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$300 seems to be the top end asking price for a used Rum-200 combo.
I managed to find one in excellent condition for $199, at GC no less.
But that was last year, I think all the love they've been getting lately has jacked up the used market prices.
Depends I have used 60watts at a semi acoustic gig all the way to 800 outdoors. On average with PA support 300 watts if good enough but depending on the music and size of venue it varies.
I gigged school gym sock hops, no FOH, two guitars, drums, rock covers, with a Vox Essex.
But that was back in the day when the air was clear and sound traveled better.
Global Warming causes attenuation of bass frequencies.
That's why we need so much more power than in the olden daze.
But that was back in the day when the air was clear and sound traveled better.
Global Warming causes attenuation of bass frequencies.
That's why we need so much more power than in the olden daze.
8x10 8x10 8x10 8x10I feel like anything over 800 watts is overkill, don't get me started on 8x10's
How much amplifier power you have isn't as important as loudspeaker sensitivity.
You can get greater acoustic output with the same amp if you use speakers with higher sensitivity.
A lot of guys on TB expend a lot of energy trying to run their systems at as low an impedance as they can to try and get as much power as they can from their amps. That will make a difference - but it isn't huge.
Example - if your amp puts out 300 watts into 8 ohms and 500 watts into 4 ohms, the difference in acoustic output is 2.2 dB - noticeable, but not a game-changer.
Many people have a hard time perceiving less than 3 dB differences in level. Also - remember that to make a 3 dB difference in acoustic output, you need to double the amplifier power.
If you want to play twice as loud subjectively, you need 10 times as much amplifier power (your ears aren't linear in how they perceive sound - they're logarithmic).
You can get greater acoustic output with the same amp if you use speakers with higher sensitivity.
A lot of guys on TB expend a lot of energy trying to run their systems at as low an impedance as they can to try and get as much power as they can from their amps. That will make a difference - but it isn't huge.
Example - if your amp puts out 300 watts into 8 ohms and 500 watts into 4 ohms, the difference in acoustic output is 2.2 dB - noticeable, but not a game-changer.
Many people have a hard time perceiving less than 3 dB differences in level. Also - remember that to make a 3 dB difference in acoustic output, you need to double the amplifier power.
If you want to play twice as loud subjectively, you need 10 times as much amplifier power (your ears aren't linear in how they perceive sound - they're logarithmic).
Very enlitening! Purple haze..That's why we need so much more power than in the olden daze.
So, one thing that I've noticed from personal experience only (not sure if it's true or not, but it seems like it may be to me), is that while the difference in volume is as you describe - very minor, wattage differences in that realm (say from 300 to 500), can have a more noticeable impact on THD depending on amp as you approach/exceed that rated output.
As an example, given fictional identical cabs where the only difference is that one is a 4 ohm version and one 8, swapping between them with your example amp that does 300 watts into 8 ohms and 500 into 4 ohms, while the volume difference may be barely noticeable, IME the 8 ohm version may have noticeably more distortion at those similar volume levels.
When I try to wrap my head around why this might be from a technical level it makes my head hurt a little, but that's my perception, and I'm happy to be corrected if something else is going on or if it's all in my head.
.So, one thing that I've noticed from personal experience only (not sure if it's true or not, but it seems like it may be to me), is that while the difference in volume is as you describe - very minor, wattage differences in that realm (say from 300 to 500), can have a more noticeable impact on THD depending on amp as you approach/exceed that rated output.
As an example, given fictional identical cabs where the only difference is that one is a 4 ohm version and one 8, swapping between them with your example amp that does 300 watts into 8 ohms and 500 into 4 ohms, while the volume difference may be barely noticeable, IME the 8 ohm version may have noticeably more distortion at those similar volume levels.
When I try to wrap my head around why this might be from a technical level it makes my head hurt a little, but that's my perception, and I'm happy to be corrected if something else is going on or if it's all in my head.
What you perceive, is exactly what you perceive. No disputing that.
That being said, the same amp running 300 Watts vs 500 Watts due only to the elusive exact same speaker, except for impedance, and being more distorted at 300 eludes me. There has to be other differences that we are not detecting.
Of course no one has ever had the experience of doing an A/B comparison between a 4 and 8 Ohm speaker that, except for impedance, were exactly the same. Something we are missing is affecting how we perceive the two.
You like what you like and outside of the lab, that's what really matters.
It's been raining but no real wind yet, thx for asking.Unless, of course you are using a Class T amp. Which we all know, the T stands for transistor, just like the D in Class D stands for digital.... NOT.
You dry down there JimmyM?
.
What you perceive, is exactly what you perceive. No disputing that.
That being said, the same amp running 300 Watts vs 500 Watts due only to the elusive exact same speaker, except for impedance, and being more distorted at 300 eludes me. There has to be other differences that we are not detecting.
Of course no one has ever had the experience of doing an A/B comparison between a 4 and 8 Ohm speaker that, except for impedance, were exactly the same. Something we are missing is affecting how we perceive the two.
You like what you like and outside of the lab, that's what really matters.
I must admit that I'm speaking more just in terms of small changes in amp wattage (100-200 watts) than from cab impedance, though given that cab impedance effects amp output, I'm assuming (maybe incorrectly) that they're similar.
Due to a recent project of mine, I was able to compare what my amp sounds like with nothing at all changed aside from the transformer. My amp's wattage rating went from 460 to 340 watts per the manufacturer's ratings for each of the transformers. Overall volume level isn't really noticeable, as you'd expect when just running the wattage/dB calculation - but there does appear to be a difference in perceived distortion.
Not saying I really have a preference either way, just an observation. Maybe it is coming from something else...
If you mic your amp to go through the PA and use IEMs, there's nothing saying 15 watts can't play a gig. I've played a gig using a 50 watt combo before.
For a SS amp (I dislike tube amps so can't speak to that) I would not do less than 400 watts. I have used lesser-powered heads (250-300) on a regular basis and it was always a compromise. Today I prefer 500+, and my main rig is 800 watts. I never have it much above 10:00 on the master, but I always have headroom for any necessary eq adjustments with that much power.
It's a full jazz/R&B/rock band with horns, but the drummer is not a heavy hitter and the guitarist uses a 15W Mesa which we have to mic to hear across the stage.
We play pubs, halls, community events, sometimes outdoor gigs and it works for me. But would it work with a loud rock band? Probably not if you want a relatively clean sound.
We have a video on our FB page playing Pick Up the Pieces at an outdoor gig. I could have had a cleaner sound - My JC was overdriving the preamp:
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I gig with 300 watts with no trouble. Now that's from an SVT and an 810 but definitly heard. I'm in the process of acquiring parts to build a sealed 212.
All the talk of headroom and efficiency on TB is great and you can learn a lot. One of my perceived lessons has been an amplifier needs to be turned up to a certain point to really sound its best. 1200 watts may be great but if you can barely get the volume turned up it will lack the authority of a smaller amp turned up to a level it wants to see.
In summary unless you need a huge amplifier get what seems to be sized right. If you currently use 100 watts and it's barely doing the job look at 300 instead. My current rig sounds awesome, I need a smaller cabinet that puts out less volume to get the amp up to a level I want to be at for most of our gigs.
All the talk of headroom and efficiency on TB is great and you can learn a lot. One of my perceived lessons has been an amplifier needs to be turned up to a certain point to really sound its best. 1200 watts may be great but if you can barely get the volume turned up it will lack the authority of a smaller amp turned up to a level it wants to see.
In summary unless you need a huge amplifier get what seems to be sized right. If you currently use 100 watts and it's barely doing the job look at 300 instead. My current rig sounds awesome, I need a smaller cabinet that puts out less volume to get the amp up to a level I want to be at for most of our gigs.
