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More GC Stupidity!

#81
Brad Johnson said:
I never trade anything in to stores like this. I'd be willing to bet you'd get lowballed at just about any major or chain store. Why? Because that's how that works and even more important, you went in there with a bass maybe 5 people on TB have even heard of;)(I have, I've seen them at LAG with Dan Lenard).

If they got that bass, they'd be waiting on that needle-in-a-haystack customer (typically like me) to show up who:
A)Is willing to pay a boutique price and
2) Even knows waht the heck a Larkin is.

GCs are not niche stores. That's a seriously "nichey" instrument. I'm always on the lookout for niche instruments and regularly get crazy deals on them. I just got a Marleaux JB Deluxe 5 for less than 1/3 retail... and I know more people have heard of Marleaux than Chris Larkin... about fifty more to be exact;)

I don't get why someone with that kind of bass would even be interested in losing 50% off retail on it unless they got it dirt cheap and just didn't care. Put it on TB classifieds or Bassgear.com, neither cost anything to use (beyond supporting membership here, bg.com is free). You KNOW going in they're going to lowball you... or you should, so why bother?
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I knew the approximate resale value of it going in. The blue book listed it as around $800-$950, so I wasn't expecting much. But I was completely unprepared for the oh-so-generous offer made at GC. That was a bit of a suprise.
I realize that Larkin isn't exactly a household name ala Smith or Fodera, so I can not realistically expect nearly the same sort of offer.
I was not looking to sell it when I took it in. I took it to try out some amps; I saw the Thumb bass & absolutely LOVED it, so I thought I'd see what I could get from the Larkin.

That incident actually led to a very interesting telephone conversation with Bill Leigh of Bass Player ("the editor of BASS PLAYER is calling ME??? Do I owe him money or something?" lol) about the lack of resale value in instruments like these; something you rarely, if ever, see mentioned in their magazine.

It wasn't untill about a year & a half later that I actually did decide to sell it; and then only out of necessity. Oh well, it went to a good home. Miss it though.
 
#82
high mileage said:
Seriously, if you guys are always so disappointed in GC then why do you go there?
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They're like Wal-Mart. Everyone hates them. But dang it if you keep going back! Sometimes it's the only place to go.

I've had "ok" GC outings. Never "great," just...ok.
And I've had a few bad experiences at shops other than GC.
Like the very small local shop, whose owner is a former pro Nashville session & touring bassist. Tried convincing me that I HAD to buy the 2 beater 8-ohm cabs he had instead of finding ONE 4-ohm cab.
"NOBODY has EVER made a bass cab rated at 4 ohms! It's IMPOSSIBLE! You NEED to get THESE."
Allrighty then....
 
#83
Musiclogic said:
I worked at the GC here, and have frequented a number of them. GC is GC is GC.....some better, some worse, but no matter what, it is a corporate mindset and should be looked at as such. They want you to feel like they are doing for you when in fact they are doing for themselves. After 3 months of obvserving and working with both the employees I worked with, and the Corporate guys who are in and out of the stores constantly, I gained a greater appreciation of the mental midgets that work there. Every GC I have been to seems the same, one or two guys who have a clue(generally NOT managers) and a bunch of pet rocks.

Funniest quote from GC: "Dude, the B-52 is the exact same thing as a Triple Rectifier" Jason Farkas -Store Manager Kalamazoo Michigan GC LMAO
Click to expand...

Combine that with the ofttimes clueless musicians who go there and you have a regular circus.

:hiding:

I don't look for GC employees to know what they're doing... that's MY job to get and keep me informed. Salespersons' jobs are bottom line to sell. Some understand that being informed can help them do their jobs, others believe blowing enough smoke up someone's ___ will suffice. It's up to you as the buyer to be informed BEFORE you even go in... how else can you make an informed decision... by trusting a stranger?

I'm the guy who would find a Larkin severely underpriced in GC and pick it up for peanuts... because I'm in that 1% who even knows what one is:hyper:

Remember, GC and the rest of the world isn't Talk Bass... most bassists and stores have no idea what Larkin, Nordstrand, Surine or any number of boutique brands are. Heck, some don't even know what Foderas are.

"Funniest quote from GC: "Dude, the B-52 is the exact same thing as a Triple Rectifier" Jason Farkas -Store Manager Kalamazoo Michigan GC LMAO"

Perfect example. That quote isn't the least bit funny unless YOU know what's up;)
 
#84
jeff_bass28 said:
I knew the approxamate reslae value of it going in. The blue book listed it as around $800-$950, so I wasn't expecting much. But I was completely unprepared for the oh-so-generous offer made at GC. That was a bit of a suprise.
I realize that Larkin isn't exactly a household name ala Smith or Fodera, so I can not realistically expect nearly the same sort of offer.
I was not looking to sell it when I took it in. I took it to try out some amps; I saw the Thumb bass & absolutely LOVED it, so I thought I'd see what I could get from the Larkin.

That incident actually led to a very interesting telephone conversation with Bill Leigh of Bass Player ("the editor of BASS PLAYER is calling ME??? Do I owe him money or something?" lol) about the lack of resale value in instruments like these; something you rarely, if ever, see mentioned in their magazine.

It wasn't untill about a year & a half later that I actually did decide to sell it; and then only out of necessity. Oh well, it went to a good home. Miss it though.
Click to expand...

They probably couldn't even find a value for it of better yet, didn't even bother to look based on it's obscurity. Obscurity and chain store do not mix;)

GCs are not niche stores. They aren't about stocking things that the overwhelming majority of buyers don't have the slightest clue about. They're about moving product and time spent sitting on the sales floor is money down the drain.

For anyone willing to do regular, basic research, the lack of resale value would come as no surprise. Especially now, with so much information at our fingertips. OTOH I see many, many people here on TB who regularly say they aren't even concerned about that. The fact that they don't even consider "what if" simply amazes me. Sure, most of us buy gear with the intent of keeping it but what if you HAVE to sell it? Duh.
 
#85
I find that with most music stores, I have to know what I want going in. I listen to some of the salesmen talking to others and I know that they don't know what they're talking about. In my earlier years, I had a salesman sell me a amp head that runs 350W into 4 Ohms with a 4 Ohm cabinet. When I asked if I could add another one later he says "sure, no problem". Sure enough, I couldn't. Luckily, I talked to the store manager when time came that I wanted to add another cabinet and he exchanged the original cab for a 8 Ohm version.

The same is true with consumer electonics. I research the stuff before I go out to buy and I narrow it down to a few models. When I go to the store, I find that I know more about the products than the sales people.
 
#88
Okay...I'll clarify it....Mesa Boogie Triple Rectifier......one of the greatest amps ever made....for guitar B-52....a cheesy knockoff of the old Marshall sound....They sound nothing alike, and are not comparable in quality.

I realize this is Talkbass, but you would think musicians would be able to see beyond their own rig.

I guess it would have been funnier here if he said; "The Bassman is The exact same Thing as the Eden WT-550"

subjective comparative
 
#89
Brad Johnson said:
People think I do some kind of magic negotiations to get the weird deals I'm up to my neck in. I don't. It's rare that I'll even ask a followup question to my basic one... "What'll you take?". ...

Know what you're willing to pay. If you can't meet somewhere near that... "Thanks... see ya next time":D
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A suitable alternative is, "At $____, this bass is sold." Fill in the blank. On used gear, assume they paid half of what they have it marked. Split the difference, and you can usually pick it up. On new gear, start at 60 percent of list on most items. If they're hungry, they'll take it, or they might bump you up to 62 to 65 percent.
 
#90
Musiclogic said:
Okay...I'll clarify it....Mesa Boogie Triple Rectifier......one of the greatest amps ever made....for guitar B-52....a cheesy knockoff of the old Marshall sound....They sound nothing alike, and are not comparable in quality.
Click to expand...

It loses something when you have to explain it.
:hiding:

I realize this is Talkbass, but you would think musicians would be able to see beyond their own rig.
Click to expand...

Cool... want to hear a hilarious "inside" trumpet joke? This guy wanted to use a Monette STC-1 on a new Bundy... I almost blew milk through my nose on that one.
:hmm:

Why would you expect bassists to know or care about guitar amps? They have no relevance to what we do... unless we also play guitar, which many of us don't. No relevance whatsoever.

I have a friend who collects guitars. It's funny when he foams at the mouth over a AAAAAAAAAAA Quilted Maple top. Never seen that before;). Or bird inlays. OMGWTFCIA. Or (wait for it)... a matching headstock.:eek: . He doesn't realize that some bassists are far more adventurous aesthetics-wise than guitarists choosing a quilted Maple top on one of three body styles.

By the same token I don't expect guitarists to know anything about basses... and most don't, beyond playing one like a guitar;)

I guess it would have been funnier here if he said; "The Bassman is The exact same Thing as the Eden WT-550"

subjective comparative
Click to expand...

Stop, you're killing me.
:hmm:

:D
 
#91
Munjibunga said:
A suitable alternative is, "At $____, this bass is sold." Fill in the blank. On used gear, assume they paid half of what they have it marked. Split the difference, and you can usually pick it up. On new gear, start at 60 percent of list on most items. If they're hungry, they'll take it, or they might bump you up to 62 to 65 percent.
Click to expand...

Munji, the funny thing is, more often than not, when I ask what someone will take it's usually less than what I would've offered. Sometimes far less.
 
#93
tigersuit said:
The Hollywood GC is absolute garbage IMHO, at least when I went there a couple weeks ago. The Sam Ash across the street was MUCH better and more laid back, even during the holiday rush.
Click to expand...

I went there again today... not a bad experience. Jammed out on a Tacoma Thunderchief fretless, some fretless basses, and a 12 string Hamer. Not overall bad at all. A keyboard guy walked me & my friends through a Korg OASYS, which was really cool. The bass room had Markbass amps and some nice basses. I screwed around with a EBMM John Petrucci guitar and the 20th Anniversary Silo. Was treated with respect, and got to play some nice stuff.

The Sam Ash across the street, however... IMO it's horrible. Overcrowded with stuff, REALLY rude staff, guitar gear ranging from pretty nice to really terrible Sam Ash copies. Then I went to the bass section, where I was (dis)pleased to find 2 kinds of amps. Hartke and SWR. Neither my favorite. I can't find useable tones for me in either. I go to check out some basses... worst cases of high action/miscare ever. Even basses I generally like, such as the ESP/LTD B404 and Spectors were "meh" experiences. The head manager guy is ALWAYS rude. The Dave Mustaine flying V guitar they have comes with straplocks, which they put in the bag that carries the pricetag of the guitar. The first time they got that guitar in, the guy told me "Be careful with that thing" which I understood. I played respectfully, and 3 minutes later he comes up and startles me by saying "Hey, if you're not gonna buy that, wrap it up!" As if I would get an accurate assessment in 3 minutes if I were to shell out 900 bucks for one? I tell him alright, and proceed to warn him if he's worried about the guitar he should probably find another solution for where to keep the heavy straplocks, as they are likely to ding the back of the head. He just rolls his eyes at me. A few months later I'm back, the guitar still isn't sold (With those kind of sales tactics who could imagine?) and the neck has a few dings.

Hey, whatever works!
 
#95
Brad Johnson said:
For anyone willing to do regular, basic research, the lack of resale value would come as no surprise. Sure, most of us buy gear with the intent of keeping it but what if you HAVE to sell it? Duh.
Click to expand...

That was the subject of my conversation w/ Bill Leigh that resulted from this. I had sent him email asking why in Bass Player, and other mags, do they tout these $3000+ super-ultra-fancy-snazzy high end basses; holding them up as the Holy Grail; but make no mention of their near worthlessness if the time comes to sell it. I felt that withholding this information was actually doing their readers a disservice. Especially the ones who (like me at that time) think "Oh...3 grand on a bass...if I ever have to sell it, I can get it all back because it's...FANCY!" Of course, I bought it, THEN looked at their resale value (DUH!). I didn't really care though because I had a great bass; but it would have been nice to have had that knowledge beforeheand to help my purchasing decision.

And it's not just to appease the advertisers; withhold info about an instruments resale value to avoid putting off potential buyers; when's the last time you saw an ad for a Chris Larkin? (He really is a great guy, btw! :D )
Although he did get a review once...1996 I believe.
 
#96
I know what it's like to realize that your wonder bass doesn't have the resale value you thought it would, but I honestly don't think that BP has an obligation to constantly mention resale value. The bottom line is that when buying new gear, it's best to do it on the assumption that you intend to keep it for a good long while. Resale is fickle, right now Sadowskys have great resale value. In ten years, another brand may be all the rage, and Sadowskys made drop like Alembics do now.
 
#97
I think my favorite GC moment was at Flint Michigan. I saw an SVT II Pro and a SVT 610 sitting there, so i decided to give the head a shot. The tag was marked 1200 watts, which I thought "Gee i want a 1200w all tube head. That would be crazy!"

A salesman comes up and I point out the obvious mistake, and he says, "No dude, look here" and points to the fuse rating on the back "It says 1200 watts" Which id did, but that was the Maximum Power rating for the extra power plug on the back. I show him the speaker plug, it says "300 watts".

He still said he was right, because the one was bigger. I told him then to tell his manager that if i bought the head and i brought it home and plugged it into my speaker cabinet, and measured the true RMS power of the amp and it wasn't 1200 watts, then i should be allowed to keep the head until they can provide me an Ampeg SVT-2 that had 1200 watts. He said he'd get back to me on that. I laughed and walked out.
 
#98
When I went to buy my new bass yesterday at a local shop (super sweet place might I add), I heard plenty about the local GC doing stupid stuff.

There was a brand new Ampeg 8x10 and head unit sitting by the door, and I commented on how someone is going to have some fun later. He told me someone bought the exact same thing from the local GC, still in the factory box. Once they got it home and opened, they found the wheels/casters completely broken off. After calling GC, they were told by an employee that it would take over 2 months to get new wheels/casters for it.

Needless to say, they were returning the cab/head back to GC and buying it from the local store for the exact same price. GC didn't understand why they would do such a thing.

I've never had a "bad" experience with GC, just a couple unpleasant ones. If you do your homework and can find a good deal there, by all means, snatch is up quick before someone else does.
 
#99
Here's an experience I had today concerning a trade-in at a local dealer. This dealer had a beautiful NOS baby blue USA Millennium four string standard for a great price. Since it was not something I budgeted for, I asked him about a trade-in. He wasn't interested in my old Foundation (it's pink) and he really didn't know anything about my TBC, so he offered me a price about 1/3 of what I could sell the TBC for here. I understood what was up, and I said that I would be back later with money for that Millennium. The point is that we TB'ers spend alot of time on the internet, just talking basses, while merchants have to spend time actually running a store. The result is that we often have specialized knowledge that we can't expect them to have.

Off topic, a pocket knife dealer I talked to today told me how he filled out a major knifemakers questionaire with the complaint that the company needs to keep dealers up to date with new models instead of leaking word out on the internet. He said, like I said above, that he has a business to run, he can't surf the web all the time. When we get a rare boutique bass or a little know bass like my TBC, we have to understand that we just can't take it anywhere and get close to true market value, or even true trade-in value.
 
#100
I just got back from a visit to Sam Ash AND GC this afternoon.

I can tell you that, for the most part, the people at Sam Ash know their stuff better than the staff at GC and they tend to have a nicer selection (if you stay away from the "Sam Ash Specials" (i.e. companies owned or partially owned by Ash))...HOWEVER, I find that they (Sam Ash) do not deal as much as the guys at GC....I just bought a Hartke VX2510 for a full street price of $599 a few weeks ago....the sales guy would not go down and I really wanted the amp so....

Anyways...I am now on the lookout for a Squire modified fretless and Ash had one. GC did not (and the bass guy (who really is a bass player - surprise!!) at GC had not even heard of them...well, I was told the best deal I cold get from Ash was $263 (down from 279)...NOT a very deep cut if you ask me - especially since the guy made a good commisssion on the Hartke and I was ready to buy...I am sure I could have talked GC down to at least $250 if they had one....will keep looking....:bassist:
 

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