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12 year scotch indeed! The good stuff sure does take time.
I'm going to piggyback on something someone else has mentioned: Most luthiers are not business men as is commonly understood. They are craftsmen, and in modern commerce they can be, uh, unconventional. The rules that many of us go by in the commerce world are very difficult for these craftsmen to comply with. Not in principle, but in practice.
I work with a guitarist who is also a luthier. Makes great stuff, lemme tell ya. But it takes him forever. The attention to detail, the choice of woods, the conceptualization of the instruments, all of it is very impressive. But Jiminy Christmas, this guy can't hit a due date if it were a piñata. I believe that the type of mind that excels at his type of talent is at cross purposes to the type that excels at commerce. But when you're a mom and pop shop, you can't really afford to hire a production manager so it's all on him. Oh, and yes, he just had a new baby, so when his wife is working, he's the baby sitter. Can't have a toddler in a wood shop, so production is waaay down now.
On the other hand, if he's doing a build for you, you'll get pictures. You'll get updates when asked. And his integrity is unquestionable, so you'll always get your instrument and love it. But you'll wait for it.
My take on the OP's issue is that the timeline is within spec, but the lack of pro-style updates is not.
I'm going to piggyback on something someone else has mentioned: Most luthiers are not business men as is commonly understood. They are craftsmen, and in modern commerce they can be, uh, unconventional. The rules that many of us go by in the commerce world are very difficult for these craftsmen to comply with. Not in principle, but in practice.
I work with a guitarist who is also a luthier. Makes great stuff, lemme tell ya. But it takes him forever. The attention to detail, the choice of woods, the conceptualization of the instruments, all of it is very impressive. But Jiminy Christmas, this guy can't hit a due date if it were a piñata. I believe that the type of mind that excels at his type of talent is at cross purposes to the type that excels at commerce. But when you're a mom and pop shop, you can't really afford to hire a production manager so it's all on him. Oh, and yes, he just had a new baby, so when his wife is working, he's the baby sitter. Can't have a toddler in a wood shop, so production is waaay down now.
On the other hand, if he's doing a build for you, you'll get pictures. You'll get updates when asked. And his integrity is unquestionable, so you'll always get your instrument and love it. But you'll wait for it.
My take on the OP's issue is that the timeline is within spec, but the lack of pro-style updates is not.
You should expect a wait for a custom bass, but if they can't tell you how long that wait is, or they keep pushing the date back then you have a legitimate concern.
It boils down to this:
If you aren't happy with the situation, get your money back.
If they won't refund you, then talk to a lawyer.
Sending links to this thread - or really even starting this thread - is just being passive-aggressive. Just be straight up with them or seek legal council if it comes to that.
It boils down to this:
If you aren't happy with the situation, get your money back.
If they won't refund you, then talk to a lawyer.
Sending links to this thread - or really even starting this thread - is just being passive-aggressive. Just be straight up with them or seek legal council if it comes to that.
While you are right that the ultimate responsibility is with the builder/business, you can't go around saying things like "find a new machinist" because that really is far too simplistic a view.
The builder needs to simply add in extra time that he knows might be needed for the machinist (or other sub/supplier) and convey that to you. Machinists that do small & fussy stuff like musical instrument parts are few and far between, even fewer who do small quantity, and fewer still who don't charge your first born son in exchange for this work. If you have someone who A) does the parts and B) does them well at a good price, you figure out ways to make the timing work, even if it's longer than you like. Burn a couple of suppliers like this "looking for someone better", and soon enough you have no one available to make the stuff for you at all.
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Last edited:
Ric5
Inactive
- Jan 29, 2008
- 29,772
- 30,452
- Disclosures
- I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
This has mail fraud written all over it. The usual scenario is that the owner(s) are in a financial bind and repeatedly tell their customers one lie after the next...hoping they can prolong whatever future plans they may have decided on. These so called company's then usually drop out of sight. I was a cop for 25 years and have investigated these type of incidents and unfortunately justice is not always seen. I would call the company and demand a refund giving them a reasonably date to return your payment. I would also say to him that if you do not receive the payment, then your next step will be to contact your local Postmaster. Good luck!
When I placed an order for an F Bass, it only took about 4 months for completion and they sent frequent pictures so I could see the progress on the instrument.
Hell, I also ordered a custom 6-string fretless bass from a private builder in the Philippines and received it within 6 months.
What I'm learning on this forum is, don't pay money up front for a custom build that you can't afford to lose.
If the company needs 15 months to build a bass is either because they don't how to be efficient or they are a big name with several basses on order ahead of you but if this is the case they should give a very close estimate delivery date.
These luthiers should learn when to stop taking orders if they know they will be in trouble to deliver on time.
What country are you located? We dont have mandatory holidays in US this week, unless they are taking vacation with money of customers that are still waitinh for their basses.
These luthiers should learn when to stop taking orders if they know they will be in trouble to deliver on time.
What country are you located? We dont have mandatory holidays in US this week, unless they are taking vacation with money of customers that are still waitinh for their basses.
In my experience, custom builds only work if you have direct access to the folks making them. That is, you can visit, check the wood they are using, the neck shape, the feel and the weight during construction. Ordering a set of specs blindly and hoping for the best has never worked well for me. Now, were I order a Fodera, I'd be pretty sure I'd get what I wanted - because they don't really change their base outline of construction (unless you really want them to...) - so I expect that I will, in the future, order an Emperor with flame walnut top over alder, set neck, thin neck profile. I'm highly confident that this will be what I want - but I'm really only ordering a few specific things.
Holidays are never mandatory for the self-employed; rare enough that they are optional (BTDT).
Presidents' Day (observed) was a Federal Holiday Monday Feb 15 in the US...
I hope he come back with enough motivation to finish this bass and not thinking on spring break
If the builder is still offering his services on TB then maybe folks should know who it is so someone else doesn't lay money down.
Exactly---- people need to redefine Custom- "Custom" used to mean you are getting a ONE of a KIND thing, that you are defining most every aspect of- NOT picking some colors and from a set of pre-defined options.
Tell that to today's typical Harley rider.
btw, some banks will do credit card chargebacks up to 18 months.
If any builder wants all the money up front .... run.The 2 of you should be able to come to a reasonable amount for a down down payment to get the work started.Based on the actual cost of items used.You should be receiving pics of the said damage other wise I'd assume it's bs.and a lot of it.I'd be looking at getting my money back.You can find a reputable builder thru here that will be more than happy to work with you.
