Official Orange Club II

[Ringhammer]

I posted this in another thread but I know a few tube gurus hang here too,( @Wasnex you listening? ) and this applies to Orange AD200B and TB500H amps specifically, soo..,

I have two pairs of vintage Mullard 12AX7's, I got these from TC Tubes. (Great folks to work with). They show readings on the boxes which I have no idea what they mean:

View attachment 5347200


I posed the following questions to Chelsea (the "C" in "TC Tubes") and she did her best to answer, but I'd like to hear what others think. It may not matter all that much, but if there's an ideal choice for one pair in one amp, I'd like to start there. And (I think) I usually lean toward clean bass tone, clear headroom with not a lot of grit. Clean volume with no speaker distortion. At least I think that's what I'm hearing when I like my tone… Here's what I asked:

"Is there a simple explanation for the "readings" you have on the boxes?

In my application(s), one pair will be in the preamp of a 200w tube amp and the other pair will be in the preamp of a 500W class D amp.

Is there one pair more suited to the 200w tube amp and one pair more suited to the 500w class D amp?

Both are Orange bass amps and Orange claims the preamp sections of both amps are identical.

For instance, the ones in yellow/green boxes show higher readings over the ones in the white boxes. Does that equate to a slightly higher output, or….?"


Chelsea's response was:

"Spec for 12AX7 is 1600 Gm. So the 10M Mullards test at 100% of spec, and the high gain Amperex-labeled Mullards test at 125% of spec. This will likely translate into higher output, though it may not be an audible difference. It might also be a cleaner tone."

Based on that answer I'd think I'd put the higher output Aperex labeled Mullards in the AD200B 200w tube amp and the others in the TB500 500w class D amp since there's more wattage available.

And it may just be splitting hairs…

 

[Wasnex]

I posted this in another thread but I know a few tube gurus hang here too,( @Wasnex you listening? ) and this applies to Orange AD200B and TB500H amps specifically, soo..,

I have two pairs of vintage Mullard 12AX7's, I got these from TC Tubes. (Great folks to work with). They show readings on the boxes which I have no idea what they mean:

View attachment 5347200


I posed the following questions to Chelsea (the "C" in "TC Tubes") and she did her best to answer, but I'd like to hear what others think. It may not matter all that much, but if there's an ideal choice for one pair in one amp, I'd like to start there. And (I think) I usually lean toward clean bass tone, clear headroom with not a lot of grit. Clean volume with no speaker distortion. At least I think that's what I'm hearing when I like my tone… Here's what I asked:

"Is there a simple explanation for the "readings" you have on the boxes?

In my application(s), one pair will be in the preamp of a 200w tube amp and the other pair will be in the preamp of a 500W class D amp.

Is there one pair more suited to the 200w tube amp and one pair more suited to the 500w class D amp?

Both are Orange bass amps and Orange claims the preamp sections of both amps are identical.

For instance, the ones in yellow/green boxes show higher readings over the ones in the white boxes. Does that equate to a slightly higher output, or….?"


Chelsea's response was:

"Spec for 12AX7 is 1600 Gm. So the 10M Mullards test at 100% of spec, and the high gain Amperex-labeled Mullards test at 125% of spec. This will likely translate into higher output, though it may not be an audible difference. It might also be a cleaner tone."

Based on that answer I'd think I'd put the higher output Aperex labeled Mullards in the AD200B 200w tube amp and the others in the TB500 500w class D amp since there's more wattage available.

And it may just be splitting hairs…

The best approach is to roll the tubes in the amp and choose the combination you think sounds best. A lot of people complain that the preamp in the AD200B and V1 of the TerrorBass have too much gain. Keep in mind that if one tube produces a cleaner and hotter signal, it may drive the next tube into distortion easier.

iP is plate current.

Gm is transconductance. It's a measure of how effective the control grid is in controlling electron flow. Defined as the change in the plate (anode) current divided by the corresponding change in the grid/cathode voltage, with a constant plate(anode) to cathode voltage.

Higher ratings are preferred. But you can't compare ratings generated by different tube testers directly. Usually you should be told the bogey, but sometimes sellers compare to the minimum rating. I consider the minimum acceptable Gm ratings as 65% of the bogey. If they give you the minimum value, divide by .65 to get the bogey.

For example if the bogey is 1600 then the minimum value is 1600 x 0.65 = 1040. If you are given the minimum value of 1040, then the bogey is 1040/0.65 = 1600

This article seems pretty decent: Tube Matching 101 - Tube Maze

 

[Wasnex]

FYI, the preamps in the AD200B and TB are similar but not identical.

My impression is more people complain about the original TB having excessive gain...but I have seen complaints about both amps. Some suggest trying lower gain tubes such as 12AU7 and 12AT7. I believe these subs would allow you to turn the Gain up more before drive occurs, but it does not necessarily give you more clean headroom.

I think my AD200B has the stock tubes and I don't have any problems adjusting it or any concern that the Gain needs to be kept somewhat low for a clean tone.

I have tried lower gain tubes in some circuits and generally prefer the specified tube. Usually I find the lower gain tube seems less lively and responsive. The only circuit I have preferred a lower gain sub is in the Reverb of my Showman Reverb. The original tube was 12AT7, and I prefer 12AU7. I think 12AU7 improves both the tone and adjustability of the reverb.

 

[Ringhammer]

The TB I have is a V2, with the "clean" switch. I also have a TB1000 (v1) and it's actually listed for sale. It's a really good sounding amp for sure, but I felt the 500 would meet my needs better. Today is the first day I am playing with the new 500, and I'm liking it, and finding it novel that the gain and master can actually go above 9 o'clock. The clean switch really cuts the gain, and in my garage with 2 OBC112's I had the gain at 12 o'clock and master around 10 o'clock, and it was getting loud, but still less than the 1000 at 9 o'clock and 9 o'clock.

 

[katolecho]

New owner of a Terror Bass here.
I've switch from a Microtubes 500 and a spare TC Electronics to the Terror Bass.

The TB sound more natural than the Darkglass.

 

[Wicked G]

New owner of a Terror Bass here.
I've switch from a Microtubes 500 and a spare TC Electronics to the Terror Bass.

The TB sound more natural than the Darkglass.

I agree. The Microtubes 500 V1 I used to have was very bright and fizzy sounding. If I remember correctly it might have even been metallic sounding. Nowhere near as nice as the Terror Bass.

 

[Captain Chaos]

I own a TB 500 and looking to get an ad200 in the near future. How much better is the ad200 compared to TB 500? And how much can I get from my TB to fund for the tube head?

 

[Ringhammer]

You can probably get $500-$600 for your TB500. I have 2 AD200's and one I got for $1350, the other I scored for $750. The one I got for $750 was a Euro model that only would run on 220/230, but the transformer had the taps for 115/125 (or whatever). My tech re-wired to to run on US voltage only.

Both of my AD200's have really good vintage US tubes in both the power sections (GE in one and Sylvania in the other), and the preamp sections (RCA in one and GE and Aperex[Mullard] in the other) and that made a big improvement to my ears over the JJ's (that came in one) and the Chinese "PM" tubes (that came with the other.

I have a TB500v2 and two OBC112's and I like it a lot, but haven't used it with the band yet. I will be for a gig in about a month, and that will tell me how it stack up to the AD200. I can say the AD200 and the OBC115 is a great sounding rig to me, really deep and clear at the same time.

What cab(s) are you using?

 

[lizardking837]

Morning all,
I finally got to test out an Orange amp at a jam yesterday. I've always loved the 'Orange Sound' from being a doom/sludge metal fan and I'm considering adding a piece of Orange gear to my arsenal. The only thing that I'm going back and forth on is the question of combo or head? Seeing as how the 100w Crush Combo, Terror Bass Head, Little Bass Thing and OB-1 300 are all close in price, what are the main differences (aside from the obvious) between all these amps?

Thanks in advance for the help.

 

[Ringhammer]

I have a couple of AD200's (one stays parked at the studio, the other goes to gigs), and they are awesome. But, in an effort to lighten up the gear for live shows in small stage venues (bars), I got curious about the Terror Bass and OBC112s. I ended up getting a TB1000 and a couple of OBC112's and I liked it but to me it seemed like too much, so I sold the TB1000 and got a TB500(v2), the one with the "Clean" switch and I like that a lot better, still plenty loud, but with more usable volume and the cleaner sound is what I go for.
I swapped the stock Ruby 12ax7's out for some good vintage Mullard 12ax7's and, while not a huge noticeable difference in tone, it cleaned up some odd minor little sounds that were coming out of the amp when I was not playing through it. Sounds I thought were just in my signal chain.

I can't speak to the combos or OB-1's but the TB500 and one OBC112 (or two) is a good, loud, compact and lightweight rig.

 

[Auer]

Morning all,
I finally got to test out an Orange amp at a jam yesterday. I've always loved the 'Orange Sound' from being a doom/sludge metal fan and I'm considering adding a piece of Orange gear to my arsenal. The only thing that I'm going back and forth on is the question of combo or head? Seeing as how the 100w Crush Combo, Terror Bass Head, Little Bass Thing and OB-1 300 are all close in price, what are the main differences (aside from the obvious) between all these amps?

Thanks in advance for the help.

I have a 100W crush combo (and a 50W as well).
Like the sound a lot, very similar (A/B and controls) to the OB-1's.

If 100W is enough for you (And DI out) it should work very well for you.
The Blend and Gain functions are great as is the frequency sweep.

I think it's a great combo, and personally I like having one Combo around, just because.
I put wheels on mine, rolling it all over the house and whatnot when the mood strikes.

 

[coreyfyfe]

I own a TB 500 and looking to get an ad200 in the near future. How much better is the ad200 compared to TB 500? And how much can I get from my TB to fund for the tube head?

I own both as well. There's a depth and dimension to the AD200 that isn't there with the TB500. Running the two into the same 8 ohm cab (so comparing ~170 watts to ~250 watts) at various gigs I'm always impressed by how big the tube amp can sound despite the lower power rating than the hybrid. The terror is no slouch, but given the choice I'd take the AD200 over the terror 10 times out of 10 for sound/feel.

The schlep is another question. I like tube amps. I often gig tube amps. There are gigs where I just don't feel like carrying a tube amp. I use a small cart to carry my gear most of the time (or road cases with wheels in some cases), if the venue is too small/cramped for the cart/case and I'm going to have to worm my way through with the cab already, doing so with my AD200 isn't appealing. When I have no advanced knowledge of the load in, or know it's going to be a hard one with a cart and I'll have to hand carry everything, I'll usually pack the terror. Sometimes I pack both and decide what mood I'm in when I see the load in/stage.

Morning all,
I finally got to test out an Orange amp at a jam yesterday. I've always loved the 'Orange Sound' from being a doom/sludge metal fan and I'm considering adding a piece of Orange gear to my arsenal. The only thing that I'm going back and forth on is the question of combo or head? Seeing as how the 100w Crush Combo, Terror Bass Head, Little Bass Thing and OB-1 300 are all close in price, what are the main differences (aside from the obvious) between all these amps?

Thanks in advance for the help.

I've had the AD200, TB500, and OB1-500. I really like the AD200 and got the terror as a backup option for a similar sound. They're great sounding amps as long as you like the baked in sound. Didn't care the OB1 at all. The drive sound was not my style, so at that point it was an over sized, overweight, basic solid state amp with very limited features relative to others in the price range. I got it in trade and was happy to sell it off at the earliest convenience. No experience with the LBT and I've always regarded the crush (whether deserved or not) as an entry level product not on par with the rest.

 

[Bassi5t]

Has anyone tried both the OBC 115 and the Fender Bassman Neo115? How do they compare?

 

[Auer]

Didn't care the OB1 at all. The drive sound was not my style, so at that point it was an over sized, overweight, basic solid state amp with very limited features relative to others in the price range. I got it in trade and was happy to sell it off at the earliest convenience. No experience with the LBT and I've always regarded the crush (whether deserved or not) as an entry level product not on par with the rest.

Too bad, the crunchy distortion/od from the gain and ability to blend it in is delicious.

The Crush 100 is pretty versatile and decently loud for the wattage.

I think Orange does class A/B very well

 

[Flatwound]

I bought the TB500 because I wanted the TB500. About 3 or so years ago, I was looking for a new amp, and once I saw a video of the TB500, I watched every YouTube video I could find about it. I was looking for something lightweight, and thought about the ELF, but I was really captivated by the TB.

I haven't looked back. I've never even played an AD200, although I'd like to try one sometime.

The TB500, with 2 OBC112's, will set you back around $2K or so USD.

Here's a pic from last Saturday's gig.

 

[Auer]

I bought the TB500 because I wanted the TB500. About 3 or so years ago, I was looking for a new amp, and once I saw a video of the TB500, I watched every YouTube video I could find about it. I was looking for something lightweight, and thought about the ELF, but I was really captivated by the TB.

I haven't looked back. I've never even played an AD200, although I'd like to try one sometime.

The TB500, with 2 OBC112's, will set you back around $2K or so USD.

View attachment 5397413

Here's a pic from last Saturday's gig.

You need one more Orange cable.

 

[Flatwound]

You need one more Orange cable.

At least.

 

[Ringhammer]

I swapped the stock Ruby 12ax7's out for some good vintage Mullard 12ax7's

I discovered today that the preamp tubes in the TB500v2 are one (1) 12AX7 and one (1) 12AT7, not two (2) 12AX7's. I was assuming that it was 2 12AX7's like what is in the TB500v1/TB1000. So, one of the Mullard's will stay in, but the other will come out and a vintage 12AT7 will go in.

 

[lizardking837]

I have a 100W crush combo (and a 50W as well).
Like the sound a lot, very similar (A/B and controls) to the OB-1's.

If 100W is enough for you (And DI out) it should work very well for you.
The Blend and Gain functions are great as is the frequency sweep.

I think it's a great combo, and personally I like having one Combo around, just because.
I put wheels on mine, rolling it all over the house and whatnot when the mood strikes.

Too bad, the crunchy distortion/od from the gain and ability to blend it in is delicious.

The Crush 100 is pretty versatile and decently loud for the wattage.

I think Orange does class A/B very well

This is about where I'm at right now. I love the 100w 1 x 15 combo form factor (I currently have an Acoustic), and I'm really falling back in love with that Doomy/Sludgy A/B distortion sound. It's gonna come down to the 3 Ps: Price, Power and, of course a Project to justify it...

 

[ColdEye]

Does anyone know if the effects loop on the Little Bass Thing is series or parallel?