Older P's - under the hood - capacitor regime

[KidAmnesia]

I have a six position rotary switch in the tone pot hole of my PBass with the 1st position open and positions 2-6 with caps .01uf, .022uf, .033uf, .047uf and .10uf. It’s essentially a home-made Stellartone control.

In the volume pot hole I have 250k/250k ohm dual concentric pots with the top knob as volume and the “ring” knob as the tone control. I keep the tone fully counter-clockwise (clockdumb) most of the time and click to the cap I want to use with the rotary switch. With the first three caps (.01, .22, & .33) I usually leave the tone ring fully clockwise, but with the .047uf & .10uf caps I’ll turn the tone ring a little clockwise to thin-out some of the mud depending on the song. I play most of the time with the cap selector on .01uf & select more treble reduction from there.

I went for a 3 way switch with a .033 and .005 uf. caps, no tone pot.

.033 is mellow without completely losing clarity and .005 works more as a nasal mid bump than a treble cut. Sounds great with a bit of overdrive.

 

[Bass4ThePublic]

Did you think you would notice with the tone cap 99% bypassed?

yes. I was 16 and capacitors are cheap lol. I think I still have that old tone pot laying around. I absolutely COVERED the top of the pot with solder. I ended up parting that bass out, and I have stuck with 0.05uf caps since. Gosh, after all those basses owned and built it feels like a lifetime ago.

 

[micguy]

Flatwounds are cheaper in the long run. The Pyramids on my Starfire get changed every 4-5 years. I’ve never had rounds that last that long.

It was a joke…

 

[Dark Horse]

My p basses typically get either .068uf or .1uf caps, depending on the voicing of the bass

 

[Iridescentone]

Now I'm wondering why I never tried a Stellartone on a P or J bass.

Note to self....

 

[REV]

Here's a question. With the tone control up full will the sound be different between a .1uf cap and a .047uf cap?

 

[fretno]

‘68 stock

 

[SteveCS]

this thread has peaked my curiosity what a PIO .1 cap might sound like.

IME, it will sound just like any other 0.1uF ceramic disc, orange drop, polyester/mylar film, mica or any other non-electrolytic type. 99.9999% of any audible differences will be due to manufacturing tolerances, which can be as high as ±20%, or because the oil has leaked out and turned the whole exercise into a crap-shoot. I like Orange Drops because they are robust, easy to handle and easy to read, not because of any tone benefits.

The other thing to consider is that tighter-tolerance capacitors aren't always made that way - sometimes they are just taken from bigger manufacturing batches. So if you have a ±20% unit, the chance of it being close to nominal value is practically NIL. This is because everything ±5% has been removed and put in the premium-priced ±5% bin. Likewise for the ±10% items. So a ±20% will probably be 10-20% below or 10-20% above nominal!! If you now try to compare a ±1% poly film with a ±20% Orange Drop or PIO, you can bet the ranch they will be different, by at least 9%. Even worse, if you have two ±20% units, the difference could plausibly be as much as 40%. if one if from the low-side and the other from the high-side. .04uF is audible.

Bottom line is capacitors are cheap - get a bag and try an bunch until you find one that does what you want.

 

[Lo-E]

I ordered a couple of .01 caps a while back but I haven't tried putting them in a bass yet. My regime is usually to put in a .005 orange drop cap if a bass has a stock .002 cap, which I just did in the '77 Jazz with the finish issue. Seeing this thread inspires me to experiment with an .01 cap - maybe I'll drop one in my Road Worn P with flats and see how it works.

Are these really the values you’re using? Are you sure you’re not off by a factor of 10?

 

[ad9000]

Are these really the values you’re using? Are you sure you’re not off by a factor of 10?

Yes I am. Math was never really my strong suit, especially when decimal points are involved.

 

[2saddleslab]

Here's a question. With the tone control up full will the sound be different between a .1uf cap and a .047uf cap?

No, the capacitor only comes into effect when the tone knob is used, not wide open.

 

[SteveCS]

I have a Nordstrand Tone Drop in one of my passive basses. Push/pull tone knob: 0.047 down, 0.1 up

One of mine has 2 caps on the same pot - 500k with a cap at each and and hot to the lug. Turn the knob CW for one value and CCW for the other. Half way and there is 250k each way, so they are effectively 'off'. Works a treat.

I went for a 3 way switch with a .033 and .005 uf. caps, no tone pot.

With a 3-way pickup selector type switch is it possible to get 3 settings: Cap 1, Cap 2 and Cap 1+2:

 

[Major Seven]

Yes I am. Math was never really my strong suit, especially when decimal points are involved.

Milli, micro, nano, pico, gigabytes, terabytes. I count zeros. Only scientific notation has meaning for me.

 

[micguy]

The other thing to consider is that tighter-tolerance capacitors aren't always made that way - sometimes they are just taken from bigger manufacturing batches. So if you have a ±20% unit, the chance of it being close to nominal value is practically NIL.

I've heard that said about resistors and capacitors, and it sounds logical. Still, despite 40 plus years designing audio gear, including plenty of circuits, I've never seen a shred of evidence of that practice. I have seen lots of 10% parts that were well within 5% of nominal value - a fair amount within a percent. 20% parts I can't speak to - those are very rare nowadays; you have to go back to mid 20th century or before to see a lot of those.

 

[KidAmnesia]

With a 3-way pickup selector type switch is it possible to get 3 settings: Cap 1, Cap 2 and Cap 1+2:
View attachment 7523798

I used an on-off-on switch. It's either one of the caps or no cap at all.

 

[edwinhurwitz]

It was a joke…

Oops. Mea culpa.