Music Man Stingray Classic - grounding issue?

[walterw]

i have a hard time imaging how those basses could sound like anything but a clacky mess with the treble maxed out.

+1 to just keeping your hands on the strings when the bass is turned on anyway. otherwise your just letting extraneous string noise happen, not very professional.

 

[Rano Bass]

It looks like you are not alone, take a look at this article:

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Maybe that is the nature of the beast

 

[mrhudson]

I am encountering this as well with my new stingray classic 4-string. I attached an mp3 of the noise - in the file, you can hear it come in and out as I touch various metal parts to make it subside, etc.

I sent this sound file to Ernie Ball, asking them about it, and they are suggesting that I (pay) to ship this out to them for repair - they say it sounds like a grounding issue. Any advice? Would they be able to fix it? Will be expensive to ship out I'm certain.

Thanks for any advice.

 

[Pablo770]

I’ve just got a gig yesterday evening and I got fairly strong buzz through stage monitor while untouching the strings, certainly more distinct than that which I hear through my amp. As I got quite worried about that, I thought it’s time I should do something with that buzz/noise issue.

And I’ve just read that Nordstrand has released their own MM replacement preamp – 2B-MM. Does anyone of you have any experience with that preamp after swapping in 2-band Stingray?

It looks like you are not alone, take a look at this article:

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Maybe that is the nature of the beast

Do you think it would be reasonable to replace only pickup itself or maybe preamp itself or both of them at the same time?

 

[walterw]

Again, if the noise goes away when you touch the strings, there's nothing wrong with the bass.

 

[Cowzone]

Same issue here. Mine is a 3 band eq.
Ok, theres nothing wrong with it. I won't get into that (although my others basses are dead silent, including my Ibanez ATK) but it can be a pita when recording. Especially if you want to boost the treble after 12:00 because you can hear the hum even touching the strings after this point.
If it's just the way it is, how can I make it stop without exchanging pup or preamp?
Hey Pablo, any development in silencing it?
I'll be taking mine to my tech tomorrow. I'll post if something changes.

 

[Pablo770]

Until now I haven’t found out what’s the reason of the buzz while not touching the strings. I try to play with my fingers on the strings all the time, but there are some moments when I release my hands off the bass and then can hear the buzz. From previous posts I came to a conclusion, that there are 2 things which, if not solve the problem, at least can help to a certain degree - grounding the pickup with strips of copper or swapping the pickup. I wouldn’t like to swap the pickup as I love my white pickup cover...

Thanks in advance for providing the conclusions of your guitar tech.

 

[SGD Lutherie]

Until now I haven’t found out what’s the reason of the buzz while not touching the strings.

Like Walter said, if the hum goes away when you touch the strings than it's not the bass. It's likely the outlet you have your amp plugged into, or the amp or cable.

The hum goes away when you touch the strings because the strings are grounded, and by touching them your body is grounded. The fact that it's not not humming shows the bass is fine. Usually if the ground on the amp is bad, either because it's plugged into an outlet without the ground pin connected, or the ground pin is missing on the amp's plug, you will get that hum.

But trust us, it's not the bass.

 

[Pablo770]

It's likely the outlet you have your amp plugged into, or the amp or cable.

But I played 2 other basses (Ibanez ATK and the second with MEC MM style pickup) in my rehearsal room, through the same amp and outlet and got no additional buzz. And what's more, I could hear the excessive noise from my Ray in other places as well, so I assume it's not the issue of my rehearsal room.

 

[SGD Lutherie]

But I played 2 other basses (Ibanez ATK and the second with MEC MM style pickup) in my rehearsal room, through the same amp and outlet and got no additional buzz. And what's more, I could hear the excessive noise from my Ray in other places as well, so I assume it's not the issue of my rehearsal room.

Check all the grounds in the bass then. Musicman basses don't have grounds soldered between the pots to the jack, so I'd start by adding those.

 

[walterw]

also, are MMs shielded? that's the usual fix for this issue, grounded shielding in the control cavity, and even around the pickups.

ibanez and many others use black shielding paint in the cavities.

 

[4848277]

If you're getting a hum when not touching the strings, then the strings aren't grounded on the bass.

Check the bridge ground wire. Using an ohmmeter, you should have continuity from the bridge to the back of each pot and the control plate. If the resistance is high, infinite or intermittent, then replace or install the wire or otherwise adjust it accordingly. Or take it to somebody that can do the work for you.

The noise when touching pole pieces can be resolved by grounding them as others have already mentioned.

Sorry if my advice seems too obvious, but I'm appalled by what others have suggested in this thread. (ie: nothing wrong with the bass) Just because most SR4 classics exhibit this behavior doesn't make it right.

Good luck.

 

[walterw]

If you're getting a hum when not touching the strings, then the strings aren't grounded on the bass.

sorry, that's the exact opposite of the facts. if you touch the strings and the buzz goes away, then the strings are grounded.

when you touch them, they ground you, which is why the noise goes away.

 

[mcnach]

I’ve just got a gig yesterday evening and I got fairly strong buzz through stage monitor while untouching the strings, certainly more distinct than that which I hear through my amp. As I got quite worried about that, I thought it’s time I should do something with that buzz/noise issue.

And I’ve just read that Nordstrand has released their own MM replacement preamp – 2B-MM. Does anyone of you have any experience with that preamp after swapping in 2-band Stingray?

Do you think it would be reasonable to replace only pickup itself or maybe preamp itself or both of them at the same time?

No experience with the Nordstrand preamp, but I have a 2band Stingray where I put a 3band 3knob MMSR preamp from John East. Fantastic.
It's based on the 2band, plus a mid control with a concentric control for the centre frequency. Highly recommended.

And yes, have you bass checked. Some minor buzz is not unusual, depending on what is around you... but if it is really that bad.... that's not what a Stingray normally sounds like.

 

[4848277]

sorry, that's the exact opposite of the facts. if you touch the strings and the buzz goes away, then the strings are grounded.

when you touch them, they ground you, which is why the noise goes away.

Pablo770 has tried his other basses at the same rehearsal room, and they don't exhibit this behavior.

But I played 2 other basses (Ibanez ATK and the second with MEC MM style pickup) in my rehearsal room, through the same amp and outlet and got no additional buzz. And what's more, I could hear the excessive noise from my Ray in other places as well, so I assume it's not the issue of my rehearsal room.

Pablo770 is waiting for a valid solution to the problem.

Everything is not 'all OK' with the bass, and there IS a grounding issue with it.

I don't participate in this forum to argue with people.

 

[walterw]

no argument necessary.

if the noise goes away when he touches the strings, then the strings are grounded. period.

now, as for the noise itself, like a couple of us mentioned before, it's more likely a shielding issue; i'm not sure if stingray classics typically have shielded control cavities, but i know most import basses do, as they just about always have that black graphite paint in there.

if that shielding is compromised or absent, then that electrostatic buzz can happen more noticeably when you let go of the (grounded) strings.

 

[SGD Lutherie]

If you're getting a hum when not touching the strings, then the strings aren't grounded on the bass.

Well if that were true, then touching them would not make the buzz go away. The reason why touching them makes the buzz go away is because they are grounded, and that in turns grounds your body, which then acts as a shield.

This is easy to test for yourself by ungrounding your strings.

Shielding will solve the problem, and is why EMGs don't need string grounds. I once totally shielded a Rickenbacker, which also used humbuckers, and didn't need a string ground, even with a preamp.

 

[Cowzone]

Ok. Here is what I got so far.
Took my basses to my tech to some routine maintenance along with my stingray.
He have a very good grounding in his shop and there the stingray was dead silent. Same with my other basses.
He happens to have an ungrounded outlet there also so whe took the amp to try there.
Tried the stingray and the noise was back.
Tried my Fender Pbass with 62 ri pups and nothing. Very quiet.
Tried my Ibanez ATK with Seymour Duncan pups and pre and it was also very quiet.
My conclusion is that somehow the stingray is more susceptive to interference than my other basses.
My tech suggested that shielding might solve the issue but I'm leaving as is for now and try to live with it.
One interesting thing is that I could even touch the pups poles in the grounded amp without any noise.

 

[SGD Lutherie]

As I said in post #28:

Usually if the ground on the amp is bad, either because it's plugged into an outlet without the ground pin connected, or the ground pin is missing on the amp's plug, you will get that hum.

Or the outlet's ground is not connected.

Shielding will help, as will grounding the backs of the pole pieces on the pickups with copper shielding tape.

Part of the issue seems to be with the tremendous amount of treble boost you can get in the Stingray. I get that buzz with that preamp if my non MM pickups are not fully shielded.

 

[Calvin Nix]

Guys I feel your pain as I too have the same problem the rest of you are experiencing. I can attest to the apparent fact that it IS a problem and not to be considered normal since something rather strange happened the other night. When I plugged my SR4 in, turned on my amp, raised the volume, adjusted the treble control, I notice the buzz as usual. After about 20 or so minutes of playing I realized something. There was no buzz. NONE. It was gone. All the controls on the bass were pegged and it was dead quiet. I had not done any adjusting on the amp or anything. I fiddled around with the controls and could not get it to reproduce the buzz sound. I was trying to find a cause but couldn't. Thought for sure something might have made contact temporarily and that I might find the problem. I thought it had just healed itself for no obvious reason. I continued playing for a while longer and then disconnected and shut everything down. The next night I came to play and the buzz was back. I don't know what gives, its the damnedest thing.

Having said all that, I am not convinced that it is necessarily a grounding issue. At least not in the obvious sense, as I have grounded the pickup cavity and pickup poles with copper foil tape, soldered it, treated the surface, and tested for continuity. Everything is grounded, at least in the bass. I am now thinking that it may be an electronics problem. For a long time I was just willing to sort of deal with it, but the more I think about how much this bass cost and the fact that the problem temporarily went away kind of irritates me. I can't believe (yeah I can) EBMM doesn't admit there is a problem. I somehow feel the need to dismantle the guitar (preamp, and pickups) and break out the test equipment to find the problem. I wonder if there could be a faulty cap, loose solder joint or connection, or something completely off the wall. I will also check the grounds in my house. However, the other basses I have are very quiet compared to the Stingray.

I have tried to upload some pictures of the grounding work I did. I have others and the pic quality is good but I guess Talk Bass has a limit on the number / size of files I can upload so....
Anyway, if I am lucky enough to find a cure for this I will post what I find. That noise is ridiculous.

I've had the bass for a couple of years now. The grounding work was done early on.
2010 EBMM Stringray Classic Black 4s
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