Opinions on Shuttle 12.0

[rpsands]

1200 watts RMS into 8 ohms is too much power for most cabinets on the market under most conditions IMO and IME. If a player is looking for this kind of power, perhaps a seperate power amp may be a better choice, as this would fall under a specialty application in my book.

The balance control would be more useable I suppose but where to put is is a bigger challenge than you might think.

A pair of fEarfuls! Hurr. I guess I could suck it up and run 375 @ 8 x 2 but 600w @ 4 from one side would be not that much less, y'know?

Seems like more people want to run multiple 4 ohm cabs these days so you guys are definitely tailoring to the market in that regard.

I would put the balance control on the back next to the speaker outputs...that's not the kind of thing you should need to set too often.

 

[agedhorse]

A pair of fEarfuls! Hurr. I guess I could suck it up and run 375 @ 8 x 2 but 600w @ 4 from one side would be not that much less, y'know?

It's the limits of mechanical excursion that are the issue. There is a direct tradeoff between sensitivity and Xmax (and ultimately Xmech). To increase Xmax causes the sensitivity to fall because there is more wire outside the primary magnetic field which dissipates heat but does (or causes) no useful work until it moves into the gap but at that point more wire is moving back out of the gap. This is a classic and difficult tradeoff all manufacturers face.

Seems like more people want to run multiple 4 ohm cabs these days so you guys are definitely tailoring to the market in that regard.

IMO, it's because typically this offers the best real world tradeoff between sensitivity and power handling within a given speaker enclosure profile. Size and weight factor heavily into this of course.

I would put the balance control on the back next to the speaker outputs...that's not the kind of thing you should need to set too often.

Me too, except there's no room

 

[MikeBass]

I have 5 more classes to go for this Master's - then it is goodbye to the Shuttle 6.0 and hello to the 12.0 and another Accugroove Tri-115. Right now, it's not the money...it is the time!

Anyway, the 6.0/Tri rig is great for the Church gigs I'm doing now - but isn't bigger better? I think that the 12.0 and 2x Tri-115's would sound good

Dan K.

Not to derail, but please do tell about this rig.
Maybe another thread, but man, I bet it's a brutal sounding set-up!

 

[rpsands]

It's the limits of mechanical excursion that are the issue. There is a direct tradeoff between sensitivity and Xmax (and ultimately Xmech). To increase Xmax causes the sensitivity to fall because there is more wire outside the primary magnetic field which dissipates heat but does (or causes) no useful work until it moves into the gap but at that point more wire is moving back out of the gap. This is a classic and difficult tradeoff all manufacturers face.


IMO, it's because typically this offers the best real world tradeoff between sensitivity and power handling within a given speaker enclosure profile. Size and weight factor heavily into this of course.



Me too, except there's no room

Yeah obviously I agree it's a special case. The 3015LFs can take it though Hopefully speaker manufacture gets to the point where it no longer is a special case.

Generally speaking I agree about the multiple 4 ohm cabs thing, but unfortunately some drivers are just not available in 4 ohms

Guess I'll keep hoping for either you guys or EA to make a modern lightweight preamp that puts out enough juice to drive a power amp.

 

[svtb15]

For me its the amp that takes a lickin' yet keeps on tickin'
Versatile and Loud too..intuitive and simple controls... indoor gigs, outdoor gigs,, DI to Inear only gigs...
Light to carry.. Im sold... ive been using single 12 cabs in pairs for a while and thinking its may be time to try a pair of Uber 2x10s soon... Just GAS'in.

 

[agedhorse]

Yeah obviously I agree it's a special case. The 3015LFs can take it though Hopefully speaker manufacture gets to the point where it no longer is a special case.

Try modeling the 3015 at 1200 watts regardless of the tuning you will run out of Xmax pretty quickly at 30-40Hz.

Guess I'll keep hoping for either you guys or EA to make a modern lightweight preamp that puts out enough juice to drive a power amp.

All the Shuttles will work as a preamp, and will output +16dBv on the preamp out... plenty to drive any power amp well into clip. Even the DI out set to line level and post eq will deliver +14dB balanced, 10dB beyond clipping for most pro audio amps. Think of the Shuttles as preamps with 600 watt headphone amps built in.

 

[Red Planet]

Might I just throw in a little here?

The Genz Benz Shuttle Max 12.0 will annihilate most any amp out there I have heard and easily any light weight amp.

Who here has heard the thing into two 4 ohm Cabs Cranked?

Sick sick sick.

I will never forget the look on Page's face when I cranked the 12.0 into two 4 ohm Berg Cabs. No one was in the store and I asked could I crank it? He agreed after I explained how we would not blow the cabs. I thought the boys eyes were going to pop out his head.

OK back to regularly scheduled TB programming.

 

[rpsands]

Try modeling the 3015 at 1200 watts regardless of the tuning you will run out of Xmax pretty quickly at 30-40Hz.

A pair of 3015LFs will definitely hang with transients of 1200watts as long as you've got a good HPF, course 1200w@ 4 ohms isn't in the cards either bridged or not (since the shuttles can't handle 2 ohms). I got my numbers mixed up.

They can certainly take more than 375 though, which is what disappoints me slightly about the SM12. It's not that I need more power, but I know this can take 500w @ 8 ohms (as I have dimed my current amp into it).

Particularly if you use a good HPF like the Shuttles have built in, I don't think 1200w is likely to asplode a fEarful style cabinet (given people have used bridged PLX3402's into them) as long as it's not continuous at low hz. I want to say Greenboy modeled something like 900 watts pushed to exceeding Xlim but I might be mistaken

The issue is more that I want more than 375 on tap

All the Shuttles will work as a preamp, and will output +16dBv on the preamp out... plenty to drive any power amp well into clip. Even the DI out set to line level and post eq will deliver +14dB balanced, 10dB beyond clipping for most pro audio amps. Think of the Shuttles as preamps with 600 watt headphone amps built in.

This is very interesting. The downside is you can get a whole lot of preamp for the cost of a Shuttlemax 6.0

Do you know if the Neopak can do the same? I might try mine out through a power amp and see how it rolls if it's got enough juice. Maybe score some rack ears or something if it works out.

 

[agedhorse]

A pair of 3015LFs will definitely hang with transients of 1200watts as long as you've got a good HPF, course 1200w@ 4 ohms isn't in the cards either bridged or not (since the shuttles can't handle 2 ohms). I got my numbers mixed up.

Correct, a pair likely, a single unlikely.

This is very interesting. The downside is you can get a whole lot of preamp for the cost of a Shuttlemax 6.0

Do you know if the Neopak can do the same? I might try mine out through a power amp and see how it rolls if it's got enough juice. Maybe score some rack ears or something if it works out.

Using the ShuttleMax would be an expensive preamp, but the Shuttle 3.0 or 6.0 would not be all that costly and includes a backup power amp too.

NeoPak will work the same way.

 

[davidjbass]

I have had mine for over a week now and love it. It will gets its first test this weekend at my gig with my Ampeg SVT610HLF. But I have been running it through my single Bag End S15d and it makes my wall shake. I love combining both the FET and Tube sections.
I love the mute feature. It makes changing basses very quick and easy. I haven't even used the footswitch yet. Just looking at it is making me drool. I called and talked to Jeff about ordering rack ears for it and I told him that I loved it so much I was going to buy another one as a back up.

All four of my basses sound fantastic through it. Just a little tweek here and there and I have got the sound I want. Finally I have found a lightweight amp with the power I need.
When I have the chance I am going to run both my Ampeg 610 and my homemade 215 together with it. I want to see how many things I can knock down off of selves.

 

[Red Planet]

Well if your asking for that kind of power at that kind of weight you is out of luck.

For that kind of juice you will at least need to step up to a QSC PLX2 1804 which can yield 1200 watts into two 8 ohm cabs or 1800 into two 4 ohm cabs and only weighs13 pounds. The downside is when you stick it with a Pre (most Pres are heavier than any of the Shuttles) and a rack you now have a40-50 pound head. If you use something like PLX 02 series you have just added yet more weight.

There are many things out there you can do but do without the weight and the power you will not have.

You could always check into a MarkBass SD1200 but I have played the SD800 and unimpressed would be putting it mildly.

 

[5StringPocket]

With FET/Tube selection and a powerful eq section, a Shuttle Max 6.0 with rackmount ears would provide a great preamp for the QSC PLX2 1804. The 6.0 Max with QSC 1804 would come in at 20 pounds. The rack would probably add another 15 pounds but I'll bet this pair would sound great and be devastating. EA's new iAmp Pro would give you 1100W into 4 ohms weighing in at 9 pounds but I haven't seen any gig reports on this yet.

 

[Big String]

I will never forget the look on Page's face when I cranked the 12.0 into two 4 ohm Berg Cabs.

Hey RED, which two 4ohm Bergs ???

Also (too lazy to look up) are the power section a/b or switching type supplies? Or something else.

 

[Baird6869]

The SM 12.0 is (IMO) absolutely amazing. I have owned lots of amps, but this one is really a special thing...

I gigged it last night with Fender Jazz and P basses through a Sadowsky (Bergantino) 4x10 cab with no effects and was blown away. Smaller room, but the master volume was at 2 or so. TONS of headroom with this amp.

My 85lb SVT-CL will collect dust from this point on. No reason to use anything other than the 12.0 for gigs and rehearsals.

 

[bhubb3rd]

I am in the market for another amp and I guess I any intrigued by the 12. My primary concern is my past experience with my 6.0. After almost a year of trying to like it, I finally sold it; it was never close to as loud as my MB LM or UL 502 into a 8 ohm load. I have two Bergs, a AE210 8 ohm and a AE410 4 ohm. I would like to, on occasion, run both cabs with one head, but need a 2 ohm head or one of the dual amp options (GB SM 12, Puma 1000, UL902) Based on not being impressed with the 6.0, I wonder how I would like this. The 6.0 was marginal into 4 ohms, but pretty disappointing into 8 ohms, it could barely keep up at rehearsal. I guess the bottom line here is - are the power amps the same as my original Shuttle 6.0 I bought 2 years ago, or have they changed? Thanks!

 

[()smoke()]

hmmm, this amp has caught my attention now that i have a pair of 4 ohm cabs and i'm considering a lightweight amp to carry around when my b1500 isn't necessary...i was considering a 6.0, but i'd only be able to run one of the cabs...the idea of having the ability to run both cabs is very interesting, as is the double power amps and power supplies...

it's very light, i just wonder if it will fit in a gig bag?

 

[modulusman]

hmmm, this amp has caught my attention now that i have a pair of 4 ohm cabs and i'm considering a lightweight amp to carry around when my b1500 isn't necessary...i was considering a 6.0, but i'd only be able to run one of the cabs...the idea of having the ability to run both cabs is very interesting, as is the double power amps and power supplies...

it's very light, i just wonder if it will fit in a gig bag?

They make a gig bag for the shuttlemax 12.0.

 

[Red Planet]

Hey RED, which two 4ohm Bergs ???

Also (too lazy to look up) are the power section a/b or switching type supplies? Or something else.

I played it through a 4 ohm HS4x10 and a 4 ohm AE4x10, an AE2x10 and AE4X10, a single AE4X10, and a single HS4x10. All sounded excellent. I have to tell you though the 4 ohm SWR Golight 4x10 sounds better to me than all of them and is a heck of a lot lighter.

The Shuttle Max 12.0 into two 4 ohm cabs is just insane. The amount of low end authority, power, thgump, and articulation is insane.

 

[()smoke()]

They make a gig bag for the shuttlemax 12.0.

that would be a good option, probably even better than putting it in my bass gigbag since i imagine it's padded

...thanks for the head's up

 

[modulusman]

that would be a good option, probably even better than putting it in my bass gigbag since i imagine it's padded

...thanks for the head's up

Yeah it is padded and looks to be well made. I used one of these until my Shuttlemax bag arrived.

http://accessories.musiciansfriend.com/product/Gator-Deluxe-Music-Gear-Bag?sku=545857 The 15x15 model. They are also good quality.