Double Bass NS Design WAV4 megathread part I

[ziv]

Tinkering with the height of the bridge is easy, for example.

Thank you, that's an interesting information. I do setup my basses myself (but, of course, a luthier does a better job than myself) so if it's as easy as an EB, I may go to the cheapest way...

Do you find the WAV4 suitable for EUBs beginners (e.g. quite easy to play when coming from EB) ?

 

[cairomike]

Thank you, that's an interesting information. I do setup my basses myself (but, of course, a luthier does a better job than myself) so if it's as easy as an EB, I may go to the cheapest way...

Do you find the WAV4 suitable for EUBs beginners (e.g. quite easy to play when coming from EB) ?

Don't have any worries about being a beginner, the discreet dots on the finger board make it quite easy to get going. I've been playing EB for over 40 years, and never played an UB or fretless EB for that matter. I got my WAV4 just after Christmas and was able to perform with it in less than a month and finally gave up taking an EB to gigs about a month ago. In my experience it takes time to develop accurate intonation even with the help of the dots, and I'm still learning. You will find it necessary to play around with the EQ on your amp and a change from the stock strings to 'real' DB strings makes a BIG difference with approximating a 'acoustic like' sound. But... don't expect it to sound like an acoustic, it never will, it has it's own sound something between a fretless EB and a 'real' UB.

 

[ziv]

don't expect it to sound like an acoustic, it never will, it has it's own sound something between a fretless EB and a 'real' UB.

That's quite obvious to me, in the same way that an entry-level Cort won't sound like a Musicman...

 

[cairomike]

That's quite obvious to me, in the same way that an entry-level Cort won't sound like a Musicman...

Quite right. But there has been much discussion about how to make it sound more like an acoustic. I've always taken the view that it is what it is, don't expect it to be something it's not. There are two settings on the pickup, Pizz and Arco. Some people prefer to play with fingers in the Arco mode, this does give a very 'thuddy' sound, but for me it just doesn't have the sustain I want. It's personal preference.

 

[Murf]

Hi, I'm new to this forum. I have been playing EB for 5/6 years now (fretted and fretless) and I would like to try EUB (acoustic uprights are just too big). The WAV4 seems to be a good instrument for that. I'm just a bit concerned about the reliability of the stand...

However, in France, where I live, they are a bit more expensive than in the US (the list price is 1290€ ~ 1730$). There is always the possibility of ordering them in Germany (at Thomann, they are listed at 990€ with 3 years repair guarantee and 30-day money-back guarantee if I do not like it, that's better) but I would not have a free setup service as when I buy it in a store. On the other hand, the shops that sell them here are more specialized in EB so I'm not sure they are really experienced in EUBs...

Moreover, WAV4s seem to be temporarily out of stock (success ?). Even Thomann says that the Amberburst model will be available at mid-July... Only the black model seems to be more or less available. I also saw on Thomann site that the next WAV instrument is supposed to be a violin.

What do you think ? Buy it in a store ? Buy it in Germany (and, for the price difference, find here a luthier to set it up, if necessary) ?

I got my WAV from www.elderly.com and from the initial order it took a grand total of 4 days to arrive at my house
Including carriage, VAT and other standard charges it still worked out slightly cheaper than Thomann, on top of this they also threw in a free German bow (worth $85)...great company to deal with, Highly recommended.

Unfortunately I didnt realise TB'er Bob Gollihur had an online store as well (yes I'm an idiot) but judging by his wealth of experience and incredibly informative posts here on TB, I reckon he's the man to sort you out on your purchase and any other questions you may have.

check out Invalid Link Removed
(Bob, hope this is the right URL..feel free to correct me if I'm wrong )

 

[ziv]

I got my WAV from www.elderly.com and from the initial order it took a grand total of 4 days to arrive at my house
[...]
Unfortunately I didnt realise TB'er Bob Gollihur had an online store as well (yes I'm an idiot) but judging by his wealth of experience and incredibly informative posts here on TB

I'm aware that it is much cheaper in the US but I hesitate to order it there. In case there is a problem (e.g. with the stand...), sending back the item will be much more expensive than sending it to Germany (or go to a local store). And you can hardly beat Thomann's 30-day money back guarantee and 3-year repair guarantee. If I was in the US, I would think differently, of course...

 

[adje]

Quite right. But there has been much discussion about how to make it sound more like an acoustic. I've always taken the view that it is what it is, don't expect it to be something it's not. There are two settings on the pickup, Pizz and Arco. Some people prefer to play with fingers in the Arco mode, this does give a very 'thuddy' sound, but for me it just doesn't have the sustain I want. It's personal preference.

I would agree that the thuddy arco setting is a bit annoying when you stand close to the amp. But the other day my brother came over and played the same bass, over the same amp, and I was further away from the amp - it actually sounded much better at a distance.

Posters here have also been saying that it sounds better in a group setting, rather than solo.

 

[endorka]

I would agree that the thuddy arco setting is a bit annoying when you stand close to the amp. But the other day my brother came over and played the same bass, over the same amp, and I was further away from the amp - it actually sounded much better at a distance.

Yes that is definitely the case, I remember when I first starting using the instrument at gigs in the "arco" setting, and people (including bass players!) were telling me that it had a great sound, while I am thinking "hmmm, are you sure?". Doing the test you mention above helped convince me of this.

Of course the now well noted "thock" phenomenon diminishes over time as the strings wear in, but I think this is something that is very offputting to start with. I don't think the "thock" comes out too much at a distance anyway.

In saying that, I regularly gig with a guitarist who prefers me to use the "pizz" setting on certain tunes, especially fast ones with distinctive basslines such as "Joshua". In those cases the articulation does seem better with the "pizz" setting. I've also noticed that in some cases, the "pizz" setting works better in rooms with bad acoustics, particularly those where you are getting drowned out in unwanted reflections.

Jennifer

 

[ziv]

Have you got any news about the availability of the WAV4 ? They seem to be out of stock at Thomann's (due 15/07) and even in the U.S. (Link Removed, same date).

 

[adje]

Yes that is definitely the case, I remember when I first starting using the instrument at gigs in the "arco" setting, and people (including bass players!) were telling me that it had a great sound, while I am thinking "hmmm, are you sure?". Doing the test you mention above helped convince me of this.

Of course the now well noted "thock" phenomenon diminishes over time as the strings wear in, but I think this is something that is very offputting to start with. I don't think the "thock" comes out too much at a distance anyway.

In saying that, I regularly gig with a guitarist who prefers me to use the "pizz" setting on certain tunes, especially fast ones with distinctive basslines such as "Joshua". In those cases the articulation does seem better with the "pizz" setting. I've also noticed that in some cases, the "pizz" setting works better in rooms with bad acoustics, particularly those where you are getting drowned out in unwanted reflections.

Jennifer

It's nice to have the pizz setting as an alternative, so you don't have to drag along your fretless EB. Apart from the sustain, I don't think it sounds so much different.

 

[endorka]

Apart from the sustain, I don't think it sounds so much different.

That's interesting, perhaps it also depends on other things such as strings, amplification or playing technique - to my ears they sound significantly different. The arco has a far stronger attack and
less tonal content, for want of a better word. I think it does share a lot of sonic characteristics of a double bass. As you say, the pizz just sounds like a big fretless bass guitar.

What approach do you take to playing pizz on the EUB?

Jennifer

 

[adje]

Jennifer,

My comment wasn't about the arco and pizz settings on the WAV, but about the pizz setting and a fretless EBG. Sorry for the confusion.

I do play pizz with the arco setting. The best results so far I get with a flat, stroking movement - not sure what the technical term is. Thumb is against the side of the fingerboard. With my index and middle fingers straightened, pointing towards the bridge, I use the side of the tip of either finger - stroking or plucking. For a clearer attack, I turn my hand perpendicular to the strings, and pluck with the fingertips, with arched fingers.

 

[endorka]

My comment wasn't about the arco and pizz settings on the WAV, but about the pizz setting and a fretless EBG. Sorry for the confusion.

Doh! I get it now. Thought I must have been hearing things or something

I do play pizz with the arco setting. The best results so far I get with a flat, stroking movement - not sure what the technical term is. Thumb is against the side of the fingerboard. With my index and middle fingers straightened, pointing towards the bridge, I use the side of the tip of either finger - stroking or plucking. For a clearer attack, I turn my hand perpendicular to the strings, and pluck with the fingertips, with arched fingers.

That sounds pretty much the same as I do - more or less a standard double bass approach? For things that demand extreme clarity I'll do the perpendicular style you describe with the "pizz" setting.

Jennifer

 

[adje]

Doh - me too. That's what I get for not taking any lessons: I end up with a fairly normal technique anyway.

It's good to know that the pizz setting helps if the room acoustics are less than ideal.

 

[ziv]

Does anyone has or has seen the red finish version ? I could not see any WAV4 in store yet (they are out of stock) and I think I will finally order one. The red version should be available in a week but I would have to wait two more weeks for the amberburst (the most common one, it seems, and the most "classical" color).

Did anyone had the chance to compare both versions (aesthetically, I know they should play the same...) ? Is it worth waiting for the amberburst ?

 

[Bob Gollihur]

I really like the look of the Red, there's a nice photo of it on the Ned Steinberger site at http://www.nedsteinberger.com/wav/index.html

 

[adje]

I got to play two WAVs side by side, and there were differences - nothing major, but so much so that I preferred one (amberburst) over the other (blue see-through). Which was nice, as I didn't really like the looks of the blue one. ;-)

 

[wxfloyd]

where did you find a transparent blue WAV4? The only ones I've been able to find are the black, red, and amberburst.

 

[adje]

I played a blue one in the Netherlands. As far as I know, there are currently no shops here that stock the WAV - all sold out.

 

[adje]

It's probably bad form to quote oneself, but anyway ...

Doh - me too. That's what I get for not taking any lessons: I end up with a fairly normal technique anyway.

It's good to know that the pizz setting helps if the room acoustics are less than ideal.

I find I need to turn up the lows when switching from the arco to the pizz setting. This with the original NS strings - perhaps proper strings have more lows in the pizz setting?