Precision vs Jazz at a gig

[Glenn Johnson]

Yeah? I wouldn't say they are exactly the same but I think most would be pretty hard pressed to tell the difference. A little EQ usually covers it in my experience.

Having had both P's and J's over the years I would say that the neck pu on a J sounds NOTHING like a P. The P has more mids and less lows and highs than the J neck pickup. The P always seems to fit in the mix better for me. I no longer own a J. YMMV.

 

[Mark Ambler]

Jimmy—the tone of everything has changed. Digital audio (and mp3 compression, etc.) is pretty much omni-present for most listeners, for better or worse. Computer speakers or iPhone earbuds, anyone? Don't get me started on crappy subs.

It's cleaner, or dirtier, or flatter, or more in tune, more quantized (or dithered), or more perfectly executed/edited, or more whatever (except profitable). That is, of course assuming we are not too deaf to notice.

Yeah, the high quality clarity available on playback systems was always available, and if you wanted a clean high quality sound you could go through the desk, and maybe mix the sound of a tube amp with that. There have always been extremely varied recorded bass sounds, James Jameson, Stanley Clarke, Overdriven rock bass sounds, etc.

There is a much better choice of amps today, though, but same sounds were obtainable then as they are today, with the exception of ultra clean SS amps. I remember people using HH amps instead of Fender, Hiwatt, etc. Really bad choice, but the amps were much lighter and they were the ‘new thing’. So yes, you couldn’t get a high quality ultra clean SS sound until the 80s/90s approx, (not sure when the first decent SS amp came out). Still, we’re spoilt for choice now, and although for many, nothing sounds as good as a valve amp, we’re 98% there, (imo) and without the reliability issues and weight.

Someone likes himself a little more than is psychologically healthy, eh?

OK, perhaps you'd like to straighten me out, so here's your chance. What's made bass tone so glaringly different since the 70's? Roundwounds? Done in the 60's. Active setups? 70's. PA style bass amps? 70's. Extra strings? OK, now there you may have a case even though they were also products of the 70's.

Basses sound different today same as acoustic Pianos do.

 

[bass.slinger]

This.
Putting tape wound or flats on a jazz is like stepping on the gas and the brakes at the same time. Using rounds with the tone rolled off would be a more suitable use of a jazz.
Their EQ is scooped by design. If you are expecting big punchy mids you won't get them from a jazz.

I have to say, I get really tired of hearing how a jazz has no mids - the EQ is only scooped on a jazz if you run both pickups equally. I almost always set mine with the bridge dimed and the neck around seven or eight - definitely not scooped. As the quote states, you are much better off running rounds (even really bright ones) and rolling off the tone when you want a more vintage sound. You also have a built in slap tone with both pickups dimed.

I find a p-bass has more low mids and is punchy while the jazz has more high mids and has that characteristic snarl from the bridge pickup. Both are great sounds and it really depends on what you want. While I like a good p-bass, the neck and the snarl of the jazz work better for me.

 

[MotorCityMinion]

"Flats on a jazz are awesome. Joe Osborne , JPJ.....hundreds of others would agree."

Hundreds of others had no options as Rounds were not easy to get in the early days and the basses shipped with flats.

OT:I saw a Carol Kay interview where she claimed she just went out and bought a new bass when the strings were dead.

 

[Mark Ambler]

"Flats on a jazz are awesome. Joe Osborne , JPJ.....hundreds of others would agree."

Hundreds of others had no options as Rounds were not easy to get in the early days and the basses shipped with flats.

OT:I saw a Carol Kay interview where she claimed she just went out and bought a new bass when the strings were dead.

The perfect solution!

 

[JMacBass65]

Flats on a jazz are awesome. Joe Osborne , JPJ.....hundreds of others would agree.

Count me as one of them.

 

[Bass]

......It was an interesting adjustment, too, having rehearsed on the more narrow neck of the J and then playing the gig with the wider neck of the P. Took me a few songs to adjust...

This issue is the same for me as I practice all week with a J, and then play a P with the band. I am thinking about getting a P with a J neck as suggested in post No. 93.

At gigs, sometimes I have had trouble hearing myself, so I suppose this can happen with a P or a J. Does anyone have a link with simple instructions on EQing the bass for live performance?

 

[ugly_bassplayer]

Does anyone have a link with simple instructions on EQing the bass for live performance?

This is never simple, too many variables. The room, the placement of the stage, the amp, the bass, the pedals, the number of people, the resonant frequency of multiple things in the room all have a direct impact in the way the EQ should be tweaked for the FOH. That’s why a good tech “tunes” the PA.

It truly is a science learned with years of experience and a well developed ear.

 

[CallMeAl]

Ah, one more P v J thread to close the year. And with 6 pages of spirited debate, it appears we are not tired of talking about it!

I had a similar experience. Played a J for a solid year, then switched to a P. I know EQ has a lot to do with it, but I just like the combination of simplicity and effectiveness of a P

 

[CallMeAl]

This issue is the same for me as I practice all week with a J, and then play a P with the band. I am thinking about getting a P with a J neck as suggested in post No. 93.

Do it! That’s what I did, haven’t regretted it for a minute. Love my J neck P!

 

[Altitude]

I like to take 3 basses and use a different bass each set

I do this too, especially when I have something new.

 

[Alan Ace Cooper]

treating the J like a P will surely lead to poor comparative results. The J is a different beastie. Notable successes with the J comprise instruments which are configured in no way similar to the P.

For one thing, the stock neck pickup on a J is generally far weaker and thinner than the P pickup. So, if you try to cop the P sound with the stock J rigging, you are automatically off to a bad start.

I use the Delano JMVC pickups on my J’s; and that neck pickup has a vibe somewhere between the ‘55 P pickup and the ‘57 P pickup. So, when I want it, my J’s def go into practical P territory. They do other things as well; and that is an area that the P does not excel as well at.

I fully agree! I have a Fralin Split Coil in my Sting 50s Precision Bass. Which provides some J Bass-like snap, but still has quite a bit of boom. As for my J Basses, I want them to be J Basses. I have the DiMarzio Model J set in my 78 Jazz and that is the only one that comes close to reproducing anything "P Bass"-like.

 

[AlexanderB]

Yeah, the high quality clarity available on playback systems was always available, and if you wanted a clean high quality sound you could go through the desk, and maybe mix the sound of a tube amp with that. There have always been extremely varied recorded bass sounds, James Jameson, Stanley Clarke, Overdriven rock bass sounds, etc.

There is a much better choice of amps today, though, but same sounds were obtainable then as they are today, with the exception of ultra clean SS amps. I remember people using HH amps instead of Fender, Hiwatt, etc. Really bad choice, but the amps were much lighter and they were the ‘new thing’. So yes, you couldn’t get a high quality ultra clean SS sound until the 80s/90s approx, (not sure when the first decent SS amp came out). Still, we’re spoilt for choice now, and although for many, nothing sounds as good as a valve amp, we’re 98% there, (imo) and without the reliability issues and weight.



Basses sound different today same as acoustic Pianos do.

It is smart to do at least a LITTLE bit of studying before you post such blatantly incorrect things...
No "ultra clean" (whatever that means?!!?) SS amps until late 80s/early 90s???
I strongly suggest you learn about Crown DC300, Mark Levinson, Krell, Cerwin Vega!, Phase Linear, UREI, QSC and so on. (And that is only American brands!)
PLENTY of high power SS amps in the 70s, some before that, and with performance way more accurate than the tube amps.

 

[Altitude]

This issue is the same for me as I practice all week with a J, and then play a P with the band. I am thinking about getting a P with a J neck as suggested in post No. 93.

I did this a little by accident. Earlier this year I bought a parts P bass locally. Loved the bass, did not like the neck, which was an Allparts P neck with binding and blocks and a very strange nut. The neck had a nice patina and had colored to yellow very nicely and looked very 70s - but the nut was too high and the way it was cut versus the binding made it sort of hard to fix or even replace.

I sold that neck and hit Stratosphere looking for an American Pro P neck as a replacement. I was only able to find J necks at that moment, so I bought one of those instead.

The neck screwed right on (to the USA Fender P body, don't know how old), the fit was perfect, needed only minor setup and might have needed none if I weren't so OCD about neck setup.

As for the J vs. P width - I don't personally care about that, but for one who does this is a very easy swap.

Here 'tis:

 

[BassVibes]

I play punk/goth/ska and find the Jazz is better when playing higher up the registers for more soloing or droning effect (aka Dead Kennedys0. Also works well with ska getting a bit lower down. But with more straight ahead rock the p bass has the punch that Jazz doesn't quite do. Whatever the case, both are versatile enough to work in any music. Imagination is the only real limitation.

 

[Mark Ambler]

It is smart to do at least a LITTLE bit of studying before you post such blatantly incorrect things...
No "ultra clean" (whatever that means?!!?) SS amps until late 80s/early 90s???
I strongly suggest you learn about Crown DC300, Mark Levinson, Krell, Cerwin Vega!, Phase Linear, UREI, QSC and so on. (And that is only American brands!)
PLENTY of high power SS amps in the 70s, some before that, and with performance way more accurate than the tube amps.

Ok Ok Ok. I was just talking from my experience of gigging in the seventies, for what it's worth, (apparently not much). In small clubs and larger rock venues people were using valve amps and some switched to HH amps when they were touted as being the next big thing. I don't know when decent SS amps became available hence my three (yes three) question marks after I typed 80s/90s. I was more referring to 100 rms type heads like HH, Ok?

 

[micguy]

That's all technology outside of the bass. You might make a case for super low lows being somewhat new, being around only, what? 25-30 years? That's new

Super low lows have been around in certain circles (Hi fi, certain PA's) since the 70's at least. But I would argue they haven't yet arrived in bass guitar cabinets.

 

[hennessybass]

I have to say, I get really tired of hearing how a jazz has no mids - the EQ is only scooped on a jazz if you run both pickups equally.

Bingo, and even then you are only scooping out certain frequencies a little bit. Not like all the mids are just gone.

I personally think a little mid scoop generally sounds really good. Not like a late 80s over the top thing, but a little dip makes the sound sweet.


— then there are those guys who say I don’t like a Jazz because of the mid scoop. A P bass is perfect,, just boost the bass a little on the amp, a little high end tweak to help it cut through and I’m in tone heaven. — guess what you just did.

 

[MobileHolmes]

This is never simple, too many variables. The room, the placement of the stage, the amp, the bass, the pedals, the number of people, the resonant frequency of multiple things in the room all have a direct impact in the way the EQ should be tweaked for the FOH. That’s why a good tech “tunes” the PA.

It truly is a science learned with years of experience and a well developed ear.

I played a gig last week that really showed how much bodies matter. Room was super boomy (all hard surfaces, high ceilings, etc). Sounded worst at sound check in front of nobody. Sounded best around the end of set 1 when room was fullest, back to kind of boomy by the end of set 3 when the audience had petered out. Had to adjust the eq a couple times

 

[Lava]

This PU configuration usually works best. It covers most situations but sometimes I roll off the third from top.