Mesa Subway Bass DI-Preamp

[bucephylus]

There are three basic elements to a bass "amp": the preamp, the power amp, and the speaker+enclosure.

You can buy this system all at once (combo amp), in two parts (bass head + cab), or in three parts (preamp, power amp, cab).

Suggesting that a discussion about a preamp belongs in effects is silly. That's about the best word I can use without baiting a moderator to send me a warning.

I see it the same way. But, I believe @mikeGJ was mainly reflecting the growing preference to put the preamp on a pedalboard; and the so-called "Effects" forum has kind of turned into a "Pedalboard" forum. There are a slew of new preamp/DI's targeted at that user group.

 

[mikeGJ]

There are three basic elements to a bass "amp": the preamp, the power amp, and the speaker+enclosure.

You can buy this system all at once (combo amp), in two parts (bass head + cab), or in three parts (preamp, power amp, cab).

Suggesting that a discussion about a preamp belongs in effects is silly. That's about the best word I can use without baiting a moderator to send me a warning.

Call me whack if you like, but there was already a thread on this DI/Pre in "effects", as well as threads for many similar DI/Pre "pedals", and I didn't start any of them.

You can try to move them ALL back here if that makes the most sense to you, but that horse has already left the barn, IMO.

Folks see them as gig bag items, or pedal board pieces. It's a different view, and not necessarily the right one but "it is what it is".

 

[bucephylus]

Call me whack if you like, but there was already a thread on this DI/Pre in "effects", as well as threads for many similar DI/Pre "pedals", and I didn't start any of them.

You can try to move them ALL back here if that makes the most sense to you, but that horse has already left the barn, IMO.

Folks see them as gig bag items, or pedal board pieces. It's a different view, and not necessarily the right one but "it is what it is".

I think that is correct; except I would also point out that other preamps in that group, such as the Noble, also have their own threads in the Amps forum. And, as I said earlier, we have traditionally discussed preamps in this forum. I personally don't think of preamps as an "Effect." But, as I also stated earlier, the "Effects" forum is now viewed by many TB'ers as a "Pedalboards" forum. And, in our great tribal manner, we are getting subdivided into those who use pedalboards and those who don't. Which is kind of comic, but, anyhow...

It is a bit confusing when threads for products are going on in parallel in different forums.

 

[murphy]

I am happy this is being discussed here, as I never look in the effects forum

 

[Lowendtech]

I think that is correct; except I would also point out that other preamps in that group, such as the Noble, also have their own threads in the Amps forum. And, as I said earlier, we have traditionally discussed preamps in this forum. I personally don't think of preamps as an "Effect." But, as I also stated earlier, the "Effects" forum is now viewed by many TB'ers as a "Pedalboards" forum. And, in our great tribal manner, we are getting subdivided into those who use pedalboards and those who don't. Which is kind of comic, but, anyhow...

It is a bit confusing when threads for products are going on in parallel in different forums.

A Pedalboard Preamp Forum perhaps.
Call it the Preamp Stomp Soapbox
It'd get busy there fast.
But better here than in Effects. Ymmv etc.

 

[bucephylus]

So, rumor has it that some of these were supposed to be showing up at the Mesa store this week. Sweetwater still shows December; but, who knows. (drums fingers on table). I know patience is a virtue; but, I'm still lacking in that department.

 

[Jeff Bonny]

Why don't ALL these kinds of bass DI/preamps have a thru out like this one does? Isn't it obvious that a signal you've EQ'd for your stage sound isn't always going be the most usable signal for FOH? After reading through the manual the Subway DI-Preamp is in terms of pure versatile functionality head and shoulders above anything else in its class or price range.

Based on the flexibility of this thing and how much I dig the EQ on the D-800 amp I'm going to give it a try as soon as L&M has them in stock. I can see it replacing one or two or....three things I've got now. If nothing else it'll likely be the go-to on a regular low volume restaurant gig with an acoustic piano player where I run my bass through the house PA.

The simple fact that unlike almost every other bass DI/Pre it's not cluttered with an unnecessary on/off stompbox switch says a lot about the thought that went into who it's for and how they really use a tool like this.

 

[agedhorse]

The pre-DI is more of a pro tour solution, the feature set is really geared towards the touring, gigging players and especially those playing fly dates.

 

[therhodeo]

The pre-DI is more of a pro tour solution, the feature set is really geared towards the touring, gigging players and especially those playing fly dates.

Or guys like me who play at church with zero stage volume requirement.

 

[agedhorse]

Or guys like me who play at church with zero stage volume requirement.

Good point

 

[therhodeo]

Good point

Its a pretty large market.

 

[bucephylus]

This is the kind of box that along with a good IEM setup gives a very good amp-less solution, which is what you are both saying.

Also, I happen to think that breaking out the pre from a separate power module will be a very flexible way to go, in general. But, now we just need to convince more companies to offer self standing Class D power modules. Say, in a format that can be mounted in speaker cabs....

 

[agedhorse]

Its a pretty large market.

Even better point.

 

[agedhorse]

This is the kind of box that along with a good IEM setup gives a very good amp-less solution, which is what you are both saying.

Also, I happen to think that breaking out the pre from a separate power module will be a very flexible way to go, in general. But, now we just need to convince more companies to offer self standing Class D power modules. Say, in a format that can be mounted in speaker cabs....

I think a large part of this challenge is the unwillingness of manufacturers to invest significant costs into the safety and EMC certification of an approach that has not been able to gain much traction in spite of the attempts. I have heard from several folks here about this, and how inexpensive it would be to make such a product, DIY builders might be able to ignore the requirements for safety and EMC certification but certainly I wouldn't expect main stream manufacturers to follow this path.

Just to put things in perspective, the start to finish cost to bring a new product through global EMC and safety certifications (with national differences) runs roughly $30k assuming everything goes pretty much as expected. That's a big nut to crack on a specialty product, and would take an awful lot of confidence to move forward on IMO.

 

[bucephylus]

I think a large part of this challenge is the unwillingness of manufacturers to invest significant costs into the safety and EMC certification of an approach that has not been able to gain much traction in spite of the attempts. I have heard from several folks here about this, and how inexpensive it would be to make such a product, DIY builders might be able to ignore the requirements for safety and EMC certification but certainly I wouldn't expect main stream manufacturers to follow this path.

Just to put things in perspective, the start to finish cost to bring a new product through global EMC and safety certifications (with national differences) runs roughly $30k assuming everything goes pretty much as expected. That's a big nut to crack on a specialty product, and would take an awful lot of confidence to move forward on IMO.

Most people fail to understand that getting good ideas to market is largely limited by infrastructure related issues, as you've mentioned.

But, won't stop us users from asking....

My first use of this preamp will be with the Demeter Minnie 800D. That box is actually a good start at the footprint I'm thinking about.

 

[Jeff Bonny]

The list of situations where this box wouldn't be useful is actually pretty short.

 

[BassikLee]

Yeah, I'm in the "direct and ears" camp most of the time. I do have one band that is still playing amps on stage, with steam powered wedges. This pre will give me a second flavor with my recently gone thru by Andy streamliner. Win/Win.

 

[paytojt]

Will running this preamp through the effects return of another class d amp (streamliner 900) make the tone different from a regular d800? I know might be a silly question...

 

[onda'bass]

So would a d800 run a poweramp
+4 dB. If so how would you wore it, the DI

@agedhorse

 

[agedhorse]

Will running this preamp through the effects return of another class d amp (streamliner 900) make the tone different from a regular d800? I know might be a silly question...

Yes, but mostly when driving the amp hard because the D-800 has several anti-saturation control circuits that allow for the amp to work well under these conditions.