You know how scary close you are in that assment? Have you ever been in a show where your 80/20 mix. 80% prerecorded tracks, 20% live mix. You can dance around and play in the key of Off and it's all okay! That gig pays!
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Nobody cares about your tone....
- Thread starter JSandbloom
- Start date
You know how scary close you are in that assment? Have you ever been in a show where your 80/20 mix. 80% prerecorded tracks, 20% live mix. You can dance around and play in the key of Off and it's all okay! That gig pays!
I've learned how many people appear to not have any professional pride. The day I start doing the minimum expected of me is the day I hang up my bass.
^ The guys saying that people care about bass tone and just don't know it are probably onto something.
I obsess over my tone mercilessly. Last time I recorded in the studio I took three basses and used about 7 different tone patches I'd worked on for months as we wrote the songs. I sound the exactly same on every song in the final product, so clearly the bandleader and producer had their own ideas about the bass tone and I didn't get a vote.
So, what I meant before was that as much as we care about our tone, other guys downstream can f**k it up anyway. I agree this is a non-issue in a no PA-support club though.
I obsess over my tone mercilessly. Last time I recorded in the studio I took three basses and used about 7 different tone patches I'd worked on for months as we wrote the songs. I sound the exactly same on every song in the final product, so clearly the bandleader and producer had their own ideas about the bass tone and I didn't get a vote.
So, what I meant before was that as much as we care about our tone, other guys downstream can f**k it up anyway. I agree this is a non-issue in a no PA-support club though.
Sure, some in the audience listen to the individual instruments... sometimes even bass! That said, most compliments I get are about my playing. Every so often I get an unsolicited compliment from a non-bassist about my tone, however it often comes when I'm running DI into FOH, so my amp rig isn't even part of the equation. OK, my bass is still part of the equation, but I'm convinced that my choice of bass and strings simply wouldn't matter: P-bass with flats, Ken Smith with rounds, a good soundman will make it fit nicely into the mix.
I choose my instruments for tone, but that's for my own benefit. IMO, the primary importance of the instrument is not its tone, but that it's a "groove delivery system". Meaning: if my hands are comfortable on the instrument, and it works properly (of course), then its tone barely matters. The Warwick Thumb isn't my thing, tone-wise, but if I find it comfortable, then I'll make music with it to the best of my ability. If I play well, then the band won't care about its tone, the audience won't care, even I won't care (much!) I played a Modulus Quantum at some country/blues gigs, and the only thing my bandmates commented on was its appearance (specifically, the trans green quilt top). I just made sure its tone wasn't too bright for the oldies we were playing.
An amp rig has to meet certain requirements, the biggest being that it can deliver the appropriate volume without unwanted distortion. I'm aware of bassists who look down their snoot at low to mid range gear like Ampeg and Carvin, but I use that kind of backline every so often at multi-band gigs and open mics, and I've rarely encountered an inadequate rig. OK, so I like my own rig better than the Hartke 4x10 provided at last Sunday's rehearsal, but that's simply personal preference. I could have used that Hartke for all of my gigs (except maybe the stupid loud ones), and it would have been fine, nobody would have complained. And it was certainly a lot cheaper than my boutique gear. Point being: I spend $$$$ on gear because I want to, not because I need to, and as the OP says, that's true for most of us. Exceptions would be guys with special needs, like Jauqo and his infrasonic basses.
That's why I wear a humerous Tshirt, nice jeans and cool shoes on every gig. At least I look like I'm the $h!t.
I was joking about the SansAmp, but in all seriousness, back when I was gigging a ton (roughly 1982-1999) I never used any DI gear. I had my amps and would sometimes mic them, but I kind of missed a lot of this technology.
Does anyone gig primarily using DI through PA/FOH? Is this a common thing?
Does anyone gig primarily using DI through PA/FOH? Is this a common thing?
Depends on the venue. When you get to medium to large clubs/casinos/ bigger stages they normally have a house system and a sound guy. They want to have complete sonic control over the sound coming out. Which they normally favor a DI (they don't like amp DI's) so mostly you sound is pre EQ. But sometimes you get a sweetheart and hey mix the mic on the cab with the DI signal. The PA reinforcement gives you a much more balanced FOH sound.
Yes, it's common. In 30+ years, I've learned that it's not a good idea to resist DI if that's what the soundman expects**. A bad soundman will mess up your tone regardless of what you give him, a good soundman can make you sound better through his PA than you do through your own rig.
I keep pretty busy on weekends, four+ different bands. 25% of the time I'm pre-EQ DI into FOH, 25% I'm mic'd, half the time my rig fills the room. Doesn't matter to me.
**If your band's overall tone depends on your bass with heavy FX, that's another story... never been true for me, though.
Thanks to sound techs beating us down and developing quite a resistance to micing cabs over the decades, yes it is a common thing. Micing has made a comeback in many circles, but there are still plenty of soundmen who didn't get the memo. My response to that was to get a big giant tube DI and add a pedal with a speaker sim built in, and now I am finally happy with using a DI line.
What's your chain look like Jim? Pedal after bass into amp? Using that new Ampeg pedal?
People actually do care about your tone, but they're not really aware of it.
Here's why:
if you have a stage sound where everyone's getting what they want and you're enjoying the hell out of your tone, you and your band plays better, you're all more comfortable, have more fun, and the audience does indeed see and feel that.
Here's why:
if you have a stage sound where everyone's getting what they want and you're enjoying the hell out of your tone, you and your band plays better, you're all more comfortable, have more fun, and the audience does indeed see and feel that.
BurningSkies
CRAZY BALDHEAD
- Feb 20, 2005
- 27,956
- 20,348
- Disclosures
- Endorsing artist: Dingwall Guitars
So, if you're not enthralled with your tone, you don't try to play well?
I've been noticing this comment over and over again.
I've been noticing this comment over and over again.
Right now it's a mess
I'm very much in flux now since getting the SCR-DI and a real pedalboard. But I'm using it at the end of my chain for speaker sim and mild overdrive. Before it I have a clean boost, an OC-2, and a couple different distortion pedals. Everything goes into the SCR-DI then out into the REDDI/amp. All one straight shot, no muss, no fuss...except deciding which of about 10 different distortion pedals I'm going to use
Nothing to do with trying to play well, but it's so much easier if you're not fighting a bad tone.
Ever had a night when things just don't sound right?
It's much more difficult to get the nuances right if you're not hearing what you're supposed to.
I think some of the opinions expressed here are based on what we consider tone. To me, tone is the combination of fretting, attack, feel, tempo, phrasing, ghost notes, slides, slurs, and other inflection tools, plus the instrument, the effects and DI or amplification equipment. It is what makes you different from another bass player playing the same line on their gear. That matters to me and to the audience. On the one hand, if you are limiting it to precision versus jazz, then yes, it matters very less. On the other hand, I find that the sound and response of the instrument affects how I approach playing greatly. This, in turn, affects how I use the other elements I listed earlier.
You can have a bad tone.
One day while experimenting with two amps, I had EQ'd one with too much of a particular mid freq on the para and after about 20 minutes I started getting a headache.
One day while experimenting with two amps, I had EQ'd one with too much of a particular mid freq on the para and after about 20 minutes I started getting a headache.
I've read all the way through this thread, and this comment makes the most sense to me. I have been gigging since the mid-sixties, and have learned that bass players are, basically, the fat cheerleaders on the bottom of the pyramid who hold it all together. Tone is important, but the groove rules.
And that's why I use a MicroBass II preamp... 1/4" to my amp and the sound engineer plugs into the post e.q. DI.
