New Acoustic Image heads

[::::BASSIST::::]

Thanks guys. i have fiddled with this before. Rick Jones at ai said i should decrease the sa focus power and use more from the sansamp. he said this will decrease noise. however, i will try your suggestion of maxing the sa focus and reducing the sansamp.

and yes the sa focus only has one knob = level.

 

[wateroftyne]

'If you want to get max gain from the SA, turn its volume all the way up (if your EBG is passive, I'd turn it all the way up as well) and set the final volume at the SansAmp.'

This is back-to-front, isn't it? The stronger & cleaner the signal coming out of the Sansamp, the better. If you max the Focus, you'll have to turn the Sansamp down, introducing noise...

Vegan - are you powering your Sansamp using the phantom power?

 

[John D Harris]

'If you want to get max gain from the SA, turn its volume all the way up (if your EBG is passive, I'd turn it all the way up as well) and set the final volume at the SansAmp.'

This is back-to-front, isn't it? The stronger & cleaner the signal coming out of the Sansamp, the better. If you max the Focus, you'll have to turn the Sansamp down, introducing noise...

Vegan - are you powering your Sansamp using the phantom power?

This topic has gone round & round on talkbass.

That is why I added the caveat regarding noise.

Pretty much each different system will have different levels of noise -- some very low (not noticeable) & others very noticeable.
With some elements of a bass system, you will get noticeable noise, with others not (sometimes even different units of the same model from the same manufacturer) -- it all depends on the particular pieces of his system and what the user perceives as 'acceptable' level of noise.

 

[Esquillama]

'If you want to get max gain from the SA, turn its volume all the way up (if your EBG is passive, I'd turn it all the way up as well) and set the final volume at the SansAmp.'

This is back-to-front, isn't it? The stronger & cleaner the signal coming out of the Sansamp, the better. If you max the Focus, you'll have to turn the Sansamp down, introducing noise...

Vegan - are you powering your Sansamp using the phantom power?

I've always understood it that you want your final volume
to be the loudest, and your earlier volume to be at a lower
level. If you are sending an overdriven sound to your amp,
then that's what gets amplified.
At least that's the way I've always understood it.

 

[::::BASSIST::::]

My system is pretty simple. Passive bass > sansamp > sa focus > cab.

I use a rechargeable battery to power the sansamp.

When my new EMG actives arrive I am thinking of skipping the sansamp and going straight into the sa focus. wonder if that will work.

 

[Esquillama]

I also have a quick question.
Is the level control on the front of the SA
for output, or input?
I don't want to sound stupid, but I was curious if it was
for adjusting the incoming signal strength or the outgoing level?

 

[Esquillama]

My system is pretty simple. Passive bass > sansamp > sa focus > cab.

I use a rechargeable battery to power the sansamp.

When my new EMG actives arrive I am thinking of skipping the sansamp and going straight into the sa focus. wonder if that will work.

I've asked before, but do you have any pictures of your rig?

 

[wateroftyne]

'I've always understood it that you want your final volume
to be the loudest, and your earlier volume to be at a lower
level. If you are sending an overdriven sound to your amp,
then that's what gets amplified.'

That's right, but you need the output from the Sansamp to be the loudest possible before distortion. Setting the Focus's Output to max is going to restrict that.

'I use a rechargeable battery to power the sansamp.'

Don't! Use a short XLR lead, and use the Focus's phantom power instead. My Sansamp distorts too easily when I use a battery. Using mains / phantom power fixed it straight away.

When my new EMG actives arrive I am thinking of skipping the sansamp and going straight into the sa focus. wonder if that will work.

Yes, but the Focus's EQ is very subtle. If you like the sound of your bass that way, fine. If not, you have limited tweaking power. I like a warm old-school tone, so I use the Sansamp.

 

[wateroftyne]

I've just clicked that you're using the SA - duuurhh.

Ignore what I said about EQ.. it's even more limited!

Phantom power, too... forget that but use a mains supply for your Sansamp. The difference was night and day for me.

 

[Biker4Him]

I can run my Skjolds directly into the SA and still run either a mini12, a 1210, or even both at VERY loud volumes. This may be in part to the fairly hot output by the Skjold's preamp. However, running an outboard preamp does get me more volume. I have found that my mahogany bass with the SA, and the Schroeders tends to get a bit of an overdriven tone when everything is set flat.. I attribute this to everything I have leaning towards the lower mids. When I add a tube preamp... it's even more that way. However if I cut the lowest mids on the sweepable-mids Skjold preamp.. I get what is the cleanest purest tone, that is loud enough to rumble the entire city block. I feel just the opposite of what I read above.. the SA is probably understating it's power, not overstating it. MY old rack system was a Read Purity/Stewart 2.1/Schroeder cabs. The Purity was certainly the best preamp I have owned so far. It would obviously get a lot louder than my current setup. However... now I'm 50lbs lighter and much happier.

I'd say turn up the sansamp's gain until it starts to distort, then turn it back a hair... and use the SA's control (for those that asked.. it controls the output.. not the input) for volume.. you really shouldn't be fighting for more volume. Also, try cutting back the mids to see if it clears up your tone.

Of course... I may not have a clue what I'm talking about.. but it works well for me.

 

[John D Harris]

'I use a rechargeable battery to power the sansamp.'

Don't! Use a short XLR lead, and use the Focus's phantom power instead. My Sansamp distorts too easily when I use a battery. Using mains / phantom power fixed it straight away.

That's more than likely the major part of the problem.

I don't know if the SA has phantom power, but if it does, is it 9V?

[I thought phantom power was for condenser mics and is either 12V or 24V or 48V.]

When my new EMG actives arrive I am thinking of skipping the sansamp and going straight into the sa focus. wonder if that will work.

Yes, but the Focus's EQ is very subtle. If you like the sound of your bass that way, fine. If not, you have limited tweaking power. I like a warm old-school tone, so I use the Sansamp.

The SA has no EQ, but if he makes his bass active, most add EQ at the onboard preamp.

 

[Biker4Him]

No phantom power on the SA.

 

[::::BASSIST::::]

the million dollar question is...

do you guys think that Acoustic Image gives their amps a fair rating in terms of wattage when compared to other amp makers?

From what I have read on TB, Mesa and Eden are louder while some are quieter.

Where does AI fit into this?

 

[::::BASSIST::::]

You really think plugging into the wall instead of using a 9volt battery is going to make that much of a difference? I'm up for anything if it clears things up.

The reason I use a battery is to save weight on power cords, extension cords etc.

Regarding the pic.. dont have one. I will take one and pm you when I have uploaded it.

 

[::::BASSIST::::]

I can run my Skjolds directly into the SA and still run either a mini12, a 1210, or even both at VERY loud volumes. This may be in part to the fairly hot output by the Skjold's preamp. However, running an outboard preamp does get me more volume. I have found that my mahogany bass with the SA, and the Schroeders tends to get a bit of an overdriven tone when everything is set flat.. I attribute this to everything I have leaning towards the lower mids. When I add a tube preamp... it's even more that way. However if I cut the lowest mids on the sweepable-mids Skjold preamp.. I get what is the cleanest purest tone, that is loud enough to rumble the entire city block. I feel just the opposite of what I read above.. the SA is probably understating it's power, not overstating it. MY old rack system was a Read Purity/Stewart 2.1/Schroeder cabs. The Purity was certainly the best preamp I have owned so far. It would obviously get a lot louder than my current setup. However... now I'm 50lbs lighter and much happier.

I'd say turn up the sansamp's gain until it starts to distort, then turn it back a hair... and use the SA's control (for those that asked.. it controls the output.. not the input) for volume.. you really shouldn't be fighting for more volume. Also, try cutting back the mids to see if it clears up your tone.

Of course... I may not have a clue what I'm talking about.. but it works well for me.

This really gets my hopes up! If I get the power you are I will be very happy. What kind of outboard pre are you using when you use one? What kind of pre is in the bass?

 

[coldtrain]

I've got a sansamp on the way to boost my passive MIA jazz into a Focus SA, so I'll share my findings once I play out with it.

I also have the True-Voice pre which has more gain than anyone could every want. I've had the True-Voice/SA combo absolutely cranked into an Epi 110UL/112UL with no distortion. And that was outside in 98deg heat, where at the end of the show the SA was actually too hot to comfortably hold on to. It's a trooper.

 

[wateroftyne]

You really think plugging into the wall instead of using a 9volt battery is going to make that much of a difference? I'm up for anything if it clears things up.

Of course I can't guarantee it, but I do know that my Sansamp used to have tiny headroom before distorting, even with a high-quality battery. As soon as I ran it via a power supply (and phantom power, as it is now), the problems disappeared.

I would borrow a P/S and give it a go.

 

[John D Harris]

You really think plugging into the wall instead of using a 9volt battery is going to make that much of a difference? I'm up for anything if it clears things up.

Of course I can't guarantee it, but I do know that my Sansamp used to have tiny headroom before distorting, even with a high-quality battery. As soon as I ran it via a power supply (and phantom power, as it is now), the problems disappeared.

I would borrow a P/S and give it a go.

Definitely worth giving it a try.

 

[Passinwind]

You really think plugging into the wall instead of using a 9volt battery is going to make that much of a difference? I'm up for anything if it clears things up.

Most common rechargeable "9 volt" batteries actually put out far less than the nominally rated 9 volts, even when fully charged. There are a few new ones that get a lot closer, but they are generally pretty expensive.

 

[KJung]

the million dollar question is...

do you guys think that Acoustic Image gives their amps a fair rating in terms of wattage when compared to other amp makers?

From what I have read on TB, Mesa and Eden are louder while some are quieter.

Where does AI fit into this?

Hoping I don't start a big ugly mess (again)..... I find that amps with switching power supplies like the AI and WW are not nearly as loud as similarly rated traditional linear power supply amps (not talking about switching power supplies in general... etc. etc.... just talking about these two... the WW and the AI). The AI Focus (600 watts into 4ohms) and WW Ultra (1200 watts into 4ohms) are plenty loud and sound wonderful.... but if you put the WW side by side with a 50 pound, high quality stereo power amp that is 1200 watts bridged.... or even an Eden 800 or other high quality, high wattage amp with a big old transformer, you will hear a fuller, meatier, fatter low end.

I find, for aggressive electric bass playing (slapping, round wound strings, active bass, etc., etc.) the 500 watt Thunderfunk can get significantly louder and punchier in the under 100hz region than the AI Focus at 600 watts.

However... give these switching power supply amps a break .... the Focus is 4 pounds for gosh sake... it sounds AMAZING for a 4 pound amp.... and WW 1200 watts in 7 pounds and the size of a cigar box... again, amazing.... but it's not going to put out as much booty as the 60 pound AG750, even though it has 'more watts'.