500w should be more than enough. Especially when you have FOH. At one point I worried about the same thing. The 500w head I have has never had an issue being heard.
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Need amp help. How many watts do you guys gig with?
- Thread starter squeally dan
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I agree from what I think might be a slightly different angle...I saw the light bulb remark as completely apt in that it's correct that "wattage is not a measure of loudness"...if wattage were a measure of loudness, anything expressed in watts would involve sound; that's not the case. IMO, light is an excellent analogous stand-in for sound.
That isn't to say that with regard to sound, wattage can't tell you anything about relative loudness within a given system...it's part of the math that can explain those relationships in pretty thorough detail. And wattage can tell you less with precision about relative differences between different systems...get you in the ballpark. It cannot tell you in detail or with precision about the relative loudness differences between two systems without regard to other differences and/or similarities between the two.
And this is the same as wattage not being a measure of how bright a light appears. Just as loudness is "the perceived magnitude of the auditory sensation of sound waves ordered from quiet to loud" and is impacted by a number of factors but primarily amplitude of the wave, of which wattage is a direct correlate, brightness is "the perceived magnitude of the visual sensation of light waves ordered from dim to bright" and is impacted by a number of factors but primarily amplitude of the wave, of which wattage is a direct correlate.
There are also similarities in how conceptually similar and related terms are treated as interchangeable. For example, just as loudness is perceived and sound pressure is measured (and are not precisely the same thing), brightness is perceived and luminance is measured (and are not precisely the same thing). But in thinking and speaking about the concepts, we tend to have difficultly separating them...like being unable to define a word without using that word..."Well, brightness is perceived brightness, and luminance is measured brightness." Errr...not exactly.
This is how threads like this one can go sometimes for hundreds of replies with maybe one or two people pointing out (and being largely ignored) that almost no one can tell you exactly "how many watts they use." Almost everyone is speaking of the maximum rated output of their amps, which would have to be completely accurate as published and require precisely the same input gain as when tested to be achieved in regular use. As a practical matter, virtually everyone is "using" something less than the maximum rated wattage of their amp, and it's probably going to be significantly less than most people would estimate (because the vast majority of us do not have experience listening to and comparing known wattage output).
And yes, I realize that responses like this are why I'm not well like by many people here
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Agreed. With my previous band I went ampless. Current band, it’s my stage monitor.
I currently run a Markbass Tube 800 through an 8 ohm Fender 4x10 and it's super strong and punchy, not unlike the GK Fusion 800 I used to run through this same cabinet. My guess - it's getting a clean 400 watts through it, and can't imagine a playing situation where more stage volume would be required. Adding more cabinets and pushing these amps at 4 ohms seems to sound loud and boomy to me, not necessarily better. I like the rich low end in this configuration, knowing the amp has the headroom to do a lot more.
You might want to read the survey thread in my sig. Nothing to add really that hasn't been said.
Well... LOL
Lumens is the measure of light output. Watts, just the electrical power taken by the bulb.
120W incandescent bulb putting out 1000 lumens does put out less light than an 30W LED array putting out 3400 lumens.
"More watts meaning more light" is only true if the bulbs have the same lumen/watt ratio.
Different bulb technologies, and different bulbs within a technology, have different lumen/watt ratios.
back to our regular programming...
- Sep 4, 2010
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I gig with a 600w Acoustic Image or a 45w Quilter Interbass, which i sometime use as a preamp (effects send out, just the pre) into the AI (effects send in, so just poweramp)
How loud i want to be, or what sonic spectrum i look for in the musical situation I am in depends on the cabs first and foremost; for high efficiency rock stuff i have a pair of Sinobas 1X12s; or a pair of Trace Elliott 1x8s. For the deepest bass and cleanest tone an ACEME 2x10; a Acoustic Image Doubleshot if i need to keep it really portable and want to be kinda acoustic sounding. All these options take 600W at 4 Ohms without a problem.
Poke fun all you will at a Quilter Interbass with a Doubleshot at a combined 14lbs fitting in Tom tom bag, but when you have to do a gig on an island that you only can get to on foot by taking a ferry, and then need to walk a half mile with also your bass and pedals to the performance space, you will have the last laugh-and sound good.
Don't get hung up on poweramp wattage. What your speakers can do (efficiency), how much your preamp pushes, is way more important.
How loud i want to be, or what sonic spectrum i look for in the musical situation I am in depends on the cabs first and foremost; for high efficiency rock stuff i have a pair of Sinobas 1X12s; or a pair of Trace Elliott 1x8s. For the deepest bass and cleanest tone an ACEME 2x10; a Acoustic Image Doubleshot if i need to keep it really portable and want to be kinda acoustic sounding. All these options take 600W at 4 Ohms without a problem.
Poke fun all you will at a Quilter Interbass with a Doubleshot at a combined 14lbs fitting in Tom tom bag, but when you have to do a gig on an island that you only can get to on foot by taking a ferry, and then need to walk a half mile with also your bass and pedals to the performance space, you will have the last laugh-and sound good.
Don't get hung up on poweramp wattage. What your speakers can do (efficiency), how much your preamp pushes, is way more important.
500 watts with a reasonably efficient speaker cabinet should cover most everything short of heavy metal or hard rock played in a big venue situation. *
* Even then ... large venues typically provide adequate sound reinforcement for the room which will enable you to get the SPL you need from the PA system.
if your concern is stage volume, watts are less important than speaker-cone area and speaker-cab efficiency. 500W is plenty--assuming you're running it at 4 ohms and your cabs are efficient (they make more dBs out of the same watts).
280 watts (GK 400RB-IV into a 4 ohm Avatar 2x10. If that's not loud enough, there needs to be PA support!
There are so many variables. Right now I gig with a GK MB500 and either one or two 112 cabs. In one band, I'm generally not in the PA so watts matter. In the other, I'm always in the PA, so the amp is just a monitor and I run very little stage volume
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I use a Ashdown 12 Band 600 which is 600w @ 4ohm and 300w @8ohm. It is more than plenty! And just because I love super powerful amps and lots of headroom I usually stick around 800w. But this amp is so clean and crisp you really dont need it. And when/if I ever need to I can slave two together and run 1200 watts which is an insanely powerful amp! I recomend stick with 400w and up for giging, you need lots of clean headroom! Or if drive is your thing mabye go for a lower wattage with some valves.
You're my people.
I should have been more specific. WITHIN THE SAME LINE of "bulbs" (actually "lamps" if we're getting very technical), more watts means more light.
Note packaging for medium-base LED bulbs. They even say "60W replacement". They're certainly not talking about power consumption. They're talking about light output of a "typical" 60W bulb.
All THAT said, I love semantics, and I'm also an electrician who currently does electronic repairs. So I can verify all of your points are correct.
Just about every gig I've done in the last twenty years, from small clubs to arena shows, has been done with a 310 watt Ampeg B5R amp. Additional volume is accomplished by using cabinets with more speakers. From a 2x10 Ampeg cab to a 6x10 Mesa cab.
