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Official Zon Club Part 5

Discussion in 'Basses [BG]' started by smperry, Jan 10, 2014.


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  1. HeavyJazz

    HeavyJazz Supporting Member

    Jan 26, 2013
    Virginia
    Email is painfully easy though. There's no excuse for not popping off a quick email concerning a change in ETA or other concerns. It takes seconds.
     
  2. mrgittleman

    mrgittleman

    Dec 23, 2003
    NYC
    For me the lack of communication is a less egregious offense then the constant lying. If someone communicates with you but they lie constantly then you can’t trust them. Trust is the foundation that all relationships are based on.
     
    Darren02, Maiden Bass and basschanges like this.
  3. HeavyJazz

    HeavyJazz Supporting Member

    Jan 26, 2013
    Virginia
    I always tell my vendors "I can handle bad news. What I can't handle is no or false news."
     
  4. Angus

    Angus Supporting Member

    Apr 16, 2000
    Palo Alto, CA
    I was not arguing that good communication cannot be done- of course it is. I'm just saying that that particular solution (hiring a secretarial position) is not easy.

    That is where the money already goes, I think.
     
  5. J.Wolf

    J.Wolf Gear Reviewer - Bass Musician Magazine Supporting Member

    Apr 29, 2003
    Asheville, NC
    Good point, it seems impossible that in the bay area they couldn’t find somebody young and hungry who wanted to learn the craft and was willing to be a low paid or unpaid “intern“ who could help carry the load, and free up some time for communication to get handled. That’s still assumes that handling communication effectively is an important priority.
     
    FlatwoundFunk, kesslari and Fuzzbass like this.
  6. Vic

    Vic There's more music in the nuance than the notes. Supporting Member

    Oct 14, 2002
    Central Illinois
    Staff, Bass Gear Magazine
    interesting side point...

    noting their backlog remains full of orders, keeping them fully utilized making and selling instruments non-stop despite all this, i guess it just goes to show his instruments are so good they're still worth pursuing regardless of these difficulties for at least most of his customers.

    if nothing else, makes me happier as an owner to have a couple i'm thrilled with already in hand of these highly sought after and potentially very difficult to get instruments.
     
    TolerancEJ and kesslari like this.
  7. Fuzzbass

    Fuzzbass P5 with overdrive Gold Supporting Member

    This. Internship, apprenticeship, whatever. Someone with very good communication skills, and enough shop skills to be trainable.
     
    FlatwoundFunk, J.Wolf and TolerancEJ like this.
  8. lowendmafia

    lowendmafia Supporting Member

    Oct 11, 2007
    Sacramento, California
    The laws in CA wouldn’t allow something like that.

    You can’t do unpaid internships in California unless certain requirements are met, most notably it’s through a school or has trade school level training.

    Minimum wage in California is now $11.00 and rising. That’s an annual FT salary of $22,880.

    It is also a legal requirement that if a person works “mostly” for your business you must offer them health insurance and other benefits. Let’s says it’s 50% benefit cost. Now you are talking $34,320.

     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2019
    FlatwoundFunk and Fuzzbass like this.
  9. J.Wolf

    J.Wolf Gear Reviewer - Bass Musician Magazine Supporting Member

    Apr 29, 2003
    Asheville, NC
    10 hours a week would do it, IMO. When I worked for ZON in the office, I think I worked 20 hours a week at the very most. Mind you, it was 2003 or 4.
     
    Fuzzbass and TolerancEJ like this.
  10. lowendmafia

    lowendmafia Supporting Member

    Oct 11, 2007
    Sacramento, California
    I am not disputing that, but I am saying that the apprentice model probably wouldn't work... at least a "legal" apprentice model. Certainly companies pay people under the table, etc.

     
  11. J.Wolf

    J.Wolf Gear Reviewer - Bass Musician Magazine Supporting Member

    Apr 29, 2003
    Asheville, NC
    I'm just saying they wouldn't require full time or even 20 hr/week support to achieve their communication goals and needs. So CA's regs on F/T employment dont necessarily apply. 10 hours of minimum wage a week seems like a reasonable investment in upholding the companies CS needs.

    what was that about getting in the weeds :)


    In the end, they'll either prioritize this situation, or they wont. And thankfully the basses will kick major butt either way.
     
    Fuzzbass likes this.
  12. lowendmafia

    lowendmafia Supporting Member

    Oct 11, 2007
    Sacramento, California
    Well, that's not an apprenticeship then. That's a part-time shop helper.
     
  13. J.Wolf

    J.Wolf Gear Reviewer - Bass Musician Magazine Supporting Member

    Apr 29, 2003
    Asheville, NC
    correct. I said unpaid or low paid intern, you said thats not legal in CA, so I clarified above to minimum wage "part time employee".
     
  14. pickles

    pickles Gold Supporting Member

    Mar 23, 2000
    Ventura, CA
    My guess is Joe has more business than he needs and wants to spend his time obsessing over perfecting the instruments.
     
  15. Vic

    Vic There's more music in the nuance than the notes. Supporting Member

    Oct 14, 2002
    Central Illinois
    Staff, Bass Gear Magazine
    if that's true, it's still manageable. he just needs to be a lot more honest about actual delivery. if it's gonna' be three years before he can build a given bass, with the time schedule/tasks he wants to have in place, just say so. the uber patient customer will go ahead and add himself to the backlog. others simply don't place the order.

    it's all about managing expectation with honest and obtainable forecasting.

    totally do-able without adding any resources to the shop. the work and money flow will self govern itself based on how he chooses to occupy himself with what.
     
  16. Maiden Bass

    Maiden Bass Supporting Member

    Feb 11, 2007
    Reno / Sparks, NV

    So, this previous post was supposed to be my last in the Zon Club, however since this thread has not turned into a warning thread, and since there is a huge second part of my story that I was not able to tell before now, I will post here one last time.

    In addition to the previous information I gave everyone about Joe Zon not delivering my bass for about 18 months now, he suckered me a second time in mid October!

    So I spoke with Joe Zon over the phone in mid October, he promised me that my Legacy Elite 5 string would be done soon and when I told him that I also needed a 4 string now (tuned BEAD) he told me that a black Legacy Elite 4 string had just become available (a person or a dealer backed out) and it was almost finished and he guaranteed me that I would have this bass by the end of November!!!
    So I paid him in full for it, and my price was $4,400 total.
    After that I only received an email in mid December saying it's still not done!

    So Joe Zon ripped me off TWICE!
    I currently have a dispute with Visa for non receipt of merchandise and Joe Zon has to show proof that I received the bass (which I never did) or I get all of my money back, and there is only a little more time left to go before this is over.

    So all you Zon Apologists out there, you are all dead wrong, Joe Zon has turned into a straight up Liar and Thief!
    He's running a Ponzi Scheme taking money from current orders that pay for past orders and there needs to be a Warning Thread on Talkbass about this!

    Mods if you want to see the police report and the Visa dispute please send me a private message and I will be more than happy to show you!

    This thread needs to be turned into a WARNING Thread to warn others! This is my only reason why I am posting, to help others so they don't get screwed over like I did!

    Take care.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2019 at 8:13 PM
    mrgittleman likes this.
  17. Honestly, I am pretty sad to read these updates. I've been a long time huge fan of Zon basses going back as far as college. My first big purchase after graduation (and getting real paychecks) was a Sonus Special V that I used as my only main bass for 18 years. It developed a lot of neck issues (it's from back when they didn't use truss rods) and I was thinking about sending it to them to get some work done. Glad I didn't now since It might have just sat on a bench for 2 years.

    I am really hoping this is just a bump in the road for Joe/them. I had it in mind that I wanted to order a new 6 string in the future. Ugh.
     
  18. I wish someone at Zon could drop by and comment on behalf of the company. We are only reading one side of the story.
     
    LeonD likes this.
  19. ModuMan

    ModuMan How many is too many? Supporting Member

    Feb 23, 2007
    Bristol, CT #19
    I agree. Until I now I would have (and did) just said "well, they take a while but you'll get it!" But I don't like that he paid for a bass in full and didn't get it when he was promised. A deposit is one thing but that's not cool.

    Some input from Zon would be very helpful.
     
    TolerancEJ likes this.
  20. Maiden Bass

    Maiden Bass Supporting Member

    Feb 11, 2007
    Reno / Sparks, NV
    Dude wake up and help your fellow Talkbass members out!
    That's the only reason I'm here! I am trying to help people!

    You go get Joe Zon's side of the story and he will LIE right to your face!
    I have police reports and Visa dispute to prove it!
    I'm lucky enough to be getting all of my money ($4650 and $4400) back, but others on Talkbass won't be so lucky!

    Here is a photo of me, Joe Zon, and his employee Mark at his shop in Redwood City just a couple years ago!
    I looked up to Joe and thought the world of him! I've purchased about 5 or 6 basses from him before this.

    Then he does this to me?
    I know for sure now that my insurance company (USAA) is suing him!
    I would never be posting this if it was not 100% true.

    This thread needs to be a Warning Thread!

    IMAG0154.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2019 at 8:15 PM

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