike
 
#26
I'm sorry but this is like comparing Dick Butkis to Joe Montana. Different era, different role, different styles.

However, in terms of pushing the envelope of the instrument, I vote for Manring. Though at the time Jaco's work was probably just as way out there, there were less "elite" players to whom you could compare him. Manring's work has been after the basic blueprint for the bass had been established.

Do I have to say...IMHO?:rolleyes:
 
#27
Originally posted by ZuluFunk
I'm sorry but this is like comparing Dick Butkis to Joe Montana. Different era, different role, different styles.

However, in terms of pushing the envelope of the instrument, I vote for Manring. Though at the time Jaco's work was probably just as way out there, there were less "elite" players to whom you could compare him. Manring's work has been after the basic blueprint for the bass had been established.

Do I have to say...IMHO?:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Please!!.. really what are u talking about? Bass players, Solo Bass Players, Composers/arrenger, Showmans .. All diferent things you know.

As far as I know Manring really is above the extraordinary in his solo bass technique specially with altered tunnings etc. I don't know if jaco ever did a solo gig/tour.

what envelope? my first impresion when hearing these awesome bass players. Jacos' portrait of tracy, continum(my favorite)- wow! and this madman groving. Manrings' Purple Hazze, Ghost in the machine- wow and .. how did he do that? Hey but one of them also composed these tunes.

Dont matter to me! My main influence right now is the man in the hat, Gary Willis!! The last of the great bassplayers? I am talking bass players now. All round bassplayers.
 
#28
Originally posted by Samie
Please!!.. really what are u talking about? Bass players, Solo Bass Players, Composers/arrenger, Showmans .. All diferent things you know.
As far as I know Manring really is above the extraordinary in his solo bass technique specially with altered tunnings etc. I don't know if jaco ever did a solo gig/tour.
Click to expand...
Your message appears to support my proposal.
I think you may have misinterpreted my post. Dick Butkis and Joe Montana were both NFL football players. Dick was a linebacker (that's a defensive position covering the slot behind the defensive line often with the role of killing quarterbacks) for Chicago in the '60s, feared for his intensity and power. Joe Montana was a quarterback (offensive play caller, the guy that throws the ball and tries to avoid linebackers who are trying to kill him) for SanFrancisco in the 80's.

I used the analogy to illustrate the DIFFERENCE between Jaco and Manring. Just as Montana and Butkis were both football players with hall of fame careers, often mentioned as the best players at their position in the history of the game, one could not reasonably compare them.

Originally posted by Samie
Hey but one of them also composed these tunes.
Click to expand...
There are many tunes composed by Manring that would blow your mind (if you are implying that he doesn't compose). It's hard to understand your point. Both of them composed tunes.

Originally posted by Samie
what envelope? my first impresion when hearing these awesome bass players. Jacos' portrait of tracy, continum(my favorite)- wow! and this madman groving. Manrings' Purple Hazze, Ghost in the machine- wow and .. how did he do that?
Click to expand...
Envelope, in this case, is a term referring to the limits of a process or item. "Pushing the Envelope" means taking something to the extreme, or beyond where it has been before.

Originally posted by Samie
Please!!.. really what are u talking about?
Click to expand...
I am talking about my opinion. :) Keep it light. I'm sorry if something is perhaps getting lost in the translation
 
#29
Originally posted by ZuluFunk

Your message appears to support my proposal.
I think you may have misinterpreted my post. Dick Butkis and Joe Montana were both NFL football players. Dick was a linebacker (that's a defensive position covering the slot behind the defensive line often with the role of killing quarterbacks) for Chicago in the '60s, feared for his intensity and power. Joe Montana was a quarterback (offensive play caller, the guy that throws the ball and tries to avoid linebackers who are trying to kill him) for SanFrancisco in the 80's.

I used the analogy to illustrate the DIFFERENCE between Jaco and Manring. Just as Montana and Butkis were both football players with hall of fame careers, often mentioned as the best players at their position in the history of the game, one could not reasonably compare them.
Click to expand...

I agree, but the you go on and say that one "pushed the envelope more" than the other. Which is like me saying that Butkis pushed footballs envelope further since he forced quaterbacks to play smarter so as to avoid him.

If I said that you would probably say "Hey Samie, what are you talking about ..."

I know that manring is a great composer but no great landmarks like jimmy's purple hazze or birds/miles donna lee, or jaco's teen town. Not yet at least.

it is all taken light :cool: no problema.
 
#31
Originally posted by Rockinjc
Who did more with less gear? Jaco!

jc
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Less gear? Have you ever seen Manring ? He uses a bass, effects, and amplification.

This thread is not to determine who is better. Knowing Manrings personality and his outlook on music I think he would be doing what he is doing today, without Jacos influence which I feel only fueled his passion for creativity and composition.
 
#32
Originally posted by Zonplayer

Less gear? Have you ever seen Manring ? He uses a bass, effects, and amplification.
Click to expand...

When I saw M2 he had about four HIGH TECH custom basses plugged in at once and a large effects array. He was fun to watch, a real eye opener. But to me it looked like he needed a lot more gear to make his statement. Sounded good though, and what a nice guy!

Jaco, used run of the mill basses and a canadian amp.

This thread is not to determine who is better.
Click to expand...
I'll bite what the heck is this thread for?

I feel that M2 did not come from a vacume. He had Jaco's influence to draw from, and uses a lot of stuff to make a statement. Before Jaco an electric bass was about following the guitar!

jc
 
#33
I see that you are in Mi. that is one of the places I saw him perform. At that perfomance he had 3 Zon basses, a Lexicon sampler, and a Digitech BP8 fx prcssr.

Onstage Jaco used 2 Fender basses fretted and fretless, MXR delay pedals, and other efx as well. Thats about equal, and dont forget there is about 20 years of technological advancements!


As far as the 'before Jaco bass followed the guitar statement'... ever heard of Stanley Clarke?
 
#34
The both took (take) advantage of the available technology. I can only image that the same arguments were made about Jaco and a predecessor of his when Jaco was in his heyday.
 
#35
Originally posted by Zonplayer
I see that you are in Mi. that is one of the places I saw him perform. At that perfomance he had 3 Zon basses, a Lexicon sampler, and a Digitech BP8 fx prcssr.

Onstage Jaco used 2 Fender basses fretted and fretless, MXR delay pedals, and other efx as well. Thats about equal, and dont forget there is about 20 years of technological advancements!
Click to expand...

OK I'll submit. Yes two Fenders equel three Zons. :)

As far as the 'before Jaco bass followed the guitar statement'... ever heard of Stanley Clarke?
Click to expand...

Well yes. I have heard of a few others that qualify as well. Lafaro being my current fav.

But Jaco opened up something for the bass that is very wide sweeping. Maybe it could be called melodic voice. MM has not had quite the same impact...yet. I think Stanley Compares better with Victor. Don't you?

jc
 
#40
it would probably be easier to ask what came first -- egg or chicken?

jaco is the first guy to bring fretless bass to the forefront. his is a sound that everyone tries to copy.

manring plays fretless but his **** is more involved with alternate tunings and playing techniques than everything else.

the only thing these two cats have in common is that they both work the fretless boom stick and are appreciated by a lot of other bass wrestlers.

just i.m.h.o. ...

cj
 
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