If your rig is too big you can always turn down... if too small you'll never get heard.
Rondo
Rondo
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Exactly.
Any PA that can make a kick drum louder than your amp can make your bass as loud as the kick drum.
It's interesting to hear the differences in house PA availability in different areas.
Around here, every club or bar that has live music more than once a week has a PA that is more than big enough for the room, and usually is way too big for the room.
And that's playing in everything from tiny coffee shops to high end clubs, dive bars, theaters, 2000 capacity dedicated music venues, etc.
The only places that don't come with built-in PA support are restaurants and private parties.
None of them have had decent monitors. Usually three or four random wedges, one mix, and no low end. Half the time they don't work, or only want to run vocals through the monitors.
I'd say no less than 500 watts in a 2x12 or 4x10
What is your guitarist using? That will give me an idea of the scope and seriousness of the situation.
I would not count on sound man or PA system to get that awesome in the room sound. 600-1000w solid through 8x10 or equivalent would be my go-to (I use 4x10 x2 as a modular). I like to have enough to drown out the guitarist if I have to. Something like one fridge per guitarist with 100-120w tube driven 4x12. You can make do with less but that is only if the guitarist is reasonable which I would not count on either.
There is something to be said about having sufficient presence in rehearsal. You dont want to be drowned out at every single practice (which is the risk of a 1x15 rig vs louder tube guitarists+ hard hitting drummer). Sometimes the only way to tame a guitarist is with br00t force and it is also one of the most enjoyable ways.
I would not count on sound man or PA system to get that awesome in the room sound. 600-1000w solid through 8x10 or equivalent would be my go-to (I use 4x10 x2 as a modular). I like to have enough to drown out the guitarist if I have to. Something like one fridge per guitarist with 100-120w tube driven 4x12. You can make do with less but that is only if the guitarist is reasonable which I would not count on either.
There is something to be said about having sufficient presence in rehearsal. You dont want to be drowned out at every single practice (which is the risk of a 1x15 rig vs louder tube guitarists+ hard hitting drummer). Sometimes the only way to tame a guitarist is with br00t force and it is also one of the most enjoyable ways.
Last edited:
500w head and two 2x10 cabs. One cab for smaller venue, two cabs for larger venues. Playing outside isnt always going to guarantee you a house PA. I'v played many outside bar and restaurant gigs over the years where 4x10 were a good way to move more air. Especially when a PA was not provided and there are no walls to reflect the sound back to the audience.
Being loud is not as much about power as speaker area (and excursion), so bring more drivers if you want to be loud. If you suspect your rig might have to fill a small room, I would recommend a ~500W (@4ohm) micro amp and a pair of good 2x10 or 2x12 cabs (so you can leave one home, if it's a small gig).
I might rather have 4-210s scattered all over the stage. I'm working on having 2-210s and using my 112 combo as my monitor.
Yeah, but it will get old REAL fast schlepping that thing around, trust me. However, I'll gladly play through a fridge if it's in the backline and I don't have to be responsible for it!
Wow, hundreds of people going to jump right in on this thread lol it all comes down to hearing yourself first, not all venues offer a PA system with floor monitors etc, how many watts is your Crate 15"? Usually an amp like that I'd set it up high and stand close to it so I could hear what I'm doing, those amps also usually have DI out so you can send a signal to the house PA, if your practice room is small just make sure your amp is up near head level, I'm assuming it's a 200w combo, even a 150w combo should be loud enough set up this way but obviously not if you're jumping around everywhere at the other end of the room ..... Lol
300-500 watts into a medium sized cab setup (410, 2x210, 212, 2x112, 2x115) will get ya by. Heavy enough to play without a PA, light enough to use as a monitor if you have PA support. Wont break the bank either
I've tried more configurations than I can remember, but these days I'm starting to think running two 1x12" cabs is the bees knees for anything except the "bigger" gigs(where you'll probably be using back line anyway)----you can have ease of transport and modular flexibility with your power. Two single 12" cabs stacked can be LOUD (given all the other factors of course--which amp, which cabs we're talking about, etc.). And 12"s are (or should be at least) punchy as heck, still with plenty of lows.
I'm using a lightweight kustom head rated at 500 watts, and I have a pair of 2x10 cabinets, each rated for 200 watts. The head says 500, but that's into a 4 ohm load. Into an 8 ohm load it'll top out at substantially less (I always figured a bit more than half the four ohm rating). With a single cabinet it handles a 100 seat club well, but we're doing r&b, nothing heavy. The higher power and two cabinet setup are for outdoor events where I expect PA, but need to be able to put a bottom under the stage sound.
Tube vs SS is a a big debate in and of itself. Especially when you start to factor in hybrid SS/Tube amps like those Orange Terror bass heads. Its all up to what you think sounds the best.
Maybe, if yours are loaded with Kappalite 3012s, or similar high-end drivers. A pair of decent 2x12" cabs is still going to move much more air. IME, a single 12" doesn't cut it for playing with a loud drummer, and it looks like OP is in the same boat. I do have a small 10" cab for the speaking volume gigs, though.
Since you mentioned Sleep, I recommend just getting an Ampeg SVT and 8x10 and being done with it.
Some else asked, but I'm going to repeat it.
What does your guitarist use and is there only one or are there two?
How hard does your drummer hit.
Getting passed one guitarist running a 50-100w tube head with a 4x12 isn't too hard. Getting around 2 of them running 2x 4x12 cabs can be hard.
If only there was a way to get that sound in a smaller package. I have to second the guys who said it's nice to play through someone else's/backline 8x10", but lugging around your own sucks
.Guitarists can be turned down, but there's no volume knob on the drummer. Mutes and drum screen only do so much. Besides, low stage volume is always desirable as long as you have decent PA support.
- Jul 7, 2010
- 3,383
- 2,311
- Disclosures
- Endorsing Artist for: Duncan Pickups; Line6, Hipshot, GHS Strings, Somnium Guitars
250-300 watts w/2 to 4 speakers would be a safe bet.....Look into a Carvin amp head if $ is issue....very good bang for your buck......just my 1-1/2 cent...
I might rather have 4-210s scattered all over the stage. I'm working on having 2-210s and using my 112 combo as my monitor.[/QUOTE]
... I think you lost me ..
... what is the objective behind having 210's spread out all over the stage? ...
... and, what are the couple 210s for if you are using your combo to hear yourself?
