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New Year's Eve show disappointment

I'm posting this in miscellaneous because it seems to concern matters that would fit multiple forum topics and not just one...

Anyway, this isn't about anything really important...

I'm not one for participating in big public holidays, especially ones where large numbers of annoying drunken people are likely to be involved, but over the past several years I've actually had pleasant NYE experiences that were live shows, often @ a place like a VFW hall rather than a standard venue, involving bands that played music people typically will swing dance to. I'm not a dancer myself at all, but I am a huge fan of old-school big band-style swing music, western swing, rockabilly, etc. and the shows I've attended on past New Year's Eves have been very fun... great music, non-annoying crowds, lots of good vibes, sometimes potlucks, etc. Tonight there were a good handful of such events within reasonable distance of home, but the one I chose was one that was announced first, several weeks back... Very reasonable cover charge (especially for early ticket buyers), 20 minute drive from home, a venue I've seen plenty of good similar live acts at before, a band I've seen before and super enjoyed... like what could go wrong??

So I get to the venue almost 15 min. late (i.e., 15 min. after announced band start time), get a good parking spot, but I see that the band is still setting up onstage, so I count myself fortunate to not have missed any of their set. But then I see it --the dreaded headstock of a bass guitar, a solidbody no less...

Now these small swing ensembles are known to have revolving lineups around a core of one or a couple permanent members, and when I've seen this band in the past (and in all videos I've seen of this band), they had an upright bassist. I don't know if their usual current bassist had a prior engagement, or if this was their current upright bassist but whose double bass was currently in the shop, or whatever. But my heart sank and I prepared for the worst, although i still had hope...

Now I play bass guitar and have absolutely nothing against them in particular, but for this style of music (mostly unamplified small band 1930's-style swing, played relatively quietly), a double bass is definitely par for the course. But I am not a gear snob -- I know that it is certainly possible to get a passable bass sound for traditional swing music out of a bass guitar... I don't really care much about the gear used in any context; if a good result can be achieved, that's really all that matters to me. But to get that passable result in this specific situation, certain measures must be taken to ensure that the result occurs --- measures involving string choice, playing technique, tailoring amplifier settings to dial in a suitable tone, fitting the bass sound into the overall band mix, etc. Otherwise, the result will be something that sounds very wrong, if not terrible.

Of course, since I am making this post, you can pretty much guess how it sounded.

I could only endure about two and a half songs before I had to leave. For this style of music, the bass sound is SO vital to making the music sound right overall. It needs to have that pulse, that beat that moves the music and fits in with the drums and the rest of the band. This night, it did not, at all. But it didn't have to be that way, even with a bass guitar. I was willing to give it a chance, and I was certainly hopeful that they would make an effort to make it sound passably OK, given the circumstances... I really wanted them to sound good, as they've sounded fantastic in the past, and I've enjoyed many similar bands at this particular venue before... But in the end, it just sounded like caca, and I had to flee and head home early (my budget for the night was already spent, so no alternative event for me).

Anyway, that's enough of my lamentation... I just wanted to vent, as I was really looking forward for the past few weeks to hearing amazing live music tonight, like at other NYE events of recent years. Tomorrow I will try to find a place that's open for dim sum as consolation...
 
Remember, you are a musician. I doubt 99.3% of those there were are detail oriented, and noticed. There are very few bands around now that play that kind of music, because it's almost impossible to book these kind of gigs the other 364 days a year (having played jazz the past decade-plus, I'm quite aware how difficult it is to get gigs that pay decent, other than dinner music and some low paying trio gigs). Also a LOT fewer people playing upright.

My guess it was a group of musicians who play some jazz, and realizing the potential for NYE, put this together for this gig. You want jazz with an upright, find a jazz club, or your local university. Otherwise, relax and go with the flow.
 
Remember, you are a musician. I doubt 99.3% of those there were are detail oriented, and noticed. There are very few bands around now that play that kind of music, because it's almost impossible to book these kind of gigs the other 364 days a year (having played jazz the past decade-plus, I'm quite aware how difficult it is to get gigs that pay decent, other than dinner music and some low paying trio gigs). Also a LOT fewer people playing upright.

My guess it was a group of musicians who play some jazz, and realizing the potential for NYE, put this together for this gig. You want jazz with an upright, find a jazz club, or your local university. Otherwise, relax and go with the flow.
Yup.
I owned an upright for 20 years and refused to gig with it. My stock answer was "this thing weighs almost 40 lbs IN THE BAG and takes up 2/3 of the cargo space in my car. $500 prepaid, or deal with a fretless.".
 
Was the guitarist using a non-cutaway archtop with a low wattage tube amp? :D

As someone who plays that style of music it's always a bit of give and take when it comes to being period accurate with instrumentation. Personally I would never take an electric bass to a gig like that but I can think of many reasons why someone would. I'd also add that this is one of those niches where the audience actually does often notice the difference whether they consciously realize it or not. Having an upright onstage really does kind of set the mood for what the audience should expect.
 
I wish I could have left my gig. I had to endure an extremely loud guitar player who played nothing correctly. Was basically freestyling the entire night! Also had to endure subpar sound. Kick drum mic was causing a horrible stage hum and kept coming out of the kick hole. I yelled at the sound guy to just turn it down. Couldn't hear the sax and barely heard the singers! Couldn't wait to get home and wait for my ears to get back to normal!


Happy New Year!!
 
For the last ten years, I've been the staff photographer for the Los Angeles Lawyers Philharmonic and Big Band of Barristers. The bass player in the Big Band was excellent and used a double bass, but his firm relocated him to New York. The replacement bass player uses a solid body electric bass, which was not to the liking of my friend the founder and conductor, but with the difficulty of finding someone in the legal profession who plays bass well, he lives with it.

I play bass uke with a ukulele group of about 30 regulars, using a RondoMusic Hadean violin/Hofner style archtop hollow body with piezo active preamp and flatwound strings. I have them modified by Eric's Guitar, replacing the wonky floating bridge with an all metal fully adjustable bridge that has a piezo pickup in each of the four saddles, and painted by Pat Wilkins.

My group plays a few straight ahead jazz songs for which I do jazz walking bass, using either a Phil Jones Double Four or Carvin MB15 amp. I have to say, it sounds very good even though it's not a big, heavy, cumbersome double bass. To make the bass look more like a double, I had Pat add a wood veneer and I added fake stick-on ƒ holes.

Veneer cherry ƒ 1024.jpeg
 
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OP, I believe the problem was in YOUR world, not anyone else's. I will admit that I have acted similar to this at other shows, however, I have learned that you need to give bands a chance. Take a band for how they sound that night or you will rarely find something that meets your expectations. Your current attitude will make it hard to enjoy things in life; please don't do that to yourself.
 
I'm posting this in miscellaneous because it seems to concern matters that would fit multiple forum topics and not just one...

Anyway, this isn't about anything really important...

I'm not one for participating in big public holidays, especially ones where large numbers of annoying drunken people are likely to be involved, but over the past several years I've actually had pleasant NYE experiences that were live shows, often @ a place like a VFW hall rather than a standard venue, involving bands that played music people typically will swing dance to. I'm not a dancer myself at all, but I am a huge fan of old-school big band-style swing music, western swing, rockabilly, etc. and the shows I've attended on past New Year's Eves have been very fun... great music, non-annoying crowds, lots of good vibes, sometimes potlucks, etc. Tonight there were a good handful of such events within reasonable distance of home, but the one I chose was one that was announced first, several weeks back... Very reasonable cover charge (especially for early ticket buyers), 20 minute drive from home, a venue I've seen plenty of good similar live acts at before, a band I've seen before and super enjoyed... like what could go wrong??

So I get to the venue almost 15 min. late (i.e., 15 min. after announced band start time), get a good parking spot, but I see that the band is still setting up onstage, so I count myself fortunate to not have missed any of their set. But then I see it --the dreaded headstock of a bass guitar, a solidbody no less...

Now these small swing ensembles are known to have revolving lineups around a core of one or a couple permanent members, and when I've seen this band in the past (and in all videos I've seen of this band), they had an upright bassist. I don't know if their usual current bassist had a prior engagement, or if this was their current upright bassist but whose double bass was currently in the shop, or whatever. But my heart sank and I prepared for the worst, although i still had hope...

Now I play bass guitar and have absolutely nothing against them in particular, but for this style of music (mostly unamplified small band 1930's-style swing, played relatively quietly), a double bass is definitely par for the course. But I am not a gear snob -- I know that it is certainly possible to get a passable bass sound for traditional swing music out of a bass guitar... I don't really care much about the gear used in any context; if a good result can be achieved, that's really all that matters to me. But to get that passable result in this specific situation, certain measures must be taken to ensure that the result occurs --- measures involving string choice, playing technique, tailoring amplifier settings to dial in a suitable tone, fitting the bass sound into the overall band mix, etc. Otherwise, the result will be something that sounds very wrong, if not terrible.

Of course, since I am making this post, you can pretty much guess how it sounded.

I could only endure about two and a half songs before I had to leave. For this style of music, the bass sound is SO vital to making the music sound right overall. It needs to have that pulse, that beat that moves the music and fits in with the drums and the rest of the band. This night, it did not, at all. But it didn't have to be that way, even with a bass guitar. I was willing to give it a chance, and I was certainly hopeful that they would make an effort to make it sound passably OK, given the circumstances... I really wanted them to sound good, as they've sounded fantastic in the past, and I've enjoyed many similar bands at this particular venue before... But in the end, it just sounded like caca, and I had to flee and head home early (my budget for the night was already spent, so no alternative event for me).

Anyway, that's enough of my lamentation... I just wanted to vent, as I was really looking forward for the past few weeks to hearing amazing live music tonight, like at other NYE events of recent years. Tomorrow I will try to find a place that's open for dim sum as consolation...
So why not confront the person directly and even if it turns out crappy you could have motivated them to actually do something to improve their sound. But instead you come here and share it with a whole load of people who will make no direct difference to that musicians sound. I want to refrain from sharing my personal feelings as to what I feel about people who feel the need to bash others sound as a form of low key ego massage. Im sure that person went home not giving a hoot about it, and the astute mind which could have helped him lacked the courage to communicate his insight.
 
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The live NYE band I heard was good enough, better than most except; the drummer, who had skill, was hitting the snare too damn loud. Obviously, this player had tech training and scribbled endless grace notes in simple enough songs like Miss You, also doubling the bass drum instead of the basic 1-3 disco-beat. It messed w/the bassist trying to replicate the Billy Preston bass line which IS the song's hook. Hardly the only offense but, to add further, an older lady was invited up to play one song on the drums & suddenly, the band had a mix not wrecked by dug-in snare hammerin' zealotry.

She also banged out a decent drum solo which after she stepped down, only brought forth heightened peacocking from the original loud drummer.

With such a loud snare, it simply crowded out decent to very good vocals, keys, guitar & bass playing.

[/Grunt]

If doing big band classics on an electric bass, with all other elements being played in the classic sense, it would behoove many to allow for a quicker decay of the bass notes by either mutes or damping, unless playing a fretless. Otherwise, electric fretted basses have too much noticeable sustain that changes the classic feel. Any 1/2-decent player would pick up on this.
 
So why not confront the person directly

But why would one think one has any business "confronting" somebody about this at all? What do you think "confrontation" would accomplish? The gig is already happening, what's the player going to do, go out and buy an upright on the spot? And who says the player wants, needs, or would even welcome your "help"?

IMO there was nothing wrong with what the OP did: gave the performance a shot, wasn't into it, and took off. OP had no obligation to do anything else, nor was there really anything else worth doing.
 
I'm not gonna disagree...an electric bass in more traditional swing contexts is never great to me, hence why i never opt to bring my electric to a swing gig and always bring my upright. It's the wrong instrument for the job. My guess is that this band couldn't find an upright player as NYE is a super busy night. I had two gigs myself yesterday, steakhouse for brunch and country club in the evening. Wish you could had come, all swing baby! But alas on the east coast...so a whole country between us.

To those defending the use of an electric bass, i see your point, but we have to at least agree it is way below ideal. The sound is not right, and the look is not right. It's passable at best, and to me should only be done out of necessity for a swing band. If you were the BL for a swing band, your bass chair list would have the electric players below all the upright players with "use only in emergencies" next to their name.
 
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So why not confront the person directly and even if it turns out crappy you could have motivated them to actually do something to improve their sound. But instead you come here and share it with a whole load of people who will make no direct difference to that musicians sound. I want to refrain from sharing my personal feelings as to what I feel about people who feel the need to bash others sound as a form of low key ego massage. Im sure that person went home not giving a hoot about it, and the astute mind which could have helped him lacked the courage to communicate his insight.

Most folks don't want to hear some self-appointed expert's opinions during a gig. There could be any number of reason why they went with an EB over a DB. As I said before, if the audience is happy, then they are getting the job done as best they can.
 
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So, the sound of the bass guitar ruined your night? Were there no other redeeming qualities of the band? Did they play too loud? Did they have a sound tech or were they doing it from the stage? Did they at least demonstrate competent musicianship? Or was it the sound of the whole band?

I get it, it wasn't your thing. But, you didn't really describe what was wrong other than saying it sounded bad, hinting strongly that the bass and drums weren't sync'd up.

My impression is you wanted to see that double bass, and your disappointment clouded your mood and ruined your night.
 
I think it might be if one or more of the musicians has a feel/tone/skill-level/volume that is noticeably inappropriate to the group mission, it simply makes the whole band "not good". I wouldn't blame it on the instrument. I will agree however that the very presence of an upright bass often sets a psychological vibe that can be a really big deal in how the overall presentation is received by an audience. I played both DB and EB a dozen years for a BL who put a lot of stock in that theory. I do NOT however believe he was putting much mental energy into how the "bass tone" was being perceived by a few purists who might be in the crowd.
 
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