Official Barefaced Bass Cab Club

[monsterthompson]

Thank you, @monsterthompson !

My experience thus far -- and please believe me that I am non-biased -- when the two are compared the competition has more noticeable LF presecense and tangible prowess, and the largest factor for me in comparison is that the 4.0 kHZ top-end of the SC is a bit too dark, so much so that it sounds box-like against the other, way, way too much.

Again, not fair of an apples-to-apples comparison at this time.

Cheers!

I had been using a Fearful/less 15/6 / 115 before the SC. I know of the boxy experience you're describing. It was not something I liked. I ended up selling my Monique because that pre couldn't EQ the "box" out. I had better results with the Genz Shuttle 9.0 with a semi para mid control. Over time, I found it less boxy. Now, when I DI/mix I often LPF at 4K because I like the result. I also noticed the stuff above 4K sounds nice solo but often disappears in a rock band mix with guitar fuzz and cymbals.

Some of that perceived missing low end (in comparison) is the midrange presence and lack of top end. If your amp let's you EQ at the right points, I think you can get into the low end territory you are looking for. Much of the game is ratio and proportion and context. Don't give up easily. Use your ears and give it some time.

 

[CharlieC]

I had been using a Fearful/less 15/6 / 115 before the SC. I know of the boxy experience you're describing. It was not something I liked. I ended up selling my Monique because that pre couldn't EQ the "box" out. I had better results with the Genz Shuttle 9.0 with a semi para mid control. Over time, I found it less boxy. Now, when I DI/mix I often LPF at 4K because I like the result. I also noticed the stuff above 4K sounds nice solo but often disappears in a rock band mix with guitar fuzz and cymbals.

Some of that perceived missing low end (in comparison) is the midrange presence and lack of top end. If your amp let's you EQ at the right points, I think you can get into the low end territory you are looking for. Much of the game is ratio and proportion and context. Don't give up easily. Use your ears and give it some time.

Here's the thing @monsterthompson . Sure, I could EQ the SC to more-better meet the competition, but that sweeps the issue under the rug.

When I A/B a single signal to both cabinets, that should be fair game, I think.

With all due respect, an SC with a horn driver (i.e. a BB2) could very well bridge the gap, but that is to be determined.

Until that time, let me state that the SC is hands-down the absolute lightest power-house available, bar none. It is a one-finger, 23.5 pound lift of old-school (tweeter-less, not-overly-bassy) tone. Exactly as advertised, but I am hoping a BB2 is more the real-deal.

Cheers!

 

[jnewmark]

Just flying by the seat of my pants here, and I am by no means any type of cab guru, but I would suspect that the Barefaced driver is some sort of OEM version of the Eminence 3012HO driver. Just taking a guess here as we will probably never be told. But, if that is the case, then putting it up against a 3012LF, just for pure low end comparison, well, it should be obvious which one is gonna win that battle. Interestingly enough, Eminence does not consider either one a " bass guitar " driver as such , listing both of them in their " Pro Audio " section, along with the 3015. Not to say that either one can't be used for bass guitar, ( I use two 3012HO's in a cab ) as many of the boutique cab builders use them ( in some form or another ), for bass guitar, but they are always used with some sort of crossover to a mid driver or tweeter/horn. I suspect that is what you are missing with the SC. Again, I am just guessing here about the Barefaced driver ( maybe its a Faital ? ), but, that 3012LF is a hell of a low end monster !

 

[1954bassman]

When I pole-mount the One10, I use a mini stand that doesn't occupy a lot of floor space

Which pole are you using? Do you have a link to it?

 

[middy]

With all due respect to everyone here, the following meet-up did not end well.

In retrospect I should have purchased a BB2.

{ Not wishing to troll, just my personal experience }

I am hoping to have a more-fair comparison opinion when my credit card allows.

Until then, please forgive my over-bearing questions and respectfully note that in Round 1: 3012LF vs 12XN550 Design, my nod goes to the competition, but to be continued...

Cheers!

Is the SC even broken in yet? Mine has gained quite a bit of low end after the first 20 hours or so.
It's perfect for me, as I'm all about a smooth and accurate midrange and a solid low end.

 

[John D Harris]

Here's the thing @monsterthompson . Sure, I could EQ the SC to more-better meet the competition, but that sweeps the issue under the rug.

When I A/B a single signal to both cabinets, that should be fair game, I think.

With all due respect, an SC with a horn driver (i.e. a BB2) could very well bridge the gap, but that is to be determined.

Until that time, let me state that the SC is hands-down the absolute lightest power-house available, bar none. It is a one-finger, 23.5 pound lift of old-school (tweeter-less, not-overly-bassy) tone. Exactly as advertised, but I am hoping a BB2 is more the real-deal.

Cheers!

Just curious whether the SC is broken in fully?
I got no dog in this fight whatsoever, I just agree with you that I would have thought the Bf 12" would have a bit more sensitivity/efficiency - as well as a stronger low-end per AC.

 

[John D Harris]

Just flying by the seat of my pants here, and I am by no means any type of cab guru, but I would suspect that the Barefaced driver is some sort of OEM version of the Eminence 3012HO driver. Just taking a guess here as we will probably never be told. But, if that is the case, then putting it up against a 3012LF, just for pure low end comparison, well, it should be obvious which one is gonna win that battle. Interestingly enough, Eminence does not consider either one a " bass guitar " driver as such , listing both of them in their " Pro Audio " section, along with the 3015. Not to say that either one can't be used for bass guitar, ( I use two 3012HO's in a cab ) as many of the boutique cab builders use them ( in some form or another ), for bass guitar, but they are always used with some sort of crossover to a mid driver or tweeter/horn. I suspect that is what you are missing with the SC. Again, I am just guessing here about the Barefaced driver ( maybe its a Faital ? ), but, that 3012LF is a hell of a low end monster !

I think that the Bf 12" is its own animal (from what Alex C has said).

 

[MOSCOWBASS]

Just flying by the seat of my pants here, and I am by no means any type of cab guru, but I would suspect that the Barefaced driver is some sort of OEM version of the Eminence 3012HO driver. Just taking a guess here as we will probably never be told. But, if that is the case, then putting it up against a 3012LF, just for pure low end comparison, well, it should be obvious which one is gonna win that battle. Interestingly enough, Eminence does not consider either one a " bass guitar " driver as such , listing both of them in their " Pro Audio " section, along with the 3015. Not to say that either one can't be used for bass guitar, ( I use two 3012HO's in a cab ) as many of the boutique cab builders use them ( in some form or another ), for bass guitar, but they are always used with some sort of crossover to a mid driver or tweeter/horn. I suspect that is what you are missing with the SC. Again, I am just guessing here about the Barefaced driver ( maybe its a Faital ? ), but, that 3012LF is a hell of a low end monster !

The BF driver is an Eminance according to Alex

 

[alexclaber]

Thank you, @monsterthompsonMy experience thus far -- and please believe me that I am non-biased -- when the two are compared the competition has more noticeable LF presecense and tangible prowess, and the largest factor for me in comparison is that the 4.0 kHZ top-end of the SC is a bit too dark, so much so that it sounds box-like against the other, way, way too much!

Yes, it sounds like the Super Compact doesn't have enough treble for you.

Not to stir the pot, but in an A/B switched speaker comparison, the 3012LF is louder (and perhaps more authoritative) than a 12XN550 from a "girth" perspective.

I thought for certain, the 12XN550 would have taken this contest.

As an aside, I made sure to run 4.0 kHz-capped test signals through both cabinets for this.

We used to use the 3012LF in the original Big Baby and Big Twin. The 12XN is significantly more powerful when you gig with it - the slight increase in Vd and thermal power handling, combined with the large increase in sensitivity, plus the improved transient response and dispersion means it has a big advantage in the live environment. I don't think running bandwidth limited test signals at lower levels is of any benefit - take the cabs out and gig them, or at least crank them in a loud rehearsal with a band.

I wouldn't go so far as saying you'd need two 3012LF's to match one 12XN but I would say you'd need three 3012LFs to match two 12XNs and even then the 3012LFs would struggle.

Just flying by the seat of my pants here, and I am by no means any type of cab guru, but I would suspect that the Barefaced driver is some sort of OEM version of the Eminence 3012HO driver.

No it isn't. It uses the same frame and magnet (not the whole motor, just the magnet) as the 3012LF because of the higher Xlim with the bumped backplate) but everything else is different.

 

[CharlieC]

Is the SC even broken in yet? Mine has gained quite a bit of low end after the first 20 hours or so.
It's perfect for me, as I'm all about a smooth and accurate midrange and a solid low end.

Just curious whether the SC is broken in fully?
I got no dog in this fight whatsoever, I just agree with you that I would have thought the Bf 12" would have a bit more sensitivity/efficiency - as well as a stronger low-end per AC.

Thank you, both.

Yes, the cab was given a vigorous and lengthy break-in time.

 

[alexclaber]

Also, A/B testing of low frequency things only works well if you're in a huge room or outdoors, or have another person swapping the cabs positions, otherwise where you stand and where the cab is can make far more difference to the output and frequency response where you're listening than the actual performance of the cab.

Our first business unit was small enough and had such solid concrete walls and floors that we could make a low frequency sine wave go from head-crushingly loud to almost silent just by walking around the room.

 

[jnewmark]

Yes, it sounds like the Super Compact doesn't have enough treble for you.



We used to use the 3012LF in the original Big Baby and Big Twin. The 12XN is significantly more powerful when you gig with it - the slight increase in Vd and thermal power handling, combined with the large increase in sensitivity, plus the improved transient response and dispersion means it has a big advantage in the live environment. I don't think running bandwidth limited test signals at lower levels is of any benefit - take the cabs out and gig them, or at least crank them in a loud rehearsal with a band.

I wouldn't go so far as saying you'd need two 3012LF's to match one 12XN but I would say you'd need three 3012LFs to match two 12XNs and even then the 3012LFs would struggle.



No it isn't. It uses the same frame and magnet (not the whole motor, just the magnet) as the 3012LF because of the higher Xlim with the bumped backplate) but everything else is different.

I stand corrected !

 

[Plutonium244]

Which pole are you using? Do you have a link to it?

It is a Yorkville, I think it might be this one: Invalid Link Removed

Invalid Link Removed

 

[1954bassman]

Thanks

 

[kringle77]

If anyone is looking to sell their Super Midget cabs, please pm me.

 

[Tim1]

EXCITING NEWS, you heard it here....
I wrote to Alex asking about ordering a Two 10 to sit on my Four 10 and whether he could also send the other crossover so I would have both 12 and 4 ohm options, meaning I could swap them over and use it at 4 ohms as a standalone cab.
He just replied to me with the following:
"We've just managed to make a switchable impedance Two10 for someone with a Six10. It's a pretty cool modular solution."
For me this is huge. It effectively means I can ditch every other cab and with a Four 10 and switchable Two 10 do any gig I want. It is also the sign of a company which is listening to its customers and wherever possible developing products to suit.
Of course, pure gas and sheer greed mean I also see a BB2 somewhere in my future

 

[monsterthompson]

Dang. Want.

 

[monsterthompson]

...btw, i've been lazy about installing my 12ohm conversion for the 4ohm two10. if anyone wants it, please send me a msg.

 

[andrew]

Dang. Want.

Yep.

 

[HaphAsSard]

EXCITING NEWS, you heard it here....
I wrote to Alex asking about ordering a Two 10 to sit on my Four 10 and whether he could also send the other crossover so I would have both 12 and 4 ohm options, meaning I could swap them over and use it at 4 ohms as a standalone cab.
He just replied to me with the following:
"We've just managed to make a switchable impedance Two10 for someone with a Six10. It's a pretty cool modular solution."
For me this is huge. It effectively means I can ditch every other cab and with a Four 10 and switchable Two 10 do any gig I want. It is also the sign of a company which is listening to its customers and wherever possible developing products to suit.
Of course, pure gas and sheer greed mean I also see a BB2 somewhere in my future

Awesome they found a way to make it - it obviously made sense and they must have tried hard to make it happen.