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Playing for free as "good marketing"?

Is playing for free until the end of the year "good marketing"?

  • Total voters
    237
  • Poll closed .
#141
When it comes to making the decision of playing for free, you have to look at it from a cost/benefit perspective. Sometimes playing for free may bring you one step forward, but alot of times it could very well bring you one step back. Sometimes the variables are complicated to make the final decision, especially in what will be a new and different environment for the restaurant/bar industry.

My thoughts are that while playing for free the rest of the year MAY build some sweat equity and good faith with venues, they will be hesitant to start paying you any time in the future. Also, when you think about WHY venues have a band in the first place, that won't suddenly change when these places reopen. The value added should be exactly the same...you pay a band as an investment to bring in more business. If the band isn't bringing in more business, you shouldn't be having a band. If live music was ever good for business, it will still be good business after the pandemic.
 
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#142
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#143
I would say no to the rest of the year. When our band was very busy we would do a one or two free shows a year but not for "exposure". It was always a feel good give to the community type of thing. The show would always be of your choosing. With that said we have already made an offer to our favorite bar that we would play two free shows once they re open. One full band show on a Saturday and one free Acoustic show on a Sunday. Nothing wrong with that.

Right now $80 to $100 per person is nothing to complain about IMHO.
 
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#145
MultiScaleMale said:
Photography is also a hobby. Sports is a hobby too. You can't tell people what to charge or not charge for anything. If people are willing to play for free - and let'a face it, being paid $100 / head per night is really just about playing for free once you pull out transportation and taxes and equipment depreciation.

Don't blame what others do, make sure what you do brings the value to justify your pricing. In the end, very, very few will be able to make a living doing a hobby.
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And I would never shoot a wedding for the exposure either - when I go out in the woods and photograph landscapes and wildlife - that's my hobby - if someone wants to use those images for advertising or to hang on a wall - better believe they're paying.

If you value yourself at zero just because you enjoy it - you're selling yourself short. As simple as that hobby or not.
 
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#147
gidbass said:
Context: This is a bar band, and we are lucky, as a 4 piece, to get $80-$100 each when we play a gig. We play 12-15 times per year on average. I like the guys in the band, and we get along well together. The music is not my favorite, but is generally kind of fun to play depending on the crowd.

So, I have 2 of the "music, hang, or money" when evaluating my situation in a band although we make very little $$ one could argue I only have the hang...;)

So, just had a chat conversation with the guys in one of my bands, and once bars reopen they were all talking like we should consider playing for free (actually food and drink, but i don't count that as payment) for the rest of the year to help "give back" to the local bars as they they try to recover from whats going on in the world.

They think it's "good marketing" on our part, shows "we care", and a good way to differentiate ourselves from the other bands as once things reopen, there will be less places to play.

It just doesn't sit well with me, and I declined. While we don't make much money, it's more the principle.

I also told them they had my blessing to play for free with a sub if they desire to do so.

I'm curious to hear your thoughts on this? (sorry if this is a repeat thread)
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I read a couple of articles on an ASCAP news letter a few days ago. They are projecting that it could very well be late in 2021 before things like public music events are attended by the general public. While it's a nice thought to help out bar/pub owners by playing for free, which is what they get with steaming music, music for free, odds are imo that the few venues that had live music will be fewer thanks to our reaction to this virus. You would make more money on a busy street corner playing a kazoo with an open briefcase.
 
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#148
Not 100% sure how to answer the poll. In my case, I'm part of two different hobby bands. When we play in a setting that normally pays (meaning that our "competition" would be gigging musicians), then we want to be paid too (partly for ourselves, partly not to wreck an already fragile situation for actual gigging musicians). On the other hand, when we've been asked to play a company function or a friend's party, then complimentary food and drinks is enough. We're not looking for exposure per se.
 
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#149
Do you know and like the bar? Are they on the edge of going bust? Would you playing for free help keep your favourite bar in business? Play for free. Once. Why not?

Is the bar not at risk? When lockdown ends, will bars be packed full of people who've not been to a bar in months? Drinks sales will be huge so they should pay the band.
 
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#150
The music scene around here has already been infested with solo acoustic guitarists/singers with loopers and backing tracks and stick PAs playing for tips in a jar (almost playing for free - I don't see many tips in those jars). While I'm always glad to be around live music, I can't help but believe the local music scene would be alive with real bands if not for these looping/backtracking singer guitarists eager to jump on stage for free/tips in a jar. This is what happens to the local music scene when musicians play for free/tips in a jar - it changes the landscape forever and hurts real bands. All of the above is my jaded opinion.
 
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#152
Loring said:
And I would never shoot a wedding for the exposure either - when I go out in the woods and photograph landscapes and wildlife - that's my hobby - if someone wants to use those images for advertising or to hang on a wall - better believe they're paying.

If you value yourself at zero just because you enjoy it - you're selling yourself short. As simple as that hobby or not.
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If you can provide a service better than the people willing to do the wedding for the fun of it, then you are providing value. But, you need to work for and not just be pi**ed off at people that are willing to do it for their enjoyment. Professionals provide value, not jut charge money. Bar bands are heavily hobbyist in most markets. People that bemoan that they can't make a living playing bars are just kidding themselves. They should hit the road, write songs, nurture their fan base, and not blame people that don't care if they get paid or not. It's no secret what the landscape looks like.
 
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#154
MultiScaleMale said:
If you can provide a service better than the people willing to do the wedding for the fun of it, then you are providing value. But, you need to work for and not just be pi**ed off at people that are willing to do it for their enjoyment. Professionals provide value, not jut charge money. Bar bands are heavily hobbyist in most markets. People that bemoan that they can't make a living playing bars are just kidding themselves. They should hit the road, write songs, nurture their fan base, and not blame people that don't care if they get paid or not. It's no secret what the landscape looks like.
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Not bemoaning anything - for me it is a hobby - for my guitar player it's not. He needs to make money doing gigs and teaching guitar.

it's not about blame at all - truth is there are a lot of really good hobbyists out there and it is getting harder and harder for some to actually offer up more. Add to that a lawyer doctor or other professional in the band that can afford better lights pa etc and It is difficult - thankfully most educated people making real money outside of their hobby don't devalue themselves.

like I said earlier - we all love what we do and most of us are doing it for less than we are worth but for the love of god don't be a zero the hero. Nobody loves you. Not the bar owner. Not your audience and not other musicians so at this point - ask yourself why?

just your ego to be on stage? It's not music - you can do that at your rehearsal space. It's not perform - you can do that at your friends party.

The only reasons I can think of is you either let the bar owner sell you on the famous non-tradeable exposure or it's to pretend you're a big boy playing on a stage where real bands play...
 
#156
Loring said:
... or it's to pretend you're a big boy playing on a stage where real bands play...
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Maybe we'er picturing different bars. The local scene here is a corner of the bar gets cleared out, few places have real stages and they're not hosting known bands. Pay for bands is in the range of $300-500 whether you have a 1-2 person acoustic duo or a full 5 piece and. Bands bring their own PA and sometimes sound guy. There are a few larger venues that you can make a few more bucks, maybe $1000 per night, but these are bands that are really into it.

Just doing the math, for drinks the profit margin is about 75%. Drinks probably average $7 (maybe a bit more) and people have around 3 drinks, so you need to sell roughly 92 drinks to cover the band's $500. That ignores any other overhead, licensing, etc. If a band doesn't bring 30 people that otherwise would not be there, it really makes no sense to have live music. 30 would be easy in the college days, but we're in an aging area and 30 butts in seats might be difficult. If I had a bar, I'd just do games on the screens.
 
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#157
TomB said:
I dunno man - I think I'd stay on that island, myself. Of course, you can't go anywhere anyway anytime soon so there's that ;)
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That's a good point. It looks like early June is going to be my first chance for flights home, the 14 day California quarantine hasn't helped either. But it's not too bad, I have a nice place to stay at least!
 
#158
MultiScaleMale said:
Maybe we'er picturing different bars. The local scene here is a corner of the bar gets cleared out, few places have real stages and they're not hosting known bands. Pay for bands is in the range of $300-500 whether you have a 1-2 person acoustic duo or a full 5 piece and. Bands bring their own PA and sometimes sound guy. There are a few larger venues that you can make a few more bucks, maybe $1000 per night, but these are bands that are really into it.

Just doing the math, for drinks the profit margin is about 75%. Drinks probably average $7 (maybe a bit more) and people have around 3 drinks, so you need to sell roughly 92 drinks to cover the band's $500. That ignores any other overhead, licensing, etc. If a band doesn't bring 30 people that otherwise would not be there, it really makes no sense to have live music. 30 would be easy in the college days, but we're in an aging area and 30 butts in seats might be difficult. If I had a bar, I'd just do games on the screens.
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I have to agree with everything you said - that's why most bars have done exactly that or hung a few TVs and become "sports bars". Many are going to house djs.

I wish all those bars would do that - then when people want live music they have less choices and therefore more specialized bars - with real stages and a capacity of more than 50-100.

reminds me of the 80's lol.

the thing is - free band is still cheaper entertainment than a dozen hd TVs or paying Wages for a dude to pretend to spin disks...
 

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