Double Bass NY Philharmonic base pay increase

[biobass]

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Base pay increases to $205,000 over the next three years. Great!


I truly hope that the orchestra senior management has done their due diligence and correctly assessed their financial resources. I have recently been watching Mozart In the Jungle. I hope that it truly is only loosely based on reality!

 

[Dlew919]

I know in one orchestra here the cellists get a 50.00 a year allowance for a G string. Since that string costs about 150 and a professional cellist uses 4 a year on average … many orchestras are underpaid.

This is great news for the New York philharmonic.

 

[groooooove]

most symphony jobs do not pay even a percentage of that -

I know people who play in symphonies that also work retail jobs (in addition to teaching and such) to cover their bills.

in a perfect world they'd all make a good living. but, the cost of running an ensemble and venue or travel like this must be astronomical. Weren't lots of them going bankrupt even before covid?

nonetheless for our friends in the NY phil this is super cool.

 

[Don Hergert]

[New York Philharmonic Players Reach Deal Raising Base Pay to $205,000]

That would probably come close to paying the rent in NYC.

But success is in looking at the whole picture. It will be interesting to see the prices of tickets to attend such performances, and who can afford to pay for them.

 

[40Hz]

in a perfect world they'd all make a good living. but, the cost of running an ensemble and venue or travel like this must be astronomical. Weren't lots of them going bankrupt even before covid?

Orchestras survive largely through support from endowments and in some places with government support. It’s doubtful any symphony in the United States could survive purely on its box office. If you look back in history, most orchestras were either state funded or survived through royal patronage or the support of the very rich. So this is nothing new.

Bottom line is that in a quasi capitalist country such as ours, the money finds its way towards things people need and want. And most orchestras haven’t done much to make all but a small part of the population feel they need or even want a symphony orchestra. If you take the NYPO’s 100 give or take musicians and multiply that by $205K plus benefits, and then add in the cost of guest artist appearances, plus administrative, support, marketing, and operating expenses - and then divide that into the number of seats times the number of performances in a season to set ticket prices, the numbers don’t look good. And that’s just to break even.

Basically, orchestras aren’t economically viable, and never really were. What I find amazing is they manage to soldier on despite all that. And being a classical music fanboy, I’m very grateful for that.

 

[Root 5]

I know in one orchestra here the cellists get a 50.00 a year allowance for a G string. Since that string costs about 150 and a professional cellist uses 4 a year on average … many orchestras are underpaid.

This is great news for the New York philharmonic.

Is the G uniquely expensive? Why does that string break so often? I might imagine the A string breaking most often

 

[biobass]

Is the G uniquely expensive? Why does that string break so often? I might imagine the A string breaking most often

Makes me glad that I’m a bass player. Replacing a string, any string, four times a year seems mighty often.

 

[Anne Millington]

Is the G uniquely expensive? Why does that string break so often? I might imagine the A string breaking most often

They typically don't break, but they do diminish in quality. The tone dulls, the harmonics become untrue, the response changes, funny noises and warbles emerge. The higher strings degrade faster. And a pro quality C string? $150 - 200. I knew a cellist who replaced all her strings every 6 weeks!

 

[garrett2]

The New York Philharmonic has a very serious public relations problem at the moment, entirely of their own making. I would certainly consider jumping ship on moral grounds if I was in that orchestra. I wonder how much of the pay increase is related to this? Regardless it’s a good thing!

 

[dbsfgyd1]

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Base pay increases to $205,000 over the next three years. Great!


I truly hope that the orchestra senior management has done their due diligence and correctly assessed their financial resources. I have recently been watching Mozart In the Jungle. I hope that it truly is only loosely based on reality!

It’s the only way to get quality musicians to be able to afford living in greater NYC area. The last time I looked at my son’s total comp package as a bassist in the US Marine Corps about 10 years ago when he was stationed in San Diego was into 6 figures. His housing allowing allowance alone was pretty close to $40k a year. Not to mention, San Diego was one hell of a lot nicer than NYC.

 

[40Hz]

To keep it in perspective, a salary of $200K puts the recipient in the top 1.5% of all earners in the United States. So regardless of the personal demands, innate talent, and the amount of education and training required, the New York Philharmonic is a pretty plum job.

 

[40Hz]

It’s the only way to get quality musicians to be able to afford living in greater NYC area.

Depends on how you’re defining the greater metro area. My town in CT is 49 miles (about one hour) by easily accessible MTA commuter rail outside NYC. And the COH here, while not cheap by any stretch, is still nowhere near what an apartment in Manhattan or Queens would set you back. There have been more than a few symphony players (including the late Leonard Bernstein) who live around where I do.

 

[Lance Bunyon]

Depends on how you’re defining the greater metro area. My town in CT is 49 miles (about one hour) by easily accessible MTA commuter rail outside NYC. And the COH here, while not cheap by any stretch, is still nowhere near what an apartment in Manhattan or Queens would set you back. There have been more than a few symphony players (including the late Leonard Bernstein) who live around where I do.

The commute is the trade-off. I live in a really nice house in a really nice suburb of Charlotte. Even though my amp, bass, and accessories were packed at 22:30 last night, I had a solid hour of southeastern suburbs to city back to western suburbs to face to get home.

 

[Don Hergert]

Just guessing, but a musician of that quality wouldn't want to practice in their bedroom, so they need at least a 2 bedroom apartment. In NYC that puts them in the $5K+ / month range, or $60K+ / year. If there's a family involved, a 3 bedroom apartment is $6.5K+ / month or $78K+ / year. Maybe they'll rent a separate practice space somewhere, but then there's a commute and ultimately it's still a rental expense.

Food, transportation, family expenses, and top-salary rate taxes all add up too. Pretty soon $205K / year turns into pocket change at tax time. Sure, you can live outside of the city, but travel-hours of your time is an expense too.

$205K sounds like a lot. But lower cost-of-living areas also offer pay rates that are consistent with their area. NYC, SF, DC, Hollywood, Nashville and a few other top dollar entertainment cities just happen to cost a lot to live in.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

Depends on how you’re defining the greater metro area. My town in CT is 49 miles (about one hour) by easily accessible MTA commuter rail outside NYC. And the COH here, while not cheap by any stretch, is still nowhere near what an apartment in Manhattan or Queens would set you back. There have been more than a few symphony players (including the late Leonard Bernstein) who live around where I do.

True, I'm not so sure I'd be comfortable traveling on a commuter train with my DB. Frankly, I wouldn't be comfortable traveling daily on a commuter train period with just me, let alone at night... LOL!!! Gads, we have a metro that runs from here to St. Louis I wouldn't recommend unless you are traveling in a very large party. For instance cars packed with Cardinal fans going to the game

But for the record, I didn't find the compensation that out of line considering the qualification/competition for a chair. I think you will agree that location has a lot to do with that amount.

 

[40Hz]

The commute is the trade-off. I live in a really nice house in a really nice suburb of Charlotte. Even though my amp, bass, and accessories were packed at 22:30 last night, I had a solid hour of southeastern suburbs to city back to western suburbs to face to get home.

I agree it’s a trade-off. But far better living arrangements in a quieter and safer environment with far lower taxes across the board, plus excellent public services, and (if you have kids) a genuinely good public school system that actually manages to educate its students for roughly half to a third the cost of living in Manhattan seems more than worth the inconvenience of getting on a train or an hours worth of driving to me.

People ask me what my town is like. And I describe it as a nice place to live, but you probably wouldn’t want to visit it. Reason being it’s fairly quiet and there’s not a lot of excitement to be had unless you consider porch music fests and the sole local performance venue - which does book some big names - to be exciting. For bigger fun you just hop the train to NYC to hit the theaters and clubs, or shuffle up to Boston for the weekend, or Cape Cod for a few weeks vacation.

I commuted three or four days a week into NYC for about four years on client work assignments. And I didn’t find it to be much of a hassle. The only part I did find moderately annoying was sometimes finding a parking space at the train station.

 

[40Hz]

I wouldn't be comfortable traveling daily on a commuter train period with just me, let alone at night..

Guess it all depends in where you live. I’m in a pretty law abiding area for the most part. I’ve never once had a bad experience let alone a hassle on our metro system. NYC’s Transit Authority and the Metrorail police don’t suffer fools gladly where I live. Same goes at the train stations. Those usually have an MTA cruiser or local cop or two patrolling the platforms and parking areas during the hours the trains are running.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

Guess it all depends in where you live. I’m in a pretty law abiding area for the most part. I’ve never once had a bad experience let alone a hassle on our metro system. NYC’s Transit Authority and the Metrorail police don’t suffer fools gladly where I live. Same goes at the train stations. Those usually have an MTA cruiser or local cop or two patrolling the platforms and parking areas during the hours the trains are running.

Not so much here in the wild west where it is expected that one behaves themselves , AND need to have ability to defend themselves....LOL!!!

 

[Lance Bunyon]

I agree it’s a trade-off. But far better living arrangements in a quieter and safer environment with far lower taxes across the board, plus excellent public services, and (if you have kids) a genuinely good public school system that actually manages to educate its students for roughly half to a third the cost of living in Manhattan seems more than worth the inconvenience of getting on a train or an hours worth of driving to me.

People ask me what my town is like. And I describe it as a nice place to live, but you probably wouldn’t want to visit it. Reason being it’s fairly quiet and there’s not a lot of excitement to be had unless you consider porch music fests and the sole local performance venue - which does book some big names - to be exciting. For bigger fun you just hop the train to NYC to hit the theaters and clubs, or shuffle up to Boston for the weekend, or Cape Cod for a few weeks vacation.

I commuted three or four days a week into NYC for about four years on client work assignments. And I didn’t find it to be much of a hassle. The only part I did find moderately annoying was sometimes finding a parking space at the train station.

I lived in downtown Boston as a young man for a few years. It was awful! No where to park, had to walk 7 blocks each way to the Laundromat or grocery store.

Suburban life is not exciting. My kids also don't meet pimps or crack dealers!
I had a mentor back in the day tell me that the goal in raising kids is to find a place that they will be bored to tears of by 18. If you hear "Yo dad, this town SUCKS!" you've accomplished the goal

 

[s van order]

Is the G uniquely expensive? Why does that string break so often? I might imagine the A string breaking most often

Other cellists may weigh in. The TI spirocore tungsten cello G is about $150 and the C more. These last me at least a year, sometimes closer to two, and I am a pretty active player. There are cheaper options of course but the growl and life of the tungsten wrapped model is nice. In my experience, A strings (Jargar excepted) don't break much if the nut and bridge notch are smooth and rubbed with graphite when changing strings. Key is to bring the new A up to pitch slowly, in increments. I change the D and A about every 3-6mos. Full timers will burn through them a lot faster.