If it helps, I did decide to go with a clip on tie.
At least I’ll be safe around heavy machinery.
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Double Bass Playing with a large band
- Thread starter g-dude
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If it helps, I did decide to go with a clip on tie.
At least I’ll be safe around heavy machinery.
I don't know whether concert band is closer to symphony or to a big band, so sorry if I'm completely off.
I play in big band and the conductor want me to play everything pizz. I came to think that it is because the deep lows from my bass provide a strong color that no other instrument can do in the band; the higher partials from arco would likely clash with the frequencies that most of the other instruments occupy. Especially with intonation issues, which are common in [not only] our band.
Sometimes I use arco, but only for rubato stuff with voices, like christmas carols.
Were I unamplified, nobody would hear me, including myself
Concert Band is generally closer to a symphony but the may cover big band material as well. Most big band repertoire is pizz only.
Concert band can cover orchestral transcripts and there is also specific symphonic band and marching band literature. In my experience these styles all call for plenty of arco.
I think of the upright bass as having two different functions. In big band or pop vocals, the upright typical serves as a part of the rhythm section. The bass should be loud enough to carry the band.
In orchestra or symphonic band, the bass is more of a section instrument and the volume should be set to blend in with the other sections you play with. The idea here is various instrument play the same notes in different octaves to create a range of different tones and textures. Often the intent is to create a tone/texture similar to bowed upright bass.
In marching band repertoire the uprights role can be somewhat of a hybrid of the two. Marching parts tend to be more functional and basic. The upright often plays in 2 and functions as a rhythm instrument playing root fifth type lines. Normally I adjusted the volume of my amp more to blend than to carry the band. Usually the tubas will carry the band and the upright bass is pretty much along for the ride. Some marching band music actually includes upright bass parts, and they frequently require arco.
Here's an example. Although not specifically annotated, this song starts arco and does not go to pizz until the trio section.
Here is a simplified version with suggested bowing.
Link Removed
Here is a more orchestral composition for band.
If you take a look at the score, the bass part is grouped with the woodwinds, between Bb Bass Clarinet and Eb Alto Sax. From what I remember, my part mostly doubled the tubas. Most of the time I sat right next to the tubas. There were times when I moved to play with the woodwinds, but this was not one of them.
If you take a look at the score, the bass part is grouped with the woodwinds, between Bb Bass Clarinet and Eb Alto Sax. From what I remember, my part mostly doubled the tubas. Most of the time I sat right next to the tubas. There were times when I moved to play with the woodwinds, but this was not one of them.
Not to put too fine a point on it, but the top version is the orchestra version of the original band piece, which is in Eb. I think it's note for note, just a half step lower. The other one looks like a simplified school orchestra version. Of the two different keys, I think I prefer Eb, I guess because it would mean a band is playing it. Totally off topic aside: I've read that in the big top circus days, if the band started playing Stars and Stripes, it meant the tent was on fire. I can't verify the truth, as all the circus playing I've done has been indoors and luckily no fires.Concert Band is generally closer to a symphony but the may cover big band material as well. Most big band repertoire is pizz only.
Concert band can cover orchestral transcripts and there is also specific symphonic band and marching band literature. In my experience these styles all call for plenty of arco.
I think of the upright bass as having two different functions. In big band or pop vocals, the upright typical serves as a part of the rhythm section. The bass should be loud enough to carry the band.
In orchestra or symphonic band, the bass is more of a section instrument and the volume should be set to blend in with the other sections you play with. The idea here is various instrument play the same notes in different octaves to create a range of different tones and textures. Often the intent is to create a tone/texture similar to bowed upright bass.
In marching band repertoire the uprights role can be somewhat of a hybrid of the two. Marching parts tend to be more functional and basic. The upright often plays in 2 and functions as a rhythm instrument playing root fifth type lines. Normally I adjusted the volume of my amp more to blend than to carry the band. Usually the tubas will carry the band and the upright bass is pretty much along for the ride. Some marching band music actually includes upright bass parts, and they frequently require arco.
Here's an example. Although not specifically annotated, this song starts arco and does not go to pizz until the trio section.
Here is a simplified version with suggested bowing.
Link Removed
That sounds right...I can't find an Eb Double Bass part. Feel free to impress me
.AFAIK, this is one of the Eb versions I played from....it's been a long time
. I played arco and pizz as previously indicated.
Most of the time I simplified the beginning, by not playing the 32nd note ornaments on the melody line.
Fire, yes. Some of our audiences would have burned the place down if we did not play Stars and Stripes as an encore. Sometimes they even insisted on a refrain of the last 32 (bars). The would shout, clap, and stomp their feet if our conductor showed a reluctance to satisfy them.
That's the only version of the part I've ever seen either. Being able to read tuba parts up an octave is an essential skill for this type of situation. I always assumed that the upper notes were for Eb tubas but my friends who really play it tell me this is not necessarily the case. You guys are probably way too young to remember the old Mitch Miller tv show that would end with the group singing "Be kind to your web-footed friends" to the tune of the S&S theme.That sounds right...I can't find an Eb Double Bass part. Feel free to impress me
AFAIK, this is one of the Eb versions I played from....it's been a long time
View attachment 5074849
I played arco and pizz as previously indicated.
Fire, yes. of our audiences would have burned the place down if we did not play Stars and Stripes as an encore. Sometimes they even insisted on a refrain of the last 32 (bars). The would shout, clap, and stomp their feet if our conductor showed a reluctance to satisfy them.
I agree with the others, this sounds like : Concert Band
Better than clothespins is a plexiglass sheet to cover the music and prevent it from blowing away. Hardware stores have them and can cut them to size for you (ie. 12"x18")
Also use a heavy music stand, as the light weight ones can be tipped in light wind.
Yes to bug spray.
Bass guitar works well in concert bands, the frets give a stability of tuning the rest of the band can lean on.
If you're doing it on upright, I'd say stick with pizzicato all the way, until your comfortable with the arco playing sections.
Consider that possibly the main reason you're there (string bass), is to provide the pulse and drive, that the tubas (and bari sax) cannot provide. They can't drive the band walking. Too much air, needing to breath, the latency... = no drive in 4. (In 2, yes, but not in 4)
The string bass brings that, in ways the others cannot.
They can do the volume swells, and long notes, the majestic, so you can lay off that until you're ready to do it.
They will lay off the walking, and the riffing, because you'll be there.
The tubas will also rip through Sousa, while you're fumbling to decipher the notes at pitch. But you'll burn through the jazz, rock, pop, while they take breathing breaks or feathering around you.
Another thing, yes watch the conductor, and yes blend well with the tubas, however, in the jazz/pop music you'll play, the string bass role is to be the front end of the attack, to be the pulse slightly ahead of the beat to drive the lumbering bus forward. Don't hang back in the beat with the tubas. You're there to drive.
YMMV.
Enjoy!
Better than clothespins is a plexiglass sheet to cover the music and prevent it from blowing away. Hardware stores have them and can cut them to size for you (ie. 12"x18")
Also use a heavy music stand, as the light weight ones can be tipped in light wind.
Yes to bug spray.
Bass guitar works well in concert bands, the frets give a stability of tuning the rest of the band can lean on.
If you're doing it on upright, I'd say stick with pizzicato all the way, until your comfortable with the arco playing sections.
Consider that possibly the main reason you're there (string bass), is to provide the pulse and drive, that the tubas (and bari sax) cannot provide. They can't drive the band walking. Too much air, needing to breath, the latency... = no drive in 4. (In 2, yes, but not in 4)
The string bass brings that, in ways the others cannot.
They can do the volume swells, and long notes, the majestic, so you can lay off that until you're ready to do it.
They will lay off the walking, and the riffing, because you'll be there.
The tubas will also rip through Sousa, while you're fumbling to decipher the notes at pitch. But you'll burn through the jazz, rock, pop, while they take breathing breaks or feathering around you.
Another thing, yes watch the conductor, and yes blend well with the tubas, however, in the jazz/pop music you'll play, the string bass role is to be the front end of the attack, to be the pulse slightly ahead of the beat to drive the lumbering bus forward. Don't hang back in the beat with the tubas. You're there to drive.
YMMV.
Enjoy!
So here’s a question - prompted in part by some of the pieces above…
If there’s a flurry of notes that I know I won’t be able to pull off, is it fine to just focus on the important notes and leave the pitch gymnastics to others?
I gotta ask this of @g-dude ...
If I was involved with this gig I'd feel almost totally unprepared to pull it off without a lot of personal woodshedding and a lot of group practices. Because of my focus on other kinds of music, I'd be nervous about being the right person for the job.
I can handle the woodshedding over time and I'm very happy to work on other kinds of music, but I'd still be dependent on a lot of group practices to make sure the fit was right. And because of the purely technical details to work out about amplification (which evidently no one else is using), I'd also want to be doing some coordinating of this with the band leader (things like AC power availability, location for amps, cabs, stands, etc.).
Not saying you're in exactly the same situation, but are there practices planned before the actual gigs happen? Also, is there potential for being in contact with the band leader about amplification?
Clearly, for me, these would be a requirement.
If I was involved with this gig I'd feel almost totally unprepared to pull it off without a lot of personal woodshedding and a lot of group practices. Because of my focus on other kinds of music, I'd be nervous about being the right person for the job.
I can handle the woodshedding over time and I'm very happy to work on other kinds of music, but I'd still be dependent on a lot of group practices to make sure the fit was right. And because of the purely technical details to work out about amplification (which evidently no one else is using), I'd also want to be doing some coordinating of this with the band leader (things like AC power availability, location for amps, cabs, stands, etc.).
Not saying you're in exactly the same situation, but are there practices planned before the actual gigs happen? Also, is there potential for being in contact with the band leader about amplification?
Clearly, for me, these would be a requirement.
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So I will have a couple of rehearsals before the first concert, which will cover some of the pieces played over the season.
They’ve had double bass before, so me rocking up with amplification is not new ground, although I had to chuckle when they said that a 12” speaker should be fine (as in, wattage also matters).
If this was a community orchestra, I’d probably not be pulling the trigger on this.
I’ve played my upright in groups of 10+ musicians before, including a mixture of arco and pizz, but these were also situations where I knew full well that I didn’t need to follow the sheet music to the letter. I knew the changes, listened to what was going on, and played something that fit what was actually going on around me.
The challenge here will be a totally new body of music and having to stay more in the lane that has been drawn for me.
Good... It sounds like you're a much better fit up front for this than I would be. I'm anxious to hear how things work out .
.
Good... It sounds like you're a much better fit up front for this than I would be. I'm anxious to hear how things work out
Me too!
I have the same, "What have I gotten myself into?" vibe as when I played my upright live for the first time in public.
Thankfully, that went fine except for the excruciating pain I had from something that was borderline to being frozen shoulder. I mean, it was a Good Friday service, so not appearing cheery was appropriate and what not.
Okay, status report…
I have survived the first rehearsal.
Some observations:
- Massive turnout, surprised people had enough chairs and stands. I don’t know how we’ll fit into the band shell.
- I was in the back in the corner, next to the tubas. This was not a bad thing.
- OMG there were a lot of tubas. I think there were five or six.
- Speaking of tubas, I hate playing from tuba scores because I’m really not used to reading a buttload of ledger lines below E.
- I brought my Mesa Rosette combo. Good thing too because it not only had enough volume, but it was compact and meant fewer trips.
- I ended up not playing arco at all, because I was having to use all my focus on music I had never heard before in my life.
- There were some times I had to lay out - either because I got lost or because I couldn’t quite sight read fast enough - and other times where I was able to play notes that worked.
- The few times where the conductor wanted the entire low end section to play certain bits, I held my own.
- I really need to work on playing in Ab major.
At the end of the day, I wasn’t disinvited, so I at least managed to avoid drawing attention to myself in a bad way.
Definitely not a walk in the park, but I feel like I will get better over the coming months.
I have survived the first rehearsal.
Some observations:
- Massive turnout, surprised people had enough chairs and stands. I don’t know how we’ll fit into the band shell.
- I was in the back in the corner, next to the tubas. This was not a bad thing.
- OMG there were a lot of tubas. I think there were five or six.
- Speaking of tubas, I hate playing from tuba scores because I’m really not used to reading a buttload of ledger lines below E.
- I brought my Mesa Rosette combo. Good thing too because it not only had enough volume, but it was compact and meant fewer trips.
- I ended up not playing arco at all, because I was having to use all my focus on music I had never heard before in my life.
- There were some times I had to lay out - either because I got lost or because I couldn’t quite sight read fast enough - and other times where I was able to play notes that worked.
- The few times where the conductor wanted the entire low end section to play certain bits, I held my own.
- I really need to work on playing in Ab major.
At the end of the day, I wasn’t disinvited, so I at least managed to avoid drawing attention to myself in a bad way.
Definitely not a walk in the park, but I feel like I will get better over the coming months.
