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OK, I'm kinda new to Primus...

#21
"Oh, you're such a darling. The ability to express your personal opinions in a more tactful manner may help to increase their value."


Oh, is this a meeting of the delicate flower sniffing society? I thought we were all burly viking bass players here. OK, I'll be more gentle for you. I have oft found the discordant meanderings of primus to be an example of the worst mindset about bass playing- which is to say, the physical, chop-laden aspect of playing only for other bass players. I find very little value in music that's whole purpose seems to be to make adolescent boys (even those who have been on the planet for a long time) harangue their girlfriends (or wives ) with "Dude, did you hear that guy rip? He was slapping and popping and pooping and standing on one leg!" It has very little musical value and encourages an unhelpful set of priorities in young players (the result of which can be heard on the floor of any guitar store at wank-fest time).
 
#22
Its all about tolerance, man.
Les gets props not because he's the epitome of what the bass has BEEN...
He gets props because he'll always be known as one of the first to bring it up to the front of the stage and use it as a songwriting instrument; hardly traditional, and obviously not to your taste, but he inspired me and countless others; we don't necessarily sound like him, but we couldn't have done what we do without him.
so lay off Les!

Alex
 
#24
I know exactly how we got a tune on Dawson's Creek (though it has precious little to do with bass playing or the subject at hand). We recorded an album, our label put it out and several months later, we were offered a few thousand dollars for them to use a clip in an episode of the show. That money allowed us to stay in a few hotels while on tour and resulted in us selling some extra copies of the album. It's not a favorite show of mine, but as far as I know, the target audience is pretty young women- which is a lot better than the pimply dweebs yanking it over bass players playing fast. Now, doesn't Primus do the South Park theme? So, it's OK for them to do a TV song for money, but not some indie band?

Way to discredit my opinion by citing an accomplishment.
 
#26
He was slapping and popping and pooping and standing on one leg!" It has very little musical value and encourages an unhelpful set of priorities in young players (the result of which can be heard on the floor of any guitar store at wank-fest time).
Click to expand...


I like Primus, Les, and everything about the band. Primus is a fun band to listen to. Simple is that. I dont really care if he goes out of tune on Tommy the Cat. The song is a great song to listen to. Sometimes all that stuff that we read indepth to doesnt really matter. Its what the music makes you feel, if you like what youre feeling its doing its job for you.

...Dawsons Creek...Indie....probally not.
 
#27
First of all...FRIZZLE FRY IS A MUST HAVE. Antipop and Sailing follow directly behind.

corinpills

I'm not going to say that your opinion is wrong, many I know have shown disinterest in Primus' music. I would say that Les Claypool is an amazing bassist who was willing to go out on a limb and play bass the way he wanted to, whether or not people would dig it. He leaves mistakes on some songs, showing that he plays for himself, and not to make a ton of money. If you listen to Oysterhead you will hear a little more of his technical playing. Claypool doesn't have to cop others material to make it. He's an original, the way all musicians should want to be. In regards to saying they are just playing for attention, I would like to remind you of the many songs they have with a simple repeating bass line, sometimes without a true groove. He just plays what comes to his head for the most part. Bassists have to appreciate a player who plays what he wants no matter the difficulty or feel. If it's possible to produce these sounds on bass, why not use those sounds?
 
#28
"Way to state your opinion by rudely stomping on everyone else's..."

Darling, I haven't even begun to get rude. That's not rudeness, Josh, those are adjectives. Did I ever say that nobody has the right to enjoy Primus if they want to? No. I simply offered the opinion that they encourage focusing on surface elements of bass playing that are detrimental to young bass players and that's who seems to dominate their audience. You guys are so afraid of another viewpoint that you've responded by being incredibly defensive and somehow equating licensing music (a business decision which a band signed to a label has very little choice in) with some sort of artistic deficiency. Be men, state your opinions with something to back them up. A sneer is a pretty weak argument. Convince me that Les Claypool belongs in the pantheon of great songwriters with Gershwin and Jerome Kern. I'm listening, explain it to me. I hear a bass player who gets credit for "innovations" that sound an awful lot like what Tony Levin was doing 10 years earlier, a guy who can't sing and writes joke lyrics almost exclusively, a weak guitar player and an overall sound that is all flash and no substance. Now, I didn't see anything at the beginning of this thread that said "only post if you have something positive to say about Primus".

This thread has absolutely nothing at all to do with my band having a song on Dawson's Creek- which, by the way, you'd both saw off your left thumb for. In fact, I think that anyone on an indie label would be quite surprised if a network TV show wanted to license one of their tunes. You may have noticed that shows on the WB network, for instance, use Warner Brothers music almost exclusively, so it's kind of a bit of coup to get a tune on that network. Bearing in mind that I didn't bring this up, if you think that it's so beneath you to have a song in a TV show (and , once again, Primus, South Park), I challange you to try to do it. Anybody can just sit back and scoff at what someone else is doing. What are you doing?
 
#30
Originally posted by corinpills
I simply offered the opinion that they encourage focusing on surface elements of bass playing that are detrimental to young bass players and that's who seems to dominate their audience. You guys are so afraid of another viewpoint that you've responded by being incredibly defensive and somehow equating licensing music (a business decision which a band signed to a label has very little choice in) with some sort of artistic deficiency. Be men, state your opinions with something to back them up. A sneer is a pretty weak argument. Convince me that Les Claypool belongs in the pantheon of great songwriters with Gershwin and Jerome Kern...
Click to expand...

How exactly is Primus "encouraging" young bass players to focus on aspects of playing that may be detrimental? I certainly don't recall any interview with them saying "Slap and pop as fast as you possibly can, kids!," though I admit I haven't really been looking for Primus interviews. If some people (and yes, believe me, I've heard them too) choose to wank away faster than they're really able or need to, it's not someone else's fault. I'm a relatively new bassist, and though I listen to Primus from time to time, the thought "Screw playing scales, I'm gonna practice slapping 32-nd notes!" has yet to occur to me.
And who's been comparing his songwriting abilities to those of the Gershwins?
I'm sincerely curious. I realize people have different tastes in music (my friends have complained about half my CDs when I play them in the car).
 
#31
Originally posted by Angus
.

And 2 uprights. I'm sure he owns other basses besides his Jazzes and CTs, so who knows.
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yea darrin huff made him one.....don't think les plays it...but he probably still has it somewhere(darrin made it to meet claypool, not by request from claypool)
 
#32
Originally posted by funk_engineer


How exactly is Primus "encouraging" young bass players to focus on aspects of playing that may be detrimental? I certainly don't recall any interview with them saying "Slap and pop as fast as you possibly can, kids!," though I admit I haven't really been looking for Primus interviews. If some people (and yes, believe me, I've heard them too) choose to wank away faster than they're really able or need to, it's not someone else's fault. I'm a relatively new bassist, and though I listen to Primus from time to time, the thought "Screw playing scales, I'm gonna practice slapping 32-nd notes!" has yet to occur to me.
And who's been comparing his songwriting abilities to those of the Gershwins?
I'm sincerely curious. I realize people have different tastes in music (my friends have complained about half my CDs when I play them in the car).
Click to expand...

Les is definatlly a nutty slap player, but he has a solid foundation, he plays sloppily but he plays well....he hits all the right notes and isn't in anyway a bad thing for a young bassist to be aspiring towards, but if a young bassist is ONLY looking to les for inspiration then there may be a problem. if you hear oysterhead or frog brigade stuff, the bass playing is less fancy slap-slop and more of a subdued "I'm les claypool hanging in the backround a bit" feel...esp. oysterhead
 
#33
i love les as much as anybody - we're into the same guys, and at a time when the record industry was looking for "relevant" "dawson's creek-able" type "music" he dared to be himself and not try to "sell".

as for primus, i'd say their best offering was frizzle fry, imo.

just keep the boy away from fretless, mkay? :eek: :p. especially live. yikes.
 
#34
Originally posted by corinpills
Oh, is this a meeting of the delicate flower sniffing society? I thought we were all burly viking bass players here. OK, I'll be more gentle for you.

i highly suggest you re-read the rules and regulations. its got nothing to do with being a delicate gentle flower sniffing society, but it has everything to do with respect to other members...you dont necessarily have to directly insult a memeber to offend them. So next time use some tact. Thanks.
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#35
10-4, good buddy. In the interest of avoiding debate, let me just say that Les is wonderful, all bass players are truly solid citizens who keep their lawn lovely and vote on a regular basis. There is no such thing as overplaying, all bass players are equally fabulous and I have no negative opinions of anything. Everything discussed on this board is all cheescake and fairy dust as far I am concerned. From now on, I will only be a caring nurturer. :) :) :)
 
#36
Originally posted by corinpills
10-4, good buddy. In the interest of avoiding debate, let me just say that Les is wonderful, all bass players are truly solid citizens who keep their lawn lovely and vote on a regular basis. There is no such thing as overplaying, all bass players are equally fabulous and I have no negative opinions of anything. Everything discussed on this board is all cheescake and fairy dust as far I am concerned. From now on, I will only be a caring nurturer. :) :) :)
Click to expand...

no bodies saying you cant debate stuff. Heck we do that all the time. All we're saying is use a little bit of tact. Because as stated before, you're words will hold more weight when you use tact.

Or is your ego that fragile that it hurts your feelings and you have to resort to sarcasm when someone disagrees with you?
 
#37
Actually, I disagree with you there. In looking back over these posts, I admit that some of the words I used about Les Caypool were a bit vitriolic, sarcastic and, perhaps, means-spirited if taken at face value (certainly a hazard of web communication, and maybe the reason so much of it is bland and dull), but I don't think I said anything untoward to any member of this board. I also don't think that being more tactful would increase or decrease the value of my statement (I'm not sure it has iny intrinsic value. It's just an opinion, after all). I think that the only thing my writing style caused was nasty little reactions- which, once again, does not change the import of my statement. I think I actually expressed a valid opinion about what impact Primus' music might have on aspiring bass players and I'd be interested in hearing what other experienced bass players think of that. This isn't a music industry forum and that seemed to be the basis of a lot of (misguided) discussion in this topic.

Perhaps I overstated my aversion to the esteemed Mr. Claypool's style as a reaction to the bland politeness that permeates this board. I'd have loved it if someone had written back that Les Caypool is the greatest thing they've ever heard, they totally love his music and don't listen to anything else. Everybody is so concerned with politely respecting each other's opinions that it's hard to actually get a decent discussion going here- and I mean more than insults. My ego is fine, thanks for asking.
 
#38
Never badmouth any musician. Do you have millions of bassists looking up to you?.... I didn't think so.

You have to learn to appriciate any kind of way someone plays, esp. if they step out of the box. It is hard to define music. You can see music as for example Jazz as pure music. But isnt the point of music to create something, like an artist, your own representation of something?

Anyway, Primus is all about rythem and groove. Which it IMO does. Sure you can see only one side of something, but try seeing other aspects of it, different point of views. Maybe it's just not your thing. Everone has diferent tastes, but I think that that is just stubborn.

just my two cents
Alexx
 

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