Neck Dive (Poll)

[Snert]

View attachment 5272201

Show me the pic without his hands supporting it.

I like playing more vertically as it gives a much better wrist angle on the left hand than the near horizontal position FSOs are on me. Second advantage is that I and the bass take up much less room on stage which is important seeing some of the shower recess sized stages I've seen of late.

 

[Watchootognbout]

I'm surprised more people *don't* play bass in a semi-upright position.
Most of the stages I play on aren't big enough to have a lot of room to move around on without potentially whacking a cymbal or a musician... I like to keep my plucking hand straighter (so low slung) and hold up my neck so I can still move/groove.

N/S Stick is a dual mode instrument.
You can play it like a bass.

You can play it like a Chapman Stick.

 

[Pyrrho Epoche]

Why not steel?
Wood will break.

I doubt it will break just playing in my home, i guess anything is possible though. It only took 30 min. to make, really don't care.

 

[micguy]

I'm surprised more people *don't* play bass in a semi-upright position.
Most of the stages I play on aren't big enough to have a lot of room to move around on without potentially whacking a cymbal or a musician... I like to keep my plucking hand straighter (so low slung) and hold up my neck so I can still move/groove.

I do church gigs (with big stages), where the usual setup has a "void" in the center of the line of instrumentalists (the singers up front cover the hole) - the void is there so the big screen doesn't have our junk in front of it. As such, I could have a bass with a 30 foot neck (50 foot sometimes), and not run into anyone with it.

 

[WG Plum]

Can you reveal what you bought, or do you feel it would sway your poll? I've been playing for 50+ years and I have owned and played dozens of basses and just never experienced neck dive so bad that I couldn't play the instrument.

I'm only 30 years in, but I haven't either.

 

[badinage]

I haven't even put any thought into which direction I "point" my bass neck.

 

[badinage]

In fact, I specifically have a goal of not "thinking" about the mechanics of it at all. ...any more than I "think" about what my lip and face muscles or my lungs are doing when I whistle. Think the melody, the rhythm, the potential harmonies. Not the mechanics.

 

[DaveParker39]

N/S Stick is a dual mode instrument.
You can play it like a bass.
View attachment 5272459





You can play it like a Chapman Stick.
View attachment 5272460

This is my typical orientation on stage, although I only use a pick like 20% of the time.

 

[MYLOWFREQ]

Is this a joke? Nobody likes basses with neck dive. They might like the bass for other reasons and tolerate the neck dive, but liking bass because of neck dive is not a reason to like a bass, period.

 

[GIBrat51]

My assertion is there are far too many neck heavy basses that manufacturers put out for sale. As such, it's a blatant rip-off that takes our money for a badly designed instrument.

I'm sure there are clever engineers/designers working for manufacturers that can solve this issue before finalizing production runs. But it seems some bass makers don't care enough to do so.

I've had enough of this garbage. Recently passed up two new (not used) basses in a music store I would've liked. Settled on a third choice that wasn't neck heavy.

Anyway, to support my assertion, I need numbers as to how many of you do or don't like neck heavy basses.

I'll be pegging on neck heavy manufacturers as I find them and will need numbers as support if the numbers are overwhelmingly "don't like neck dive".

I'm aware of the multitude of workarounds suggested in this forum, and web, to correct neck dive. No need to repeat them here. My entire point is we shouldn't have to be working around and settling for deficient products that are new from the manufacturers.

While I sympathize with you, and agree with you - up to a point - don't expect me to sign any petitions. Personally, I'm far more irritated about the lack of left handed basses, than I am about a little neck dive... So, I suppose you could count me in the "I don't care" category. But, I think I have pretty good reasons...
- I made a list of left handed, 4-string basses that I wanted to own, 30+ years ago. And there are quite a few basses on that herd list that have not been made for a long time. Kinda useless to bitch to RIC about a Rick 4001's tendency to point at the floor, when your bass is... gosh, 50 years old now. Same goes for my aluminum necked, '78 Kramer 450B. If you really want one, you'll just have to deal with it's desire to rip your shirt off, as it heads for the floor... And, maybe do some arm exercises...
- Some of the basses I own, have what some people call neck dive, but... it's so slight, I just consider it "a slight forward bias, weight-wise". Yeah my violin basses - and my Hofner Club Bass - "suffer" from this, but... really; how hard is it to hold something up, that feels like you're holding up an Egg MacMuffin? And, finally;
- I've noticed, as I acquired all the basses that finally filled all the spots in my herd, that there are a lot of basses that people consider to be neck divers - for them; but, hung on my shoulder? They actually don't want to dive at all. Both my Ricks will start to dive - if I hold them parallel to the floor. But, that isn't the way I play them - or any of my basses, for that matter. At the slight upward angle I like for most of my basses? They don't dive - at all. Same for my Gibson Thunderbird. Held like a Fender P-Bass? Oh, yeah; it's a diver. Slung low, with the headstock pointed up at a steep angle? Really comfortable to play - and no dive, either...
So, I suppose that, if any of the basses I've bought new in the last 5 years or so were real divers, I'd probably have a complaint. But, they aren't - or, at least, not what I'd consider bad. I've always just considered all my basses to just... be what they are; and, to be happy that a bass I like is available as a lefty...

 

[DaveParker39]

Is this a joke? Nobody likes basses with neck dive. They might like the bass for other reasons and tolerate the neck dive, but liking bass because of neck dive is not a reason to like a bass, period.

If I've learned anything from the internet, it's that every possible thing is at least liked by one person

 

[SubHuman]

Show me the pic without his hands supporting it.

I like playing more vertically as it gives a much better wrist angle on the left hand than the near horizontal position FSOs are on me. Second advantage is that I and the bass take up much less room on stage which is important seeing some of the shower recess sized stages I've seen of late.

A lot here say the EB-3 is the worst offender and he looks pretty relaxed without holding the neck up.

 

[ClusterFlux]

The old adage that a bass is too light to balance well is a myth....

I didn't say it's impossible for a manufacturer to make a lighter bass that is balanced.

The problem is guaranteeing that an entire production run is light and balanced, when the density of your primary component is highly variable.

Let's say that 15% of a production run of a traditional bass is imbalanced. The boss says that in the next run, he wants to prioritize lighter instruments, and sticking you with the same budget. You now have to reject a higher percentage of bodies that are more than 7 lbs and/or chamber the body. That increases your costs, so you switch to a lighter and cheaper bridge. But you can't save much weight with the neck. Instead of rejecting every neck that weighs more than 2 lbs and blowing up your budget, you keep the same necks. Result? 20% or more of the next production run has neck dive. Right...?

And again, making a bass that is on the light side and balanced gets a lot harder if you're not allowed to change the body shape, and your design choices are constrained to traditional design features (big headstock, big tuners, wider necks, etc).

I.e. it's not that manufacturers don't know what they're doing. It's that pretty much every design and/or manufacturing decision involves trade-offs. If you want basses that are more balanced, something has to give. Either your costs go up, and/or you use less traditional designs, and/or you avoid lighter bodies.

 

[Jefenator]

I changed my vote.

 

[FRoss6788]

A lot here say the EB-3 is the worst offender and he looks pretty relaxed without holding the neck up.
View attachment 5273110

Um....

...not to argue, but, what's his hand doing there?

 

[JRA]

i voted "...don't like basses with neck dive." duh!

but IMO, let the manufacturers do what they do and let the individual player make the judgments about options, just like it is. for the player: live and learn...and modify when necessary. for the manufacturer: your prices are too high for axes that neck dive!

 

[SubHuman]

Um....
...not to argue, but, what's his hand doing there?

Evidently not fighting neck dive. His hand would be near the headstock if that was the case...No?

 

[FRoss6788]

No.

Could be anywhere on the neck

 

[FRoss6788]

Having had one of those on a strap before I'd put money on if he let go that headstock would make its way to the floor.

 

[micguy]

The problem iIf you want basses that are more balanced, something has to give. Either your costs go up, and/or you use less traditional designs, and/or you avoid lighter bodies.

With the tools we have today, you can design something, you can use the variable densities that bodies and necks will have (the maple used in necks is much more consistent than the woods used in bodies in density), and you can guarantee before you start building that they will all balance within acceptable limits. If you start with a design that wasn't done right (I'll just throw the word Thunderbird in here for no apparent reason ;-) ), and don't change anything, yes, you may have a problem, but that's not what I'm talking about.