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My regret as a bass player

I've been learning these lessons over and over. When I started playing bass (mid 70s in jr. high- I'm 52 now), I played an EB2-D with a pick. In 1982, I decided to try my hand at Berklee and thought they'd laugh me out of there if I went there playing like that, so I got a Fender Jazz and got my fingers operating in a reasonable fashion (and I was getting into slap playing and my pick/slap hybrid seemed a little awkward-shoulda stuck with that as I found out later that Bobby Vega was all over it). So, I worked really hard and got together what I could. Then, in my final semester, I found out that one of the most influential players in the bass department had played an EB2 with a pick-Steve Swallow. For years, though, I blew off that part of my playing until 2007. Then I was back to it. Sometimes I wonder how life would have been had I kept with my original vision.

I also went through a similar deal with my rigs. I started with a Showman and a double JBL 15 cab. Over the years, I've been through all kinds of high tech, high powered crazy rigs but here I am again, playing through a Showman and a JBL double 15.

I spent year traveling the country playing original music with varying degrees of success. I never played in a cover band until 2009, when I found myself enjoying a weekend thing after I started law school at the age of 48. I guess I chose wisely in some ways because being in a Grateful Dead cover band means I'm pretty much encouraged to be as far out as I want, but my background in funk and jazz means that even the most far out stuff is more grounded than a lot who play that music. But now that school is over, it might be time to find another original gig. At the end of the day, my playing is pretty idiosyncratic. But I realized early on that there were a ton of bass players a lot better than me at everything except being me. I've never had much success in emulating other players (although I'm told my Phil Lesh is pretty close, but I think that's more of a result of seeing shows in the 70s and knowing the background material, from my time playing bluegrass, classical, jazz, etc., than aping the tapes.). It's been pretty gratifying to meet players younger than myself who tell me that I influenced them early on, especially when they've had a decent measure of success. And teaching is lot of fun. Really, music is great!

The only advice I'd give to younger players is to make sure they really want to do it if that's what they're going for. You have to give up a lot to follow that path, especially with original music. When you start hitting your thirties and you're still living like you did when you were 22 and your high school friends are having families, buying houses and driving new cars, it can be psychologically challenging. There's no shame in having it be a hobby; even original music can become a job and drain your energy like playing in a cover band.

All in all, my only real regret is not wearing ear plugs more often.
 
So here's a thread I could only start late at night after one of my gigs...

When I was a kid just starting on bass in the 70's, I didn't want to be someone who sat in the back pounding out roots. Still don't, either. I wanted to sing and I wanted to play my ass off. When it came to bass player influences, back then I was all about John Entwistle, Chris Squire, Mel Schacher, Bootsy, Ronnie Lane, Gary Thain, Louis Johnson, Mars Cowling...all the players who demanded attention be called to their great bass playing. Later in my teens, I expanded to jazzier guys like Stanley Clarke, Andy West, Jaco, etc. Loved punk rock and butt rock as well, but was way more interested in Bruce Thomas and Graham Maby than I was Dee Dee Ramone, though I've always had a special fondness for Cliff Williams and Gene Simmons. But for the music I wanted to make, I wanted to use effects, I wanted to be loud, and I wanted to be entertaining and fun to watch.

Then I got out into the world of trying to find bands to play out. I'd jam with people and I'd get, "You play really well but you overplay," or "We're not looking for a lead bassist" or "Can't you just play the song and quit hopping around?" My favorite, though, was when I'd write songs and show them to everyone else, and they'd say, "Sounds like a bass player wrote these songs."

Wow, cold reality slapping me in the face with a dead fish! I determined that I wasn't going to get anywhere by being an awesome shredder (or whatever we called it back then), and I would strive to overcome the overplaying rap I had with being a dependable bassist who played the cover songs like they're supposed to be played and wrote songs that didn't feature the bass playing so much. I ended up staying fairly busy most of the time and it was cool.

But over time, and it took me a long time to realize it, I lost the qualities that made me unique and fun to listen to when I was just starting out, and I got assimilated into the Borg. I tried to write people-pleasing songs that sounded like whatever was current in rock and roll, and none of them had the flashy bass playing of the earliest stuff I did when I was trying to please myself above all else. As a result, nothing I did stood out from the pack, and it was all just OK and kind of boring and was treated as such by audiences.

Meanwhile, a whole slew of bassists with flashy chops who stuck to their guns were the ones really getting out there and making a name for themselves professionally. And by the time I realized I lost the spark, well let's face it...nobody was looking for me at my age. And now at 52, I still love and play music and have a lot of fun doing it and my band is quite well-respected on the 50's-60's-70's oldies circuit, but it only occasionally requires chops playing, and there are a few thousand bass players out there who can play bass in my stead, though if I whittle out the bass players who can't sing good harmonies and a decent lead, we're down to maybe a couple thousand.

Why am I spilling my guts like this? It's because I know some kids with talent and a dream like I once had are coming onto Talkbass every day, and one day they're going to post something about wanting to be unique and play in a unique style that's different from the norm. And I know the Bass Borg on here is going to tell them that they need to settle down, learn how to play simple repetitive lines, and know their role as a bass player.

And kids, if you're reading this, I want you to completely disregard anything they have to say about bass playing from there on out. I'll be the first to tell a young bass player that if they can't play "Back In Black" or "No Ordinary Love" without a solid groove that their work developing into a great bass player is far from over. I'll also be the first to tell them the realities of getting a paycheck from playing music, and that is if you're looking for people to hire you, give them what they want in return for the money you want or they will find someone else.

But you know what? When you're on your own time, you can do whatever the heck you want. No law says you can't do two or more bands at once. No law says you can't make yourself the star attraction. Pursue your vision to its fullest no matter whether it's being a solid dependable bassist in someone's working cover band or writing and recording the music in your head no matter how out there it may seem to some. Search for like minded musicians that are as interested in your vision as you are. If you can't find like minded musicians, do it yourself. Learn to play and program other instruments, or just do it all with your bass if you'd rather. And don't make any apologies about wanting to be a badass, stay true to your vision, and most of all, ignore those bass players who tell you how you should be playing.

If I could do one thing over again, I would have never made apologies about wanting to be a badass. The music business is such that I likely would have ended up right where I'm at anyway, but I'll never know now. So as I close in on AARP membership, I'm going to follow my own advice. Not quitting my gig or anything, but off the gig, I'm going to have fun with making my own music my own way for my own self-gratification. And I won't ever reach Bieber status with it but it's going to be one of a kind, and all of the soul-sucking forces out there who think I should fulfill their idea of what I should be doing as a bass player can suck their own souls. And if my music is polarizing and a lot of people don't like it, I will remind myself that there are 5000 bass players who could be the bass player with Bieber, but there is only one Les Claypool. It's pretty much a given that I won't ever reach Claypool status, but I will have fun making music my own way, and that's all he ever cared about, and that's all I care about.

So if there's one piece of advice I could pass along to bass players whose vision of music is unique and different and doesn't fulfill the typical bass "role," it's this (cue stirring marching music)...

The odds of you being a famous musician are astronomically against you no matter what you do, but if you have something that makes you unique, you will at least be the only person in the world from which they can get your special brand of music delivered in a style only you can deliver. Do what you feel you must in order to pay the bills, but pursue that uniqueness to its fullest whenever you can, have as much fun as humanly possible with it, and don't ever lose it no matter who tells you it's no good and won't sell. You can be one of a kind or one of many. It's up to you.

I'm not going to read the 19 pages of this thread, I don't need to. Jimmy that might be the most sage advice ever on Talkbass (at least since I was an Ask The Pro). Seriously, man ... words to live and grow by!
 
I'm going to go out on a limb here and opine that one needn't be a bass player to get the point of Jimmy's message.

My sons play keyboards, drums, guitar, and compose; my daughter plays bass; and I play off-key air guitar. I'm sending the link to all of them.

Jimmy, do you have a website where we can hear some of your songs?
 
I'm going to go out on a limb here and opine that one needn't be a bass player to get the point of Jimmy's message.

My sons play keyboards, drums, guitar, and compose; my daughter plays bass; and I play off-key air guitar. I'm sending the link to all of them.

Jimmy, do you have a website where we can hear some of your songs?
Working on it, Duke. First I need to record some songs ;) Unfortunately, last year I had a computer crash and lost every song I had ever written. Thought I had a backup or two but couldn't find them.

Thank you for the nice words, folks!
 
Great observation, and ALL bassists need to take heed of the words, not just young ones.

I have always felt like the gus who are saying "root notes man; don't overplay; play for the song" etc are the guys who can't, or don't want to get to the level of that kind of playing demand. And I am not saying that that is bad, but it is bad when those guys start slamming other players to make them selves fee like they are "right"

I am sooo glad that I never gave into the Borg, and over the years have found a way to be able to satisfy the "notes" checklist and the "groove" checklist at the same time (at least in my own head....). They should not be 2 separate entities!!

They key is to never assume that you are "done"...never assume that because you have mastered one goal that that is it. Keep redefining the goals and evolve!. that is what makes it a consistent joy to play...every time I pick up the bass, I act as if it is the first time. Every time we rep a song in band practice, it is a clean slate. I think: What can I do better this time. I am not afraid to try a part and have it fail - in fact my band mates would probably say I do this too much - but sooo many really great parts have come from the shrapnel of past failed attempts!

The number one rule I have always used is:
Am I happy with this bass part.

then, I consider everything else, and the bass part evolves into something that is hopefully happy for everyone.
 
what is the best guitar for off key air metal?

Well you got me there... I'm more of a cab junkie... wanna know what's the best cab for off-key air metal??

Working on it, Duke. First I need to record some songs ;) Unfortunately, last year I had a computer crash and lost every song I had ever written. Thought I had a backup or two but couldn't find them.

I have no idea what it's like to start on a promising (and off-the-beaten-path) project, even to the point of getting very encouraging feedback from one of the most respected voices in the field, and still not have finished it up years later. No idea whatsoever. (If you got my e-mail a couple days ago, you know that I'm revving up to finally get 'er done... and believe it or not, that was before I found this thread).

Seriously, sorry to hear about the loss of your songs from your computer crash. I lost all my crossover design work to a hard drive crash a couple years ago.

I'd really like to hear some of your songs if/when you get around to. Obviously you got the fire in your belly, and I'd really like to hear what comes out of it. (Hmmm... I'm not sure that metaphor really worked there... )
 
Man, I'm glad I read this...Very well said. I too was greatly influenced by the Ox and Jack Bruce. I stopped playing in the late 70's only to pick the bass back up about 5 years ago. Guess what, the only way I knew how to play was the way we played way back then, and I'm too old to listen to anyone dog me about my playing style...so I still play like I used to, and I'm having a great time doing it...
 
surely a good read for everyone...thanks. I just turned 51 and having a great time playing again last couple years after a long (20 yr) hiatus from gigging. Most guys my age (around here anyway) are playing the FM radio rock, alt country, oldies circut, etc,... me......still playin' Gang of Four, Bauhaus, The Birthday Party, Pixies, X, the Smiths,PJ Harvey, etc with some folks......so play what you want and be content.
 
My greatest regret. As with other passions in my life, allowing LIFE to interfere with my bass playing. I went almost 20 yrs without touching a bass. Where would I be today, had I stuck with it? GOD ONLY KNOWS! Perhaps I wouldn't be stuck in a deadend job, going nowhere FAST! Regret, something we all have to deal with I suppose. Too bad!!!
 
My Dad always use to remind me that making it in the music business is akin to winning the lottery. When I was in my mid teens back in the 70s, I didn't want to believe that, but now... Yep!

Dad was right! ;)

So, now I play for my own entertainment, and I continue to write original music as I have done since the late 70s. I never made it big, but I am quite proud of my body of work and have no regrets for investing my entire life into music.

Its the only thing I have ever been good at. ;)