Mesa Boogie Subway D800+ Is it LOUD?

[Jason Z Chicago]

It has been a pleasure reading this all day. I keep saying it but thank you guys so much!!!

Great points, no flaming, plenty learned and lots more to think about. Great job, dudes

 

[looper]

I have used the 800+ with both a Baer212 and Barefaced four10 in a loud rock band and both were, loud, and great sounding!

 

[jnewmark]

Anybody try the 800 into an 8 ohm load, say a fEARful 12/6 ?

 

[BrewsterRooster]

I have been running my D800 on either an 8 ohm 410HE, or an 810 Classic 'fridge (4 ohm) depending on the venue. The Ampeg 410 is certainly no fEARful, but it is still an 8 ohm load and it does anything I need it to with the D800 head.

I've only been playing the D800 for about a month but the feedback has been fantastic. I ran it with the 'fridge two weekends ago and my lead player was all smiles, all night. He got in for a closer look at a break, asking questions, and commented that he'd never heard those basses sound better (MIA passive Jazz, active Yamaha TRBX505). He also commented on the low end being defined but thick. I used to run a MESA M- Pulse 600 on many gigs and while that's no slouch of an amp, the D800 really puts fidelity back into the equation. Only rarely do I venture below a D on my 5er, but regardless, there's enough bottom available in the D800 that even the Ampeg cabs sound good down in the basement like that. They're not ordinarily known for being very effective cabs below 42Hz, though a thoughtful combination of the D800's low mid control coupled with the DEEP switch really brings the cabs to life.

I am also considering some Subway cabs. I love everything I've read about them.

 

[SLO Surfer]

Just because I can (thanks to tax refund and work bonus) I called Sweetwater and asked if they would let me shootout the Mesa Subway 800+ and the GK Fusion. Will post my results of shootout here. Going for which one produces the most sound pressure (in my opinion). Well... that AND tone quality, obviously.

And for sure I realize that speakers are a huge part of "loud". I have a practice space shared by a bunch of bands. Willl give all cabinets a shot. Trying both heads on each cab should give me a good idea of which is "louder".

Again thanks so much for all the input, fellas!

I'm looking forward to see what you think. I bought the Mesa D-800 and GK Fusion 800 and spent a couple months A/B-ing them at my studio, rehearsals and gigs.

Remember what people here are saying, don't judge loudness on knob position. The GK is complete opposite of the Mesa in the gain and master knob tapers. The GK gets more loud than I'd ever need in the first 25-30% of the knob's rotation (turned up to 9:00-10:00), while the Mesa knob needs to be turned up considerably more to reach the same decibels. But they both get as loud as you'd need. I much prefer the Mesa's volume taper because it's easier to make slight adjustments.

Let us know what you find and choose! I'm curious about the D-800+...

 

[Waltsdog]

Anybody try the 800 into an 8 ohm load, say a fEARful 12/6 ?

I use a D800+ into an 8ohm Barefaced Super Compact (1x12) so that's in the ball park. It keeps up with my loud band (2 guitars, loud drums and shouty vocals). It also carries a medium sized room on it's own, say around 100-150 people sorta size.

 

[Jason Z Chicago]

Sweetwater just shipped and they are only 1 state away so should be here by tomorrow or Wednesday. I should be in the space on Thursday so I will likely reply back with opinion on Friday.

In the meantime I will be looking for cabs and reading up on peoples experiences with lighter speaker magnets and wood used for the cabs.

Plenty of excellent suggestions in this thread so far and I am looking at all of them via youtube demos and such.

 

[Goatrope]

I'm looking forward to see what you think. I bought the Mesa D-800 and GK Fusion 800 and spent a couple months A/B-ing them at my studio, rehearsals and gigs.

Remember what people here are saying, don't judge loudness on knob position. The GK is complete opposite of the Mesa in the gain and master knob tapers. The GK gets more loud than I'd ever need in the first 25-30% of the knob's rotation (turned up to 9:00-10:00), while the Mesa knob needs to be turned up considerably more to reach the same decibels. But they both get as loud as you'd need. I much prefer the Mesa's volume taper because it's easier to make slight adjustments.

Let us know what you find and choose! I'm curious about the D-800+...

I still own both. Started with the MBF800 and echo this observation about the tapers. I bought the D800 as a backup, because I had trouble believing these tiny little amps can possibly last, and ended up relegating the MBF800 to backup position.

I used the MBF800 at a gig this past Saturday, and the power plus the tone could drive nails. The Mesa is much darker, smoother, warmer to my ears.

 

[bassfootballguy]

When I was playing more actively, I used one with a pair of Barefaced One10 cabs and sometimes with a pair of DIY 1x15 cabs and with both setups it was stupid loud. I think I could've cut through any band mix I have ever been part of with that amp and multiple cabs.

James

 

[packhowitzer]

No knock on the D800 at all, but my GK MB800 will peel the paint off the walls when played through my two mesa PH410s. just my .02

 

[Al Kraft]

No knock on the D800 at all, but my GK MB800 will peel the paint off the walls when played through my two mesa PH410s. just my .02

IME the GK MB800 is pretty much a cannon with EQ!

 

[agedhorse]

I bought the D800 as a backup, because I had trouble believing these tiny little amps can possibly last, and ended up relegating the MBF800 to backup position.

We back up that these amps will last with a 5 year transferrable warranty. Wouldn't be able to do this if they didn't last, right?

 

[Goatrope]

IME the GK MB800 is pretty much a cannon with EQ!

Lol! I was actually frightened when I first got that amp. Once the taper had been explained to me I felt more comfortable controlling it.

The Mesa taper is much more "civilized", and still achieves all the volume I get out of my MBF.

They're both outstanding little amps and have been super reliable. They've set my mind at ease regarding their sturdiness. They've both been bounced around a lot and have performed flawlessly.

 

[Goatrope]

We back up that these amps will last with a 5 year transferrable warranty. Wouldn't be able to do this if they didn't last, right?

Absolutely. And thank you. Loving your D800. Outstanding.

 

[bobcruz]

This issue with comparisons based on knob position come up pretty regularly, so let me comment directly to this point.

One of the goals of the Subway project was to make it FEEL like a pro amp, that means that the controls operate over their entire range, smoothly and evenly. While this comes more from the pro audio perspective where feel and predictability of an adjustment is important over the entire range, this is not at all universal among bass and guitar amps. In fact, for the very reasons mentioned, having a control that appears more "active" earlier in the rotation gives the "impression" that an amp may be "louder" or "more powerful", when it is not. This, along with a specific voicing can leave the inaccurate impression if the player doesn't understand why it is this way and that it's intentional.

The Carbine is more traditional in that the controls are more active earlier in their rotation, which may explain the side by side comparison results, though the Subway will continue to get louder as you turn it up. I don't understand why folks would think that having a control with 270 degrees of rotation with only 120 degrees of adjustment is a benefit, but it continues to be done this way on some products.

It's not just MI amplifier manufacturers--auto makers have been putting a similar taper on the throttle for years now to make their cars seem more powerful off the line than they really are. I hate how sensitive the newer throttles are when you first touch them. When I learned to drive there were INCHES of travel in the throttle pedal to allow you to adjust your foot and heel positions without making your car jump like a startled jackrabbit and hit the guy ahead of you!

 

[agedhorse]

It's not just MI amplifier manufacturers--auto makers have been putting a similar taper on the throttle for years now to make their cars seem more powerful off the line than they really are. I hate how sensitive the newer throttles are when you first touch them. When I learned to drive there were INCHES of travel in the throttle pedal to allow you to adjust your foot and heel positions without making your car jump like a startled jackrabbit and hit the guy ahead of you!

Yup, Al and I were discussing this very thing. I really don't like it either, you want the MOST control at the bottom of the range, not the least!

 

[Al Kraft]

It's not just MI amplifier manufacturers--auto makers have been putting a similar taper on the throttle for years now to make their cars seem more powerful off the line than they really are. I hate how sensitive the newer throttles are when you first touch them. When I learned to drive there were INCHES of travel in the throttle pedal to allow you to adjust your foot and heel positions without making your car jump like a startled jackrabbit and hit the guy ahead of you!

This is where marketing approach/product impression gets prioritized over intelligent design and, in the case of automotive products, safety. While Mesa may have dealt itself a first impression/marketing blow with the uninformed by providing uniform volume/control tapers, people who understand the value of this feature definitely find it desirable. Unfortunately mental models are hard to change and folks often judge even innovative new products from the comfortable context of their past experiences.

 

[bherman]

For me, I found that the GK was actually too hard to handle. I'd be trying to turn it up and 1/2 of a level adjustment and it'd be too loud. I much preferred the Mesa with its more linear taper to the volume/gain pots. The GK was too "jumpy" for me.

 

[Jason Z Chicago]

And I think people are just too scared to turn an amp all the way up. In the case of the Mesa D800, it sounds like they are missing out. Ill keep that in mind while I crank the heck out of both of these guys.

Slightly related- someone on Craigslist just mentioned trading a "Shuttle 6.0 with a 212 NeoX Cabinet" for a SVT CL I have up for sale. Seems too good to be true. Awaiting reply.

 

[Al Kraft]

For me, I found that the GK was actually too hard to handle. I'd be trying to turn it up and 1/2 of a level adjustment and it'd be too loud. I much preferred the Mesa with its more linear taper to the volume/gain pots. The GK was too "jumpy" for me.

Once you experience the control precision of a linear taper pot, it's hard to go back. My Carbines are especially touchy, to the extent that if you're playing outside and good breeze comes along you may get a volume adjustment.