Most iconic hard rock/metal amp & speaker?

[NKBassman]

I know next to nothing when it comes to this subject, so I can only ask questions.

Are there different metal market segments? I'm thinking principally in geographic terms - is Scandinavian metal different from metal in the UK? Is Europe apart from Scandinavia a different thing? Is the US market distinct from the rest of the world? And what about Asian metal? Or is it the case that globalization has homogenized and blurred these former differences out to such an extent that they no longer exist (if they ever did)?

And if Mesa is looking to cement a place in the (I assume fairly substantial) metal market, are areas outside the US meaningful to them?

In metal, Typically regions somewhat tend to define sub-genres. Like "Swedish metal" is definitely a definable sub-genre of metal as a whole. I dont know that it necessarily affects the choice of bass amps per se, but it might.

I think it also comes down to the "size" of the band. Bands big enough to tour outside of their home country will either a) bring whatever amps they personally own, b) use popular amps available from backline supply in the country in which they're touring, or c) have endorsement deals to use a particular brand.

w.r.t. (a), could be anybody's guess. Mixed bag of vintage amps, tube or solid state, etc.
w.r.t. (b), Ampeg, Fender, GK, Mesa, Orange, and oddly lots of SWR. Also Traynor in Canada.
w.r.t. (c), I've seen Orange popping up everywhere lately.

 

[_Some Dude]

In metal, Typically regions somewhat tend to define sub-genres. Like "Swedish metal" is definitely a defineable sub-genre of metal as a whole. I do t know that it necessarily affects the choice of bass amps per se, but it might.

IMO, the biggest effect of regions on gear is price and availability.

 

[NKBassman]

IMO, the biggest effect of regions on gear is price and availability.

True, or is that reversed? The availability (or lack thereof) of certain brands can and will certainly affect "regional" sounds, especially in smaller markets.

 

[NKBassman]

@agedhorse, does this help? lol

 

[_Some Dude]

True, or is that reversed? The availability (or lack thereof) of certain brands can and will certainly affect "regional" sounds, especially in smaller markets.

Yes.

Look at all the gear that used to be old and cheap that is now expensive because certain genres started using them and that became "the sound".

 

[Jim Carr]

I agree Jimmy, I'm just trying to understand what the hard rock & metal community considers the most iconic, what they think of when they think of hard rock & metal bass rigs.

For me, I guess it is hard rock, more than metal. I think of Jethro Tull with their all tube 200 watt Hiwatt rigs with two 412 cabs, or Ron Wood, playing bass with Jeff Beck. He used a '68 Fender Telecaster bass and a Marshall Major 200 head with two 412 cabinets loaded with Celestion greenbacks. Kind of a super loud guitar amp.

If I were playing metal and needed to just lay down the thunder, I'd probably either do what Troy Sanders of Mastodon does (Mesa or SVT), or bring two 15/6/1 fEARfuls and a Crest ProLite 3.0—or may be a pair of Mesa Strategys. I think I'd use an HPF, some compression, and an active 5-string. Probably add some dirt at the tube pre level.

 

[4stringmf]

Interesting responses.

Bogey, wasn't the Stone one of Bob & Bobby Corona's clubs (along with the Keystone)?

There seem to be a lot of (somewhat) iconic brands that are now long gone, any thoughts as to why?

What has been iconic in say the past 10 years?

I would say the "iconic" brands before the past 10 years that are long gone perhaps due to the "grunge" phase that put metal back underground in the 90's. As far as the past 10 years? Like I mentioned before, the SVT in my opinion stands out far more than anything else. BUT! as of late, I am starting to see Class D heads on stage at metal shows. One that I remember specifically, a couple of months ago I saw a D-800 on top of a PH 8x10.

 

[jnsnj]

If I were playing metal and needed to just lay down the thunder, I'd probably either do what Troy Sanders of Mastodon does (Mesa or SVT), or bring two 15/6/1 fEARfuls and a Crest ProLite 3.0—or may be a pair of Mesa Strategys. I think I'd use an HPF, some compression, and an active 5-string. Probably add some dirt at the tube pre level.

I thought Troy Sanders played an Orange OB1

Edit: which is an amp I'm seeing a lot of currently

 

[NKBassman]

I thought Troy Sanders played an Orange OB1

Edit: which is an amp I'm seeing a lot of currently

Pretty sure he's been riding the endorsement train for years now. Was Mesa for a while. Ampeg. Now Orange?
I've noticed Orange EVERYWHERE lately. They must have really upped their marketing budget a lot over the last few years.

 

[4001]

Geddy Lee used SVT's (mid 70's) and later on (78-83) two BGW 750C power amps with two Ashley SC-40 preamps into a couple of 215 cabs with his Rickenbackers. When he used his Jazz Bass on the MP and Signals tour, I believe he had his tech switch the stereo Y splitter with a mono Y splitter using that stereo rig.

The stereo rig was shelved after the Signals tour was over in May of 1983.
Too bad. It was the best tone he ever had (hey.. my opinion), especially on the Permanent Waves tour in 1980.
That damn Jazz Bass had to come and ruin the day.... if he never walked into that pawn shop and found that beast, he would have probably been stereo for quite awhile longer.... maybe... then there was the Wal....and it ain't stereo...so.....either way, the stereo rig with the Rickenbackers was IT.

 

[andrew]

What has been iconic in say the past 10 years?

Not sure anything has been iconic in the past 10 years. Possibly the Orange AD200B.

But popular amps in heavy music that come to mind this decade are Aguilar, Darkglass, Orange. EBS in Europe. Ampeg and G-K are still in there but have been well before the past 10 years.

Lots of other companies making great stuff, but those are the amp brands showing up the most in big back lines.

 

[Jim C]

If Mesa put out an amp with a WD800 preamp strapped to a 200-300w tube power amp...

They would loose a ton of money after all the R&D, testing, certifiaction costs, and tooling costs.
How many tube power amps does anyone see, in any type of music, other than the SVT and a very few others like Orange.
I haven't see a Highwatt, Marshall, or other tube amp in many years and even then it's rare.

You can't compete with the SVT on price and its' iconic stature would be hard to dethrone the champ.
OTOH, SVT 4 Pro was mentioned and I had forgotten that one as another amp I've seen by the metal guys.

The heavy metal thing is interesting as I think we are all imagining big touring acts.
For a regional or local level, I see less and less bands carrying anything other than an SVT.
The Acoustic and Sunn amps were cool but not very powerful either, meaning multiple cabinets to get stupid SPL.
I had an Acoustic 370 with an SVT cabinet and was disappointed with the clean headroom.
I thought it was the cabinet but it wasn't.

Andy, how viable and expensive would it be to design and build a new 500 watt all tube amp at 4 Ohms?

 

[agedhorse]

500 watts, all tube? Expensive, large and very heavy.

 

[NKBassman]

500 watts, all tube? Expensive, large and very heavy.

Have you ever done any experimentation with a tiny pentode "power amp" driving a Class D power section? Tube power tone with Class D doing the heavy lifting, some pun intended.

The SWR Interstellar Overdrive comes to mind.

 

[Jim C]

500 watts, all tube? Expensive, large and very heavy.

Heck,
Even I knew that!

 

[br1qbat]

I know next to nothing when it comes to this subject, so I can only ask questions.

Are there different metal market segments? I'm thinking principally in geographic terms - is Scandinavian metal different from metal in the UK? Is Europe apart from Scandinavia a different thing? Is the US market distinct from the rest of the world? And what about Asian metal? Or is it the case that globalization has homogenized and blurred these former differences out to such an extent that they no longer exist (if they ever did)?

And if Mesa is looking to cement a place in the (I assume fairly substantial) metal market, are areas outside the US meaningful to them?

Not really by region so much as by subgenre. Many have what I'd argue are associated gear/brands/trends.

Last 10 years the Ampegs myriad SVTs are still #1 with a bullet. I might put Orange at a distant #2, seen a surprising amount across metal players.

But really, I would argue outside the SVT there's not another truly 'iconic' amp for metal bass, because theres a huge amount of gear avaible to choose from, both big company offering and at the boutique level.

My main metal genre of choice is Doom. I'd say for that there really isn't a specific brand thats iconic, but what is iconic are lots of cabs, lots of power usually from 70s gear or boutique designs based mainly in the same ballpark. IE: 70s Sunns (both tube and SS), SVT(tube) and fridge, Orange (ad200b), Matamp, Verellen, Hiwatt (and clones), Sound City, 70s-80s Peavey, etc.

Mesas are around but usually the 'big iron' ones like the 400/400+ and the diesel cabs (those 2x15s seem to be the most common)

And big heavy cabs: 4x12s, 2x15s, 8x10s, 4x15s.

 

[NKBassman]

I'm trying to think back to the other local bands that were popular when I was in my 20s and playing actively in a metal band.

I started out using an Ampeg 3PRO, and later a Sansamp RBI. Then Ampeg 2PRO. Then my Verellen Meatsmoke, which I still own.
Another popular local band at the time was using a Mesa 400+.
Lots of SVTs. Lots of component rack rigs. Lots of Sansamps.
One band that is still active today had (and still has) a Marshall VBA-400 that sounded AMAZING.

 

[br1qbat]

I'm trying to think back to the other local bands that were popular when I was in my 20s and playing actively in a metal band.

I started out using an Ampeg 3PRO, and later a Sansamp RBI. Then Ampeg 2PRO. Then my Verellen Meatsmoke, which I still own.
Another popular local band at the time was using a Mesa 400+.
Lots of SVTs. Lots of component rack rigs. Lots of Sansamps.
One band that is still active today had (and still has) a Marshall VBA-400 that sounded AMAZING.

Those vba400s are killer, I've lusted after one on and off for awhile

 

[agedhorse]

Have you ever done any experimentation with a tiny pentode "power amp" driving a Class D power section? Tube power tone with Class D doing the heavy lifting, some pun intended.

The SWR Interstellar Overdrive comes to mind.

Perhaps.

 

[_Some Dude]

They would loose a ton of money after all the R&D, testing, certifiaction costs, and tooling costs.

It's not like they don't have the experience or the IP. Nor is it a reason to discard ideas if that's what Agedhorse is digging for. I'm sure he can think and make decisions for himself. If he doesn't like it he can either tell me himself or ignore it.... either way it's not a big deal.

How many tube power amps does anyone see, in any type of music, other than the SVT and a very few others like Orange.

Seems like an underserved market. The SVT is too heavy, the V4B doesn't have enough headroom, the Orange is too wooly; there's room to manoeuvre there.

Andy, how viable and expensive would it be to design and build a new 500 watt all tube amp at 4 Ohms?

There's a reason I suggested something in the 200-300w range.