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Mesa vs Aguilar?
- Thread starter Mediocrity Man
- Start date
I've used each for several years. Both are fantastic but sound quite different. The Aguilar, to my ears, doesn't have the high end or deep lows of the Mesa. It also can go from mild break up to full on fuzz using the unintuitive gain, drive, and mid controls. It definitely takes some experimentation to figure out how they interact with each other. The Mesa is very clean and has much more range in its eq. Although both sound great at nearly any setting it can take some experimentation with the controls to get a sound that works for you.
Both are very well made, reliable, and loud. I play in a rock band with 2 guitar players with 50 watt amps and and could always be heard (I'll talk about cabs later). Volume to my ears on both is very comparable despite the wattage differences.
Both sounded good through the variety of cabs I played them through - SWR sealed Marcus 410, Subway 112, 115, and currently 212. I would recommend using at least two speakers with either amp. I was using just the 115 for a while and while it worked, there were times where I felt like I might be driving the cab a little to hard.
I had the TH500 for years, got the D800 when it first came out and used that since 2016. I recently have gone back to the TH500 just out of current tonal preference.
I definitely recommend testing each out if possible and not going by what you read since taste is so subjective. I don't think you can go wrong with either.
Both are very well made, reliable, and loud. I play in a rock band with 2 guitar players with 50 watt amps and and could always be heard (I'll talk about cabs later). Volume to my ears on both is very comparable despite the wattage differences.
Both sounded good through the variety of cabs I played them through - SWR sealed Marcus 410, Subway 112, 115, and currently 212. I would recommend using at least two speakers with either amp. I was using just the 115 for a while and while it worked, there were times where I felt like I might be driving the cab a little to hard.
I had the TH500 for years, got the D800 when it first came out and used that since 2016. I recently have gone back to the TH500 just out of current tonal preference.
I definitely recommend testing each out if possible and not going by what you read since taste is so subjective. I don't think you can go wrong with either.
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I had both and kept the TH500. Fuller tone and more musical.
I know the original poster asked about the tone hammer, but I feel like the AG700 is worth mentioning. It is more capable of producing the deep lows of the Mesa, much more so that the tone hammer.
I would agree - I think the AG700 is closer to the D800 than the TH500 is.
This is the reason I went back to GK.
The Mesa just wouldn’t punch. Even through a 410. Or using both 410’s. Just no growl when you wanted it and no punch.
It does clean all day. If your a jazz player heck ya go Mesa. But if you want to play rock. No.
I’ve come to this same conclusion while comparing these amps.
I thought that the TH500 sounds like nothing else, and that I had a hard time telling the AG700 from the D800.
I was comparing Class D heads at my local shop, using a Fender Custom Shop PBass and a Genzler 212 cabinet:
Aguilar AG700
Aguilar TH500
Mesa D800
GK MB800
Genzler Magellan 800
Quilter BB800
My subjective conclusions:
The TH500 was very woolly (Little highs, not clear, but thick.
The AG700 and the D800 sounded the most alike amongst these heads. Both were clear, full, and moderately dark. I liked the tone of the D800 a little better and I liked how the EQ and other controls responded better. The D800 was definitely the best designed amp, and ignoring the Genzler’s built in overdrive, the most flexible.
The GK MB800 and the Genzler sounded similar as well. Both were clear, full, and bright, but I thought that the Genzler’s tone was much better than the GK.
The Quilter BB800 had the sweetest tone out of all of them. It was thick, clean, spongey, and had a smooth brightness. However, it had more limited tone controls (only 1. bass shelf, and 2. a dial-in scoop/honk) and the main reason I didn’t buy it: Post-masterVolume DI.
Honestly, if the DI was Pre-masterVolume, I could’ve dealt with the limited tone controls and would have bought this a long time ago. (Yes, I could get a separate DI, but I really don’t want that right now)
Jazz only huh?, I'm guessing Ben Kenney, Tony Hall (Dumstaphunk), John Myung, Rob Trujillo, Blasko (Ozzy), Les Claypool, Gary Mounfield (Stone Roses), Paul McCartney and many, many other pros would strongly disagree with your opinion on Mesa's ability to punch or growl.
but I'm sure your experience exceeds theirs
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I have had both the D800 and the TH350. Bought a TH700 and sold the D800. TH is much more to my tonal preferences. The D800 was clean and clear, but I love the TH warmth. I did like the Walkabout when I had it, so the WD800 might be a more apt comparison to the TH.
Ive recently switched from a Rumble 500 head to a D800...and I also play through a GK MB212. I wouldn't describe the D800 as "dark"...i guess when compared to a "brighter" eq'd head, maybe low-mid forward, but i can get plenty of snap and clarity.
Reviving this thread, here's a good descriptive comparison IMO (from this article): the TH500 sounds mid-rich, gritty, and vintage with an affable and musical tone coloration. It has a gritty character but doesn’t let it sound absolutely clean. The Mesa Subway D800 is transparent and modern with noticeable brightness and an extended high-frequency range. It has an open tonality and great dynamics but can’t approximate the punch and grit of the TH500.
I have played a TH500 for many years (love that tone) and bought an AG700 when they came out. I also bought a D800 which I really liked but by the slenderest of margins I stayed with the AG700. If I'd bought the D800+ maybe I'd have made a different decision.
Agedhorse's Mesa amps are a quality act.
Agedhorse's Mesa amps are a quality act.
Calling @Al Kraft
He has (or had both) and is very unbiased in his reviews (which I almost always agree with)
BTW, I had a TH500 and didn't like the tone. I've later learned that the controls are very interactive and that I probably didn't give it a fair test.
He has (or had both) and is very unbiased in his reviews (which I almost always agree with)
BTW, I had a TH500 and didn't like the tone. I've later learned that the controls are very interactive and that I probably didn't give it a fair test.
Hard to go wrong with either choice. I'd suggest playing them if you can. If you can't, youtube videos are helpful.
Al Kraft
Supporting Member
- May 2, 2016
- 10,774
- 40,453
- Disclosures
- Mesa Boogie beta product tester and player support
I'll start by saying that for Mesa Carbine or GK MB players the D-800 will sound less present in the top end (i.e. a darker inherent voicing). I find the D-800 to be clean, clear and articulate with most of the tonal controls (EQ and deep switch) oriented more in the lows and low mids area. The treble EQ and the voicing control will get you a more open top end (plus you can dial back some lows to fine tune), but Carbine and GK MB sharpness and glass-cutting top end were not a design goal to my ear. The other thing the D-800 has going for it is that the notes have a quickness and nice definition (there's a tad of Carbine DNA in that respect) that along with the fixed HPF allow you to push the bigger lows without things getting muddy or out of control.
The TH500 IMO is a product in its own class. It's easily one of the most tube-like behaving/sounding all SS heads out there to my ear. I think it's best characterized as anchoring the opposite end of the voicing world from a GK MB or Mesa Carbine. I find the TH500 a little less inherently bright than most anything else, but not lacking in note definition because of that. The non-intuitive and interactive nature of the control set takes some skill to master - but it's very versatile once you get the hang of it. IME the TH control set is focused a lot on emphasizing characteristics in your mids. As the gain/volume goes up, the mids can get sort of thick and harmonically blurry - some say wooly. The D-800 doesn't do this IME.
I like and own both the TH500 and D-800, but they are not at all similar to me. The TH500 is a class D for Aguilar fans who don't want to lug the heavy DB head and are willing to give up a bit of that DB slam and tube preamp richness. It's not a mini-DB, but there is a clear family resemblance with a lot voicing flexibility.
The D-800 is a more polite version of the Carbine quickness with a bit richer and less sharp edged focus to the notes. I'd describe the tone as polite, but powerful. There is a lot of flexibility in the voicing control, but you have more direct control in the lows and mids than you do the upper register IMO. It is a versatile head that has rounder and smoother sounding notes than the bullets that fire from the Carbine amps (which I also own). The 800+ offers a lot more upper register direct control and general presence in the top end and the WD and TT models do as well, but are centered around a different voicing.
As a final thought since it was mentioned, I found the AG700 to be more directly D-800/GK MB competitors than some slightly revoiced higher output version of the TH. The AG was not as refined in its controls and seemed more brute force/rock oriented in many respects. To put that in context though, I was comparing it that day to a Berg Forte. All great products, just different tools for different jobs/tastes. As always YMMV!
I owned the Tonehammer pre... it was fine, had the usual tone controls you'd expect. I was only able to get bland tones out of it. I use a Mesa 400 w/Sansamp BDDI in the FX loop so that's where I am coming from.
Al, I've got to ask.
Out of the pile of heads you have, which one do you normally grab for a rock or R&B gig.
(you know, gig; like when musicians would get together and play music for an audience ...)
Out of the pile of heads you have, which one do you normally grab for a rock or R&B gig.
(you know, gig; like when musicians would get together and play music for an audience ...)
