• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Minimum wattage to play with some buddies

R

Ray Ng

Sep 28, 2024
3
1
#1
Hi, so I've been practicing with just a vox amplug for a while now because that was all I could afford when I got a bass, but now I'm thinking of getting an amp so I can finally play with my friends. How much wattage should I be aiming for to just play alongside a guitar and drums?

FYI I play on a Five String Squier Affinity
 
  • Like
Reactions: rmayer
#2
Ray Ng said:
Hi, so I've been practicing with just a vox amplug for a while now because that was all I could afford when I got a bass, but now I'm thinking of getting an amp so I can finally play with my friends. How much wattage should I be aiming for to just play alongside a guitar and drums?

FYI I play on a Five String Squier Affinity
Click to expand...
What kind of music would you be playing and what kind of equipment do your friends have?
 
  • Like
Reactions: urkel3000, Bassdirty, Pulverizor and 2 others
#4
abarson said:
Watts are relatively cheap today and in general it's better to have more than not enough.
Click to expand...
This ^

You can always turn down too much, you can't turn up not enough :(


That having been said...I'd aim for a 2x10 combo in the ballpark of 200-300+w. IME, more speakers has been more helpful than just a single large speaker. YMMV...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rip Van Dan, DirtDog, Bassdirty and 2 others
#5
I have a rumble 100 and it’s freaking loud. More than enough volume that I’m comfortable exposing myself to in a rehearsal room.

If your friends are metal heads, hard rockers, turn up to 11 types- maybe 200-500 watt combo.

If you can, find out the guitar players rig. Hang out at a rehearsal and see if you need ear plugs. Or just ask em how loud they like to get.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BassCodger, Andy Marshman and hieronymous
#6
Are you after a combo or a separate head and speaker cab ?
If you are after a cab and a head then make sure the cab can handle the amp, the speaker must be able to handle more watts then the amp can put out.
If you get an amp that can put out 500 watts at 4 ohm and 250 watts at 8 ohms then you can get one 8 ohm 250 watt speaker now, you can always get a second speaker cab later so you end up with 2 8 ohm in parallel to get the 500 watts at 4 ohm.
There are so many possibilities that its best if you let us know if you find something so we can advice you on the best setup.
Like my teacher told me when I was an apprentice electrician, stupid questions can be embarrassing but stupid mistakes can be deadly, so just ask away.

PS. Where are you located ??
 
  • Like
Reactions: WRM
#7
You need to be concerned with the minimum SPL your require. If you have a target number, you need to consider both usable power power and how efficient your speaker system is.

Most speakers have a Sensitivity rating. Usually it's expressed as the resulting SPL measured at 1 meter from the cab when 1Watt is applied. For example you might see something like:
  • Sensitivity = 97dB 1W/1m.
This means when 1W is applied, 97dB is measured at 1 meter.

The SPL goes up 3dB each time you double the power.

Here is the progression, assuming Speaker A sensitivity = 97db 1W/1m:
Speaker A
1W = 97dB
2W = 100dB
4W = 103dB
8W = 106dB
16W = 109dB
32W = 112dB
62W = 115dB
124W = 118dB
256W = 121dB
512W = 124dB

If the sensitivity is 93dB 1W/1m, the progression is
Speaker B
1W = 93dB
2W = 96dB
4W = 99dB
8W = 102dB
16W = 105dB
32W = 108dB
62W = 111dB
124W = 114dB
256W = 117dB
512W = 120dB

So as you see, the resulting SPL is 4dB less at each power level.

If the sensitivity is 100dB 1W/1m, the progression is:
Speaker C
1W = 100dB
2W = 103dB
4W = 106dB
8W = 109dB
16W = 112dB
32W = 115dB
62W = 118dB
124W = 121dB
256W = 124dB
512W = 127dB

My personal standard for playing in a cover band is a rig that is rated for at least 124dB. I can make 118dB work, but it can be frustrating. This is one of those YMMV moments. You may require more than 124dB or you may be entirely content with less than 118dB.

Note that speaker A makes:
  • 118dB with 124W
  • 124dB with 512W
Note that speaker B makes:
  • 118dB with 316W
  • 124dB = 1259W **
** 1259W is a lot of freakin power! :eek: You need an amp that can deliver the power and you need a speaker system that can handle it.

Note that speaker C makes:
  • 118dB with 62W
  • 124dB with 256W
You will also want to understand what happens when you add a matching cab. Usually the cab is connected in parallel, so the impedance is cut in half. For example if you have two 8 ohm cabs, the combined impedance in parallel is 8/2 = 4 ohms. An important caveat is to make sure you amp is rated to safely handle 4 ohms or lower. Also, many amps deliver more power at 4 ohms than 8 ohms; so check the amp's specs.

When matching cabs are connected in parallel, the combined power rating is 2X and the two cabs share available power equally. If you have a cab rated for 400W and you add a matching cab, the combined power rating is 400 x 2 = 800W. If your amp can makes 800W at 4 ohms, each 8 ohm cab will get 800/2 = 400W. Make sure the cab's RMS power rating is 400W or more.

Each time you double the number of cabs, the sensitivity rating goes up approximately 3dB. So if you have one cab with a 97dB 1W/1m sensitivity rating, when you add a matching cab the combined sensitivity of both cabs is 97 + 3 = 100dB 1W/1m.

Here is the progression with two cabs rated 97W 1W/1m:

Speaker A x 2
1W = 100dB
2W = 103dB
4W = 106dB
8W = 109dB
16W = 112dB
32W = 115dB
62W = 118dB
124W = 121dB
256W = 124dB
512W = 127dB
Note: This is the same progression as cab C.

If the useable power = 800W, calculated SPL = 129dB
 
  • Like
  • Wow
  • Love
Reactions: Dabndug, ellenripley, Pernick and 11 others
#8
I vote something simple, like a Rumble 100. If that isn't enough, then the people you are playing with are either WAY TOO LOUD (what?!!) or are pretty sophisticated and might even have gear you can borrow. A lot of people do a preamp into a mixer or powered speaker.

Hoping they aren't too loud and have fun on the journey!

(btw, I have been playing almost 40 years, have all kinds of preamps, play through a mixer and headphones when I'm at home - and I finally picked up a Vox Amplug and am really impressed! For what it is, it's great.)
 
  • Like
Reactions: WRM, Exploiter8, Karl_in_Chicago and 1 other person
#9
Wow
A lot of info already on here

You can definitely go down a rabbit hole in your research but you sound like you’re pretty new. While it’s great to have an understanding of every nuance of a bass amp/speaker/combo it may only serve to confuse at this point.

Best piece of advice that I’ve seen is to figure out what your band is playing and are they loud? I’ve played an old rumble 100 and it was fine with a guitar and drums but those weren’t cranked.

At reasonable levels, you’ll be fine with 100w.

If you are loud, go with 250+

Are you going to play out? You’ll likely need at least 250 to carry a small gig. I have played several gigs with an Aguilar AG500SC into an 8 ohm 2x12 which is about 250w. No issues.

In reality, it’s going to depend on your budget , availability of equipment and what sounds good to you. If it doesn’t sound good to your ear, you’re not going to play it much.

If there’s a music store around, go plug in and see what you like. You may like the sound of a 1x15 combo, or a 2x10 cab with a separate head. I like a 2x12 cabinet myself with a separate head. The convenience of a good combo can’t be overlooked though.

Good luck in your search.

kgb
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: CallMeAl and Wesley R
#10
I just had a look at the Vox Amplug manual online and it looks like you can drive a powered speaker from it, that gives you another option for amplification.
There are many powered speakers out there that can be used with a bass guitar and then you can also use it at parties and anywhere where you might want loud music.
It is not the best option for you but it is an option nonetheless.
I am not up to speed on powered speakers but maybe someone else here can give you some helpful information on the options available.
With a powered speaker the whole band could go amp-less since that is what venues have when groups use front of house (FOH) for their gigs.
You just need some pre-amp pedals of some sort for the rest of the group.
I mentioned it in case someone near you is selling something useful dirt cheap, you never know till you look around.
 
#11
depends on how loud your guitar and drums are. playing with a sort of quiet metal band, i got away with 300 watts, and playing with a classic rock band with a gentle drummer and a restrained guitar player, 200 watts through a 210 did fine. at one point, in a very loud punk/alt band, i had to pump 1000 watts through a 118 and a 210 just to hear myself.

and different brands report watts differently, so one brand's 200 watts can be much louder than another's.
 
  • Like
Reactions: urkel3000, WRM, Bassdirty and 1 other person
#12
Get a 100 watt combo that can also power an extension cabinet. In case you need more you can just add a cabinet.

Another way would be to make sure the combo has at least a good line out, and you can buy a powered PA/monitor speaker to run that line and beef up your sound.
 
#15
I started with a combo amp.
It did and did not keep up with a drummer.
Meaning rather high distortion.
"Wattage" is not a myth, but remains the mythical standard for musicians.
Not about Wattage.
More about speakers and how much power they take to reach your
SPL goal.

Does not matter if 100 or 1000 watts.
If the speaker reaches distortion at 100 watts then the other 900 is useless.
And "250" Watt speakers can have high distortion at half that.
Really depends.
For efficiency 1x15 is minimum.
If that does not keep up with a drummer.
We just stack another 15 on top or 2x15.
Modern days most go with 2x12.
Wattage being a almost useless number.
More about speakers.
Would have saved me a lot of time when I found out
the hard way when my " 250" watt 1x15 combo did the
Same as my " 100 " watt combo.
I finally covered the drummer with a 2x15 stack
Later a 8x10

My 200 watt Hartke Head easily powered them.
And it was a few months to recover the money
to eventually just buy a Head and Cabinets.
Since combos became a waste of time.
Really depends on the band situation.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Blues Bass 2
#18
Get a combo…like this:
IMG_9432.jpeg

All kidding aside…the efficiency and total speaker area is as important as amp power in a band setting. An efficient 112 or 210 driven by 150-200w should be just fine. There are a ton of options at every price point. I’ve been impressed by GK MB and Fender Rumble combos. You might also check out Markbass. All widely available.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Ritter667
#19
buldog5151bass said:
Speaker area means more than watts
Click to expand...
No replacement for displacement :)

The size and number of speakers in a cabinet are easy elements to identify. The excursion is harder to identify but also a factor. As mentioned above "sensitivity" of the speakers should be considered in addition to the watts.

If you live in an area with rehearsal studios available and those studios have backline amps, then go see what they have to offer and how loud you feel you need to be. There's a good chance that 100-300w though a 1X15" or 2X10" cabinet could get you pretty far in a lot of settings. Maybe not in a droning doom metal band, but certainly in other genres.
 
#20
Ray Ng said:
Hi, so I've been practicing with just a vox amplug for a while now because that was all I could afford when I got a bass, but now I'm thinking of getting an amp so I can finally play with my friends. How much wattage should I be aiming for to just play alongside a guitar and drums?

FYI I play on a Five String Squier Affinity
Click to expand...
If you're playing a 5 I'd get a Rumble 500. Used ones are cheap. Should do everything you'd need it to do. Used to think anything not rated in kilowatts was a toy, but the deafening days are thankfully behind.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back