Phil Jones speaker cables - worth it?

[Deleted member 165050]

PJB gear is not cheap. Relative to the cost of the rig, is $139 really that much? It's like making sure you have a genuine Apple USB cable.

Plus, cheap cables can in extreme circumstances fail, kill your amp, and overload the local sub-station creating a negative inverse feedback loop causing quantum instability and ultimately resulting in hyperluminal proton expulsion at the subatomic level and nuclear catastrophe.

 

[Killing Floor]

Step 1 - Don’t be dumb.
Step 2 - Rattlesnake Speaker Cable with Neutrik connectors. $40 and they have sales all the time.
Step 3 - Never worry about your cable or again.

 

[fishdreams]

I have one of these, Sinobas Amps, who also made my cabs. Cable are made to order, Neutrik plugs. Excellent cable for $35. Link Removed

 

[Engle]

I'm with you on this.

But then, their whole thing has always looked to me like a thought experiment carried to illogical extremes.

Yeah, I don’t like to discount innovations just because they are different, but I don’t see the advantage of that many tiny drivers.
I could be wrong, I often am.

 

[agedhorse]

It's a hypothetical in the description of the cable on their website (quoted below) so I'm leaning towards questionable.

"Just think, if you have a 4-ohm speaker and a 0.5-ohm speaker cable, you could be losing at certain frequencies 11% of your amp power through the cable!

For every 100 watts your amp is believed to be given out, it may only be 89 watts! Obviously, it pays to use high current cables if you are running low impedance speakers with your amp. Unless, you can afford to burn those watts away just to heat up your cables!"

Hypothetically, if you were to send me $100, it might make my morning coffee taste better and make me less grumpy... I'd be happy to test this out if you were to send me $100 (hypothetically of course)

 

[DrMole]

PJB gear is not cheap. Relative to the cost of the rig, is $139 really that much? It's like making sure you have a genuine Apple USB cable.

Plus, cheap cables can in extreme circumstances fail, kill your amp, and overload the local sub-station creating a negative inverse feedback loop causing quantum instability and ultimately resulting in hyperluminal proton expulsion at the subatomic level and nuclear catastrophe.

$139 is ridiculous when an equivalent quality cable can be purchased easily for 1/4 of that.

This coming from a guy who does not wince at $25 for 4 pints of ale.

 

[TexasHeat]

Using inferior cables will greatly impair the performance of your system, even more so if you are running a 4 ohm speaker load."

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no...

and long cables can suck tone,

So, about this.... long instrument cables can degrade tone, but not speaker cables.

 

[agedhorse]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no...


So, about this.... long instrument cables can degrade tone, but not speaker cables.

Very long, undersized for the application speaker cables can in fact degrade the performance.

The key bit of information you are missing is that the length versus the gauge versus the power (current) versus the load impedance. All 4 variable factor into the equation.

 

[Gizmot]

It's true - - you can lose significant amplifier power with certain combinations of long cable runs and thin wire. If you want to see the actual power losses, there are a number of online calculators that will let you plug in wire size and amp power that will show you how much you'll lose. Here's one from EV: Cableloss Calculator by Electro-Voice. In most cases, if you're only using a few feet / meters of cable, you can get away with using 16 or even 18 gauge wire.

 

[Redbrangus]

.... if you're only using a few feet / meters of cable, you can get away with using 16 or even 18 gauge wire.

This. However, I like to use heavier gauge (AWG 14 - 16) for the mechanical sturdiness of the cable. 12 gauge is overkill in any bass amp situation -- how long is that run between the amp and cab?

 

[DrMole]

This. However, I like to use heavier gauge (AWG 14 - 16) for the mechanical sturdiness of the cable. 12 gauge is overkill in any bass amp situation -- how long is that run between the amp and cab?

Double this.^^^
4-6 feet of 14-16 gauge copper wire with Neutrik connectors should not see a 3 digit price tag- unless they come with a private massage...oh wait, wrong thread

 

[agedhorse]

With some jack plates, generally plastic, heavy, still cables can break the plastic. They can also pull light weight amps off the back of the cab.

 

[Cave Puppy]

I, for one, will NEVER buy or use another PJB product ever again. I bought the 4x5 cab years ago and it was an unmitigated POS. Quality Control was horrible. The tolex was separating and there was a buzz I couldn't resolve. I played exactly one half gig with it and returned it as soon as I could. I also bought the $99 PJB headphones and THOSE were also an unmitigated POS. They broke within three months of barely any use. I mentioned my unhappiness at both sub-standard purchases in the Phil Jones FB group and the man himself, Mr. Phil Jones, tore me a new one. He said I was lying and was basically otherwise thrashing me because I was unhappy with his "products." Never offered at all to make it right, so eff that guy and his "products." Shows to go you how much he cares about his customers. I will bash Phil Jones and his "products" every chance I get, in every Phil Jones post I see.

 

[Cave Puppy]

No .. NONE of his stuff is worth it. STAY AWAY FROM PHIL JONES!!

 

[DrMole]

I, for one, will NEVER buy or use another PJB product ever again. I bought the 4x5 cab years ago and it was an unmitigated POS. Quality Control was horrible. The tolex was separating and there was a buzz I couldn't resolve. I played exactly one half gig with it and returned it as soon as I could. I also bought the $99 PJB headphones and THOSE were also an unmitigated POS. They broke within three months of barely any use. I mentioned my unhappiness at both sub-standard purchases in the Phil Jones FB group and the man himself, Mr. Phil Jones, tore me a new one. He said I was lying and was basically otherwise thrashing me because I was unhappy with his "products." Never offered at all to make it right, so eff that guy and his "products." Shows to go you how much he cares about his customers. I will bash Phil Jones and his "products" every chance I get, in every Phil Jones post I see.

This is totally opposite of the support I see from Robert from GK, Agedhorse of Mesa /GenzBenz, Roger from Source Audio or Doug from Darkglass(at least when he was active here)- not to mention several others on TB- I just happen to have products from the companies mentioned and their positive presence on this forum is a major consideration in my purchases.

 

[Cave Puppy]

This is totally opposite of the support I see from Robert from GK, Agedhorse of Mesa /GenzBenz, Roger from Source Audio or Doug from Darkglass(at least when he was active here)- not to mention several others on TB- I just happen to have products from the companies mentioned and their positive presence on this forum is a major consideration in my purchases.

I almost always come to TB for input on gear. Everyone seemed to love the 4x5. It is really great that we are able to contact folks directly at our favorite manufacturers here on TB. PJB could be the best thing in the world. I wouldn't touch them even I was given an endorsement. The customer service, like you said, is KEY! If he hadn't have ripped me a new one I would probably have some PJB stuff, even though the QC is terrible.

 

[Deleted member 165050]

No .. NONE of his stuff is worth it. STAY AWAY FROM PHIL JONES!!

I love my PJB Bass Cub and my PJB Acoustic Cub... added to which Phil in the past has answered my emails in person. I'd buy a PJB cable but neither of my PJB combos has speaker out

 

[DrMole]

I almost always come to TB for input on gear. Everyone seemed to love the 4x5. It is really great that we are able to contact folks directly at our favorite manufacturers here on TB. PJB could be the best thing in the world. I wouldn't touch them even I was given an endorsement. The customer service, like you said, is KEY! If he hadn't have ripped me a new one I would probably have some PJB stuff, even though the QC is terrible.

As someone who is always considering a small combo just to keep in the living room - I will likely just ignore any PJB offerings based on CS considerations- regardless of even a great deal...and The nonsense provided regarding the speaker cable.

 

[Slevage]

.5 ohms for a 4’ speaker cable indicates a defective cable, so this statement is questionable or is due to a typo. EVERY speaker cable (even 18 gauge) with copper conductors will have <.05 ohms total resistance.

That said, it is very important to use genuine Neutrik plugs and be sure you are really getting copper conductors (not copper plated aluminum). Many quality manufacturers offer speaker cables with Neutrik plugs and copper conductors. I recommend between 16 and 14 gauge for short cables, there is no real world benefit to heavier cables for this application IMO and IME.

Accurate measurements of resistance less than 1 ohm requires a meter that most folks don’t own.

 

[Reg Braithwaite]

FOH

Time to buy a hint… is the middle word “Outta?” If so, I can work out the other two.