Mesa D800+ Disappointment

[Az4stringer]

Just recently purchased a Mesa D800+ to be either my main amp or backup amp. My current main amp is a Markbass Little Mark III tube. Both amps are 800W into 4 Ohms.

I brought the D800+ to rehearsal for a good test run. The D800+ was just struggling to keep up regarding volume. I had both Gain and Master at one point past 2 o'clock and it was really struggling. It was like the D800+ was running out of headroom. The limit LED started flashing at one point too so I turned both the gain and Master down until the limit LED stopped flashing but then volume output was too low to be heard with the band. I connected the Markbass amp to the same cab and had plenty of volume with lots head room to spare. Also, compared the amps without the band playing and there is definitely a huge volume difference between the amps even with the D800+ Gain and Master set much higher than the Markbass.


Amps were connect to a Mesa Subway 15in 8 Ohm cab. Double checked switches, etc on the D800+ and all were correct. Tone on the Mesa is awesome just struggles with volume.

We are a power trio and do not play very loud, and I have never had an issue hearing myself or the rest of the band hearing me. Just posting if anyone had any ideas or have a similar experience with the D800+. My guitar is a passive Lakland Jazz bass, had the D800+ Active/Passive switch set to Passive.

 

[Killed_by_Death]

You don't need to turn down the volume knob when the clipping light comes on.
You don't actually need to turn anything down if it still sounds fine to you. I was concerned about this with the Subway line, because I would expect some overdrive at that level on the Gain knob.

 

[agedhorse]

May I suggest that you re-read the manual as there's an explanation of how the output limit LED works and what it means. It's fine (and in fact may be desirable for some tones) for the output limit LED to flash on for up to 25% of the time you are playing. It's indicating that you are entering the output tube emulation region, in practice you have almost 50% more power still available at the point that the LED begins to flash.

Also, the controls are designed for smooth linear control throughout the entire rotation (unlike some amps where 90% of the gain occurs within the first 50% of the rotation, leading to a false impression that the amp is "more powerful")

That said, if the amp doesn't work for you, there's plenty of other good choices out there.

 

[Jim C]

Was the EQ set reasonably flat?

 

[Az4stringer]

Thank you for the responses. Yes, the EQ was pretty much flat. The tone was awesome, even my band mates liked the tone. It just didn't have the overall volume compared to the Markbass. I did read and re-read the manual, in fact I printed out Spiffmeister's Bass Guitar EQ guide chart to help me understand the EQ controls better, especially the Mids.

Thanks Agedhorse, I was not aware the controls were smooth linear. That has been my experience as well, with most amps 90% of the gain occurs in the first 50% rotation. I haven't given up on D800+ and will try again next practice using the information gathered from everyone's responses.

 

[BassmanPaul]

Just in case you didn’t know @Az4stringer @agedhorse designed your amp.

 

[pfschim]

definitely do a bit more knob twisting with the pot taper info in mind.
I prefer the WD800 to the D800+ (which I also own) for preamp/tone reasons, but as I believe they both share the same power section, I have a hard time imagining that the D800+ would not get quite loud vs any other 800w amp.

I know the OP used the same Subway 15 with both amps, but I would also point out that single driver cabs are only ever going to get so loud and maybe you should consider a 2x15, or 2x12 cab if your band volume needs warrant that.

btw, how do you have a "power trio and do not play very loud" ?

 

[4Mal]

Easy... let the PA do the heavy lifting.. In my trio the guitarist uses a Deluxe Reverb so I don’t need to get over the top of a stack which helps...

 

[joel406]

Thank you for the responses. Yes, the EQ was pretty much flat. The tone was awesome, even my band mates liked the tone. It just didn't have the overall volume compared to the Markbass. I did read and re-read the manual, in fact I printed out Spiffmeister's Bass Guitar EQ guide chart to help me understand the EQ controls better, especially the Mids.

Thanks Agedhorse, I was not aware the controls were smooth linear. That has been my experience as well, with most amps 90% of the gain occurs in the first 50% rotation. I haven't given up on D800+ and will try again next practice using the information gathered from everyone's responses.

There’s an amp for everyone but not every amp is for everyone.

I’m a lifelong GK user and when the D-800+ came along and I read all the hype about it I had to try it. And I did for a year. Dumped my GK head and went Subway.

And your right that clip light is way to easy(IMO) to set off. While they say it’s ok about 25% of the time for it to blink I bothered the crap outa me.

My D-800+ worked fine I was able to get volume out of it decent enough but I never got the punch my GK could do.

I always had the low and high boost going. Constant knob turning. Always starting from flat(noon) setting. HPF was basically useless. I get more control from the contour and presence controls on the GK. And the bass boost on the GK is just plain dangerous. I usually (well always really) leave it off. And the GK sounds awesome with the EQ set at noon. You can color ever so slightly with the knobs on the fly very easily.

Now is the Subway a great amp?

Of course it is. And there are a great many TB’ers that will agree its the amp that gets them what they want.

Good for them.

And having support right here on TB from one of the main designers of the Subway is just crazy.

But like I said.

There’s a amp for everyone. But not every amp is for everyone.

 

[Turbo Sparky]

Just recently purchased a Mesa D800+ to be either my main amp or backup amp. My current main amp is a Markbass Little Mark III tube. Both amps are 800W into 4 Ohms.

I brought the D800+ to rehearsal for a good test run. The D800+ was just struggling to keep up regarding volume. I had both Gain and Master at one point past 2 o'clock and it was really struggling. It was like the D800+ was running out of headroom. The limit LED started flashing at one point too so I turned both the gain and Master down until the limit LED stopped flashing but then volume output was too low to be heard with the band. I connected the Markbass amp to the same cab and had plenty of volume with lots head room to spare. Also, compared the amps without the band playing and there is definitely a huge volume difference between the amps even with the D800+ Gain and Master set much higher than the Markbass.


Amps were connect to a Mesa Subway 15in 8 Ohm cab. Double checked switches, etc on the D800+ and all were correct. Tone on the Mesa is awesome just struggles with volume.

We are a power trio and do not play very loud, and I have never had an issue hearing myself or the rest of the band hearing me. Just posting if anyone had any ideas or have a similar experience with the D800+. My guitar is a passive Lakland Jazz bass, had the D800+ Active/Passive switch set to Passive.

I had that amp in/for a Post-HC/HC/Punk VERY loud trio; w/o issue except for subjective tone.
Whether 4 or 2 Ohm loads she was great. Was the cut engaged? If so, a considerable amount of gain/volume is tossed.
Whether deep or brite switches were engaged, the D800+ had zero issue keeping up with an incredibly powerful drummer (no sh*t) and a 50W guitarist tube amp. She was run either and or a Barefaced SuperTwin (212)/Barefaced 610 (medium gigs).
While I can't remember the nomenclature of an 800W MarkBass head I had, that one had two different issues; a sort of chorus effect when adjusting the master, and a crackling effect when adjusting one of the variable knobs...sorry cannot remember specific variable/virtual knob. MF was great as far as returns.
Perhaps cut the amp bass EQ a tad, bump up the high mids and high freq and treble, engage the brite-if required- etc.
Add second cab/speaker?
IMO make certain the input gain cut is NOT engaged.
Prefer GK tone, but IMO the D800+ is bulletproof powerhouse.
Good luck.

 

[Hounddog409]

Just recently purchased a Mesa D800+ to be either my main amp or backup amp. My current main amp is a Markbass Little Mark III tube. Both amps are 800W into 4 Ohms.

I brought the D800+ to rehearsal for a good test run. The D800+ was just struggling to keep up regarding volume. I had both Gain and Master at one point past 2 o'clock and it was really struggling. It was like the D800+ was running out of headroom. The limit LED started flashing at one point too so I turned both the gain and Master down until the limit LED stopped flashing but then volume output was too low to be heard with the band. I connected the Markbass amp to the same cab and had plenty of volume with lots head room to spare. Also, compared the amps without the band playing and there is definitely a huge volume difference between the amps even with the D800+ Gain and Master set much higher than the Markbass.


Amps were connect to a Mesa Subway 15in 8 Ohm cab. Double checked switches, etc on the D800+ and all were correct. Tone on the Mesa is awesome just struggles with volume.

We are a power trio and do not play very loud, and I have never had an issue hearing myself or the rest of the band hearing me. Just posting if anyone had any ideas or have a similar experience with the D800+. My guitar is a passive Lakland Jazz bass, had the D800+ Active/Passive switch set to Passive.

If you have volume problems with the Mesa D800 not being loud, your cabs blow or you do not understand the nobs yet.

There is no way you have input and volume at 2 o'clock and you were getting drowned out by one guitar. Something is amiss.

Provide pics of settings please.

I run mine with a single or 2 15 cab. 2 guitars, keys, drums. Never had it past 11 oclock.

 

[BassPilot]

Did you have the impedance switch on the back set to 4/8 or 2 ohms? For maximum power it should be on 4/8 ohms with a 4 or 8 ohm load.

 

[klejst]

To each their own, but I personally think the D-800 is one of the better amps released in the more recent years. But again that's me.

 

[Aidenn7]

Isn't the D-800 a smooth dark tube sound.. And wd-800 more a bright hi-fi tube sound

 

[Nephilymbass]

Just recently purchased a Mesa D800+ to be either my main amp or backup amp. My current main amp is a Markbass Little Mark III tube. Both amps are 800W into 4 Ohms.

I brought the D800+ to rehearsal for a good test run. The D800+ was just struggling to keep up regarding volume. I had both Gain and Master at one point past 2 o'clock and it was really struggling. It was like the D800+ was running out of headroom. The limit LED started flashing at one point too so I turned both the gain and Master down until the limit LED stopped flashing but then volume output was too low to be heard with the band. I connected the Markbass amp to the same cab and had plenty of volume with lots head room to spare. Also, compared the amps without the band playing and there is definitely a huge volume difference between the amps even with the D800+ Gain and Master set much higher than the Markbass.


Amps were connect to a Mesa Subway 15in 8 Ohm cab. Double checked switches, etc on the D800+ and all were correct. Tone on the Mesa is awesome just struggles with volume.

We are a power trio and do not play very loud, and I have never had an issue hearing myself or the rest of the band hearing me. Just posting if anyone had any ideas or have a similar experience with the D800+. My guitar is a passive Lakland Jazz bass, had the D800+ Active/Passive switch set to Passive.

My guess is it’s because you’re only running at 400w with that single 15 cab. I run mine through an ampeg 410he and 15 stack at 4 ohms. It’s plenty loud enough. I’m actually playing with two loud guitar players also. One uses Mesa dual rectifier and the other is playing through a PRS archon. Lately I run deep switch on, low mids boosted slightly, voicing all the way counter clockwise and everything else flat. I have noticed if I boost the lows a lot it does limit how loud I can get the rig. But with the deep switch on I really don’t need to boost the bass knob at all. I actually never run the master above 12oclock either. So that’s my bet. That you’re only getting half the potential power of the amp or if it was on 2 ohms with the switch on the back you may have been only getting 200w into that 15

 

[Freddy T]

Both amps are excellent brands but have way different voicings. It may be that you're just "hearing" the Markbass better because of the prominent mids in the natrual voicing of that head. I use a D800+ often and deliberately cut my lows and engage the HPF to get the tone and presence I like in a band mix. Mayby try running the Markbass preamp out to the Boogie power amp to compare the power sections. Or try eq'ing it to match the tone of you Markbass. I feel your pain because I generally can't get the volume and power I like from any 1×15" cab for a loud power trio UNLESS I start cutting bass; and coincidentally the most success I had was with a Markbass head - I actually didn't like the tone, thought it was too thin, but on playback it was actually great! For me the solution is more speakers, 2x12" minimum. I love my D800+, trust me it's loud with plenty of low end booty on tap - kind of different than Markbass. Good luck!

 

[tombowlus]

I have both heads, and if the D-800+ is not as loud or louder than the LMII, then it's either a matter of gain-staging and EQ, or else something is wrong with the D-800+. All of the current 800w Mesa heads have excellent output, IME/IMHO.

Though I will give a definite nod to the LMII as being an amp which tends to outperforms its specs. Still, the D-800+ should more than keep up.

 

[dukey donkey]

Something is definitely amiss... Its not the head, I assure you. I run my D800+ with a single GB215, input gain at 4:00, if I crank the master to 12, I'm reallllllly loud... in my bedroom, it feels like the house is going to come down on my head... in the jam room, a loud drummer and 2 guitarists with Krank rev1's and 8x12 stacks each are asking me to turn down... that's on the 2 ohm setting too so I'm pushing softer... If I add my other 2x15 to the mix I can easily handle things without FOH on the stage. There's something in the chain besides the head that's causing this. Eq'ing? Lack of cone area? inefficient cab?

 

[Kevorargh]

I love the D800+ and never worry about volume in the live gigs I have played - and the HPF is a lifesaver that has worked wonders in some of the live setting - it has significantly cut down on the boomy effect of a room. The bands I have played have ranged from a 5 piece, 4 piece to a trio.

 

[Coughdrops]

I briefly owned an 800 and 800+ at different times. I found a similar sort of thing with them in that even when loud they didn't hit like I like an amp to. Tried them with different cabs and basses at different venues. My initial thought was how can this much power be not enough? I eventually just came around to the fact that they don't work for me. Something about their voicing and tone stack didn't translate. I then got a WD800 when they were released and love every bit of it. For me it hits harder and just better matches what I like. Disappointing as you say, but sometimes there's no other way to learn that something does or doesn't work for you.