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Need a loud amp that isn't big

#25
Just a guess, but by "half stack" and "stack" i assume you mean one or two 4x10 cabs or something similar. FWIW, terms like stack and half stack are pretty ambiguous in the world of bass, whereas in the world of guitar everyone understands you mean 1 or 2 Marshall (or clone) 4x12" cabs.

Just how loud is loud? If you want to get really really loud small may not cut it. Come to think of it, who's really going to stay to watch your band at that volume? Consider bringing it down a notch or 2. :eek:

For cutting through in a metal setting all that you may need is some EQ. Go put on a pantera/metal CD. The guitars have scooped mids and boosted highs and lows. To cut through, the bass has the lows cut (or at least not boosted), and often has a boost somewhere in the mids. Just leaving your lows flat or even cutting them a bit will allow you to turn up more. You may not like the resulting tone when you play by yourself, but when the entire band plays it works for metal.

If you do have to get a new rig, cabinets are going to give the most bang for the buck volume wise. Cabinets with high sensitivity ratings will be be much louder, and no matter how many watts you put into a cab with a low sensitivity rating, it's not going to cut it. You'll also get more dispersion stacking a bunch of smaller cabs vertically than from bigger cabs on the floor. If the cabs alone don't solve the issue take a look at some high wattage heads and/or poweramps. Some are louder than others, old trace elliot heads and the aguilar 750 are much louder IME than similarly rated heads.

as far as "grit" unless you go with an all tube head like an old SVT, that tone will be a function of your preamp, EQ settings, and outboard overdrive/fuzz type units. Likewise some basses have more of "that sound" and even something as simple as brand new stainless steel strings with a bit of high mid bump can be all the Dr. ordered.
 
#26
A Yorkville XS800H on top of a 4 ohm Avatar B410Neo is light (26 lbs for the head, 65 for the cab), extremely portable, compact, reasonably priced (about $1100.00 shipped, depending on where you buy) and can level a house. The built-in tube drive is a nice feature since you say you are looking for 'grit.' You also get a built in compressor with that.

Your band will hate you for having a rig that loud, but I think it will fit your needs quite well. :D
 
#27
I like the Schroeder 1210/1212 pair with the Stewart 1.2 amp and a preamp of some sort. Huge Power, great tone from the Schroeders and excellent deal. Hell, I played Alpine Valley Music Theatre with my Schroeder Mini-12 and 1212 and a SWR Bass 750. The Stewart and Schroeders would certainly do any job and they are very light.
 
#30
how about a mesa buster tube combo ?(if you can find it anywhere)- its heavy but small - sounds incredible. You can grit it up by turning the gain up to 11!

Might need to add a cheeky 115 or 118 - but that can be light if need be.

Or an Ampeg portaflex - they don't look very robust but i hear they sound great.
 
#32
The Metal Guy said:
I'm looking at some Ampegs, but I'm worried about the sheer size of their rigs and how I'm gonna move them around.
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Okay....it sounds like perhaps a SVT4Pro and either a SVT6X10 or 8X10 (for the sheer "loudness").

I currently use the 4Pro and the 6X10Hlf. We play a LOT of outside shows and festivals and I PROMISE you....you WILL be heard. There is a cavaet to this, however,

They are a BEAR to move around. By the time you put the 4Pro in a rack with say, a tuner and a power conditioner (at the least) you're looking at roughly 60+ pounds for that alone.

Add another 125-155 for the 6x10 or 8x10 respectively, and there you go. Having said this, please take into account that I am 58 years old and (with a little help from my friends....to wax philosophic) I have little trouble. If you are relatively "young", you'll get by

Good luck!

O-<
 
#33
The Metal Guy said:
I'm looking at some Ampegs, but I'm worried about the sheer size of their rigs and how I'm gonna move them around.
Click to expand...

They are not too difficult to move around - I would suggest getting into the weight room if you are freaked out by the weight and the luggin' around. I loaded and unloaded an 810e by myself without too much difficulty.

If you want that Rex Brown crunchy distortion sound of Cowboys - I suggest going for a really good guitar distortion pre-amp/pedal. Rex has em[ployed the Tech 21 PSA-1 and the Rocktron Vodoo Valve Pre-amp on later albums, but these items would get the distoted tone you are looking for. A cheaper alternative and something I like working with - Tech 21 XXL Bass Edition, grindy, fuzzy, and crunchy at the same time. He did use a 4 PRO with Pro series 810 cabs, but he had two full rigs on at once - one for distortion and one for his clean tone. To get Rex's tone in one speaker (distortion plus clean tone), try the Radial Big Shot Mix Pedal - it allows you to mix that distorted tone with your bass's clean tone so you can send your amp two signals straight to the amp input. Makes life easier! I use it all the time and I do not lose definition or low end when I employ my Big Shot, my Tech 21 XXL Bass Ed pedal, and my bass.

I have heard Rex's tone is like a "W" on a Graphic EQ. lows in the 30-80hz range are present, low mids 150hz-300hz are cut a little or flat, 550hz-900hz is boosted heavily, 1khz - 3khz is about flat, 4khz - 8khz are boosted for definition.

If you really want hear yourself in practice without going a super big rig, go for one Eden cab - 410XLT. That cab projects like none other! It will make ANY Ampeg cabinet seem like garbage in terms of volume and tone. I power it with a Trace head (600 watts max out of it) (check my sig) - I crush two guitarists, drummer and a singer (guitarist's: one has 120 watt tube amp, the other has a 60 watt tube amp, two JBL EON speakers for singer). Keep in mind that I keep the mids flat (500hz-900hz) when I blast over the band - it just works. I would not suggest an Ampeg if you want to go small - I am dead serious here: 2 SVT 410HLF's do not project tone and volume like ONE Eden 410XLT. In a nut shell, one Eden 410XLT can kill 2 SVT 410HLF's - no contest! I have done the side by side comparison - Eden just kills. So if you go Eden, all you need is one 410 from Eden to kick ass in band practice. With Ampeg, you would certainly need two speakers to compete volume wise.

Good Luck to you.
 
#35
RandallFlagg said:
Okay....it sounds like perhaps a SVT4Pro and either a SVT6X10 or 8X10 (for the sheer "loudness").

I currently use the 4Pro and the 6X10Hlf. We play a LOT of outside shows and festivals and I PROMISE you....you WILL be heard. There is a cavaet to this, however,

They are a BEAR to move around. By the time you put the 4Pro in a rack with say, a tuner and a power conditioner (at the least) you're looking at roughly 60+ pounds for that alone.

Add another 125-155 for the 6x10 or 8x10 respectively, and there you go. Having said this, please take into account that I am 58 years old and (with a little help from my friends....to wax philosophic) I have little trouble. If you are relatively "young", you'll get by

Good luck!

O-<
Click to expand...

Yeah I'm like 13 so I'm pretty sure I should just stop being a sissy, roll up my sleeves and carry the stuff. Getting people to help me carry it should be no problem, I mean what's the drummer for, right? :smug:

If I were to get the SVT 4 pro, I'd have to order it. Is it worth going for the amp even though I don't get to try it? Ampeg have a good reputation but I'm a little warry of buying stuff without getting to try it first.

For the cab I'm thinking of getting an 8x10, but I dunno if some other kind of cab would be better suited to the sound I want.

BTW, is your screenname from the character in the Stephen King book The Last Stand?
 
#36
The Metal Guy said:
Yeah I'm like 13
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I wish I had a budget of "multi thousands" when I was 13. :smug:
If that is truly your budget, you have a lot of options. You can do light and loud AND get the sound you want. I'd do A LOT of reading in these forums, and TAKE YOUR TIME deciding on what's best. Dont' let that $ burn a hole in your pocket and buy something you're not going to be happy with down the road. Good Luck!
 
#37
how about a Basson cab. thier 4x10 handles 1000WRMS so you can be loud get a prety big sound and not have to carry around as much. it still would not be the full on 8x10 sound but it would probably be second best (okay 3rd best to a 6x10). it is decently portable with a Huge sound and lots of power.

then find you nice high powerd head. the ampeg B4R is a good option. so is the SVT 4 and SVT 6 pro. a GK 2001 RB is also good and a fender pro 1200 is a very nice setup as well. just go with the basson cab and try our various amps to go with it.
 
#38
If you're really 13 and your budget is 2k-3k, it's obviously not your own money you're spending, tell your dad to register and log on here and get some opinions from some other bass playing dads as far as whats best for you. There are custom cab builders who can do something specific to your needs, you can have a quite loud and still fairly small bass rig that would be metal specific as you'd be giving up the low end, your guitar players have their 80-100hz bass knobs cranked you know. That would leave you having exactly what you didn't want for playing any other type of music. Or you could have a good, fairly even throughout the spectrum sounding cab and get a head or power/pre set-up that had a good compressor and versatile EQ options and then you could sit down and learn how to use them. Anyway, learn what you're getting into and don't go out and spend the money tomorrow just because it's there.



Beware the salesman, for they slither at the depths of humanity.....
 
#39
will33 said:
If you're really 13 and your budget is 2k-3k, it's obviously not your own money you're spending, tell your dad to register and log on here and get some opinions from some other bass playing dads as far as whats best for you. There are custom cab builders who can do something specific to your needs, you can have a quite loud and still fairly small bass rig that would be metal specific as you'd be giving up the low end, your guitar players have their 80-100hz bass knobs cranked you know. That would leave you having exactly what you didn't want for playing any other type of music. Or you could have a good, fairly even throughout the spectrum sounding cab and get a head or power/pre set-up that had a good compressor and versatile EQ options and then you could sit down and learn how to use them. Anyway, learn what you're getting into and don't go out and spend the money tomorrow just because it's there.
Click to expand...


I tend to agree with this sentiment. First, if you are actually 13 where the heck do you get your money!?!?!? And, secondly, there is NEVER a rush. As others have stated...take your time....if, in reality, you have that kind of money to burn...you can choose from a myriad of different combinations..but YOU choose! Don't take anyone's advice here as gospel. These different suggestions are from both THEIR experiences, as well as mine. Again, what works for me - may or may not work for you.


And, yes....Randall Flagg is, indeed, a character in a Stephen King novel entitled "The Stand" which, again, begs the question: "What the heck is a 13 year old doing reading something so.....dark"??????
 
#40
You'd be amazed what kids are into nowdays, what was rebellious and deviant is now goofy and old-fashioned. Everything is more to the extreme and more sick than it ever was (I understand the word "sick" is used as somewhat of a positive now, I use it in the classical sense, like something is wrong with you, if not physically then mentally) and I'm only 35 and I don't have children of my own, imagine what real parents must think.
 

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