I'll go for what I like. I do notice a difference; neither good nor bad either way. I also notice differences between two ported or two sealed cabs as well. If I like how it sounds, I'm good.
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Preference For Sealed Cabs? Why?
- Thread starter dukeorock
- Start date
- Mar 8, 2011
- 12,232
- 51,187
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- Authorized greenboy designs builder/Owner of BNA Audio
Of course! The OT was asking the question, do you prefer sealed cabs? Why? So it's not really sealed vs ported because that would be as silly as arguing 10"s vs 12"s. It's not a shoot out between two specific things. There are some that just prefer them and I find it interesting. Nothing to argue, just points to discuss
Anyone know rough percentages of total ported vs. sealed cabs produced? It would be interesting to understand how the market has voted overall on preference.
I got it... Lmao
Played through both kinds over the years, like them both, but really enjoying the extended lows in my current faves, DB112's...
The qualities referred to as speed and transient response are strongly influenced by the balance between the lower and upper harmonics. It is the contribution of the higher frequencies to the fundamental waveform that create a waveform with a 'fast' rise time and a tone that is perceived as being 'fast'. When we discuss the influence of sealed vs ported cabs we are really talking about something that impacts only the lowest frequencies. When the lows are too prominent, they are out of balance with the highs, the resulting waveform is more gently sloped, and is perceived as being slow.
Boom and overhang result from underdamped alignments, both ported and sealed. There can be a fair amount of broad peaking before there is boom and perceptible overhang.
Group delay, a term borrowed from filter theory, is a measure of the delay of the lowest frequencies relative to the higher frequencies. Cabs with a steep low frequency rolloff have more group delay than those with a slow rolloff. Excessive group delay can cause the cab to sound slow. Just how much is allowable before 'slowness' is perceived is a matter of considerable debate.
A sealed cab does two things: 1) it adds stiffness to the drivers suspension (surround and spider) which causes the driver's resonant frequency and Qts to rise, and 2) it prevents cancellation of the front wave by the back wave. If a driver with the same T/S parameters as a given driver in a sealed cab were mounted in an effectively infinite baffle (a really big box) it would exhibit the same response profile in the bass, same efficiency and same transient response. The sealed cab really does not control the cone any better than the infinite baffle. It is the suspension stiffness, electro-magnetic damping (Qe) and driver resonant frequency that control the cone. The performance of a driver in a sealed box works quite well as long as excursion compressed air acts as a spring. Unfortunately, at large excursions some of the compressive energy is converted into heat (rather than returned to the cone), and the spring action becomes non-linear.
To answer the OT.....
I like both. Maybe I like large sealed cabs and slightly smaller Ported or that maybe just coz that's what I've had.
I've a Berg NV412 sealed and I love it. Very punchy, grindy mids, and enough lows to make my 5 string jazz sound cool on the low B.
But give it a 4 string with a tube amp and it's pure magic. Thick, quick, and prominent.
My ported cabs range from Berg AE112'S to a couple of Fender Bassman Neo 115s.
They sound a little stronger down low in the low B range so I'll use these if I'm playing in a different band that has a Lotta funk n disco and needs a stronger low end.
I like both. Use both.
I like both. Maybe I like large sealed cabs and slightly smaller Ported or that maybe just coz that's what I've had.
I've a Berg NV412 sealed and I love it. Very punchy, grindy mids, and enough lows to make my 5 string jazz sound cool on the low B.
But give it a 4 string with a tube amp and it's pure magic. Thick, quick, and prominent.
My ported cabs range from Berg AE112'S to a couple of Fender Bassman Neo 115s.
They sound a little stronger down low in the low B range so I'll use these if I'm playing in a different band that has a Lotta funk n disco and needs a stronger low end.
I like both. Use both.
That is an awesome explation...not only technically but in a way that allows me to picture in my mind what is happening.
You sir, should be a teacher. Thanks.
Depends on way more than just "a driver for a sealed and ported cab".
With as much info as you have given, it gets filed under " crap shoot".
I skipped physics in High school (no physics in middle school). But then got my fair share in college. I could go on and on about what I think should be taught in high school/middle school science. For example earth science, probably the easiest and most relevant science, rarely gets taught. It baffles me.
- Jun 29, 2006
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- President, CEO, CFO, CIO, Chief Engineer, Technician, Janitor - Reiner Amplification
I've been building what I would consider modern, very high performance sealed cabs for a few years now and while I also love great ported designs, I always come back to sealed. I like they way they behave at high volume and I prefer the way they respond the EQ is the bass and low mids.
Im obviously a ' SIMPLE SORT' but I seem too prefer sealed with my all tube Fender 100T and have enjoyed ported with solid state amps I have borrowed. I found the ' girth' added ( lack of a better word) with solid state amps to be a plus. That said, take this as intended, as a very simple opinion, based on a few experiences.
Thanks, Marc
Thanks, Marc
IF (big if there) a particular sealed box produces less lows, esp in the lowest octave, than that box may have a "tighter" or more focused sound. The lack of lows will help the mids to sing clearly and may be a big part of why some prefer the sealed design.
Would it be accurate to say the use of a HPF like the Fdeck transforms a ported cab into sonic characteristics of a sealed cab? That's how it seems to my ears.
My favourite cabs for normal rooms have all been ported, and this goes back decades, through various types and sizes. This may or may not have anything to do with the fact I play 5-string basses strung with a low B.
In venues with really problematic acoustics, even carefully designed ported enclosures like my AudioKinesis Thunderchild (basically a bass-friendly recording monitor) seem to suffer from room boom a little more than I would like.
Plugging the ports on the AudioKinesis, or using the little Fender Rumble 100 V3 combo that I modded to be a sealed enclosure, seems to clean up that trace of tubbiness, at least with those two cabs.
How well does this relate to other sealed/ported comparisons? Probably not at all.
In venues with really problematic acoustics, even carefully designed ported enclosures like my AudioKinesis Thunderchild (basically a bass-friendly recording monitor) seem to suffer from room boom a little more than I would like.
Plugging the ports on the AudioKinesis, or using the little Fender Rumble 100 V3 combo that I modded to be a sealed enclosure, seems to clean up that trace of tubbiness, at least with those two cabs.
How well does this relate to other sealed/ported comparisons? Probably not at all.
- Jun 29, 2006
- 5,148
- 3,217
- Disclosures
- President, CEO, CFO, CIO, Chief Engineer, Technician, Janitor - Reiner Amplification
Not really, there are a lot of different parameters and interactions at play, especially in a dynamic system.
Sort of but not really. The Fdeck cuts bass very steeply at the selected cutoff frequency. Sealed cabs roll off very gently, but start doing so at a higher frequency than ported cabs.
Maybe I'm off on this, but my take on it is not from a technical angle, but purely a subjective "sound I hear". I do believe that I'm getting that sound of a "tube amp through a sealed cab" kind of thing, through my ported fEARful 15/6. I'm running a VT Bass Deluxe pedal into a ShuttleMax 9.2 head with the pre-gains set relatively high. I also use a rack mount compressor with a fair amount of compression (lower threshold, higher ratio, with more output on the back end to make up for the volume drop from the compression). Although it is not by any means choking or squashing my sound.
It "seems" that I'm getting that sealed cab, tight, controlled and fast response I'm after that I've always been fond of with a tube amp and a sealed cab, but with a SS amp and a ported cab. It's got this nice fat, yet tight low end that seems to breathe with my playing as if the speakers are more responsive to my playing. I'm not saying sealed is better than ported from any design standpoint, just a tonal preference of mine, even though I use a ported cab.
Is there a naturally occurring compression happening with sealed cabs, especially when driven by a tube amp? I'm just curious.
It "seems" that I'm getting that sealed cab, tight, controlled and fast response I'm after that I've always been fond of with a tube amp and a sealed cab, but with a SS amp and a ported cab. It's got this nice fat, yet tight low end that seems to breathe with my playing as if the speakers are more responsive to my playing. I'm not saying sealed is better than ported from any design standpoint, just a tonal preference of mine, even though I use a ported cab.
Is there a naturally occurring compression happening with sealed cabs, especially when driven by a tube amp? I'm just curious.
Agreed. Of course, we're now living in a nation where the very concept of "Science" is somehow rendered political. Madness.
I agree. I find it quite annoying when self-appointed internet guardians pull out the "do a search" response to legit questions such as Mark's. Just pipe down and go somewhere else if you don't like, folks.
- Mar 8, 2011
- 12,232
- 51,187
- Disclosures
- Authorized greenboy designs builder/Owner of BNA Audio
Ironically, using the search function and reading a couple old threads is what led me to start this thread in the first place...the 810e remains the 'gold standard' to so many. Berg has a couple of coveted sealed designs for many players. Honestly though, until I heard a couple of JGRs sealed designs, I figured the only successful designs were 610 or 810 cabs, maybe a 412. That made me curious to see what different folks were thinking now
