private school

[khay0s]

What a laugh. What great wealth of wisdom and knowledge qualifies that statement?

The private school my kids are at have taken them on field week trips to the south of France, Italy, Germany. My eldest daughter is competing is in a basketball tournament in Munich today. She heads off to Tanzania in late June for a two week program. What real life experiences is she missing out on?

Legal drinking age here is 16. She's 16. She's downtown every Friday night with her friends. I pick her up at the train station around midnight. What's missing? Drugs? Fist fights? Or any other quality "real world experiences". I'm not following you.




That's laughable. I just interviewed 30 people in the past twelve months. 432 applications. Not one was pulled aside for "real world" education in secondary school. Maybe we missed something.

Our choice for private school here is driven mostly by language. Even still, I attended a big regional high school. The quality of education and life experiences I am giving my daughters far far outweigh what a public school in Canada or Switzerland could offer. Exposure to different cultures for one thing. We get all the top universties showing up here trying to attract students with grants, bursaries, etc. Sure they smell money and so what. At the end of the day, having a strong resume with good schools and good jobs help peoples careers. I'm not saying private schools guarantee anything in life. I've done very well career wise without ever having set foot in a private school. But if I have the choice, I prefer to offer the best I can give my kids to give them a good footing in life.

Trading a good education for "real world" education is too flakey for me.

"Would you like French fries with that?"

There was a reason I avoided this debate in the first place. I've already entered it far too many times on this forum with the same result - a few vocal supporters of private schools boasting a few anecdotal claims on how wonderful they are. If we're going to be using pointless anecdotes that don't prove s***, then here's one for ya - the girl who has been top of my uni course for the past 3 years is a country girl who went to her local state school, 4 hours north of Brisbane. Yet, she's a straight 7 GPA (highest score possible). She is consistently the top student in every subject with scholarships coming out of her ears. I doubt she'll be saying, "Would you like fries with that?" anytime soon. Likewise, I'm doing vastly better than those around me because to get the OP I did, I had to get better marks than those who went to private schools. Hence, I am better qualified to be in the course I am.

Oh, and I can only ever speak from the perspective of the Aust education (specifically QLD). But it is most certainly the case that people who go to private schools are stunted in maturity, particularly when it comes to do with relationships with people of the opposite sex. That is not just an exaggeration, but a given around here for the trade off for going to an "educationally elite" school. I know which one I'd choose if I had my time again, and I know which I will choose for my children, too.

Oh, and don't waste your time responding to this post because I won't be reading any more of this trainwreck.

Leigh

 

[bmc]

There was a reason I avoided this debate in the first place. I've already entered it far too many times on this forum with the same result - a few vocal supporters of private schools boasting a few anecdotal claims on how wonderful they are. If we're going to be using pointless anecdotes that don't prove s***, then here's one for ya - the girl who has been top of my uni course for the past 3 years is a country girl who went to her local state school, 4 hours north of Brisbane. Yet, she's a straight 7 GPA (highest score possible). She is consistently the top student in every subject with scholarships coming out of her ears. I doubt she'll be saying, "Would you like fries with that?" anytime soon. Likewise, I'm doing vastly better than those around me because to get the OP I did, I had to get better marks than those who went to private schools. Hence, I am better qualified to be in the course I am.

Oh, and I can only ever speak from the perspective of the Aust education (specifically QLD). But it is most certainly the case that people who go to private schools are stunted in maturity, particularly when it comes to do with relationships with people of the opposite sex. That is not just an exaggeration, but a given around here for the trade off for going to an "educationally elite" school. I know which one I'd choose if I had my time again, and I know which I will choose for my children, too.

Oh, and don't waste your time responding to this post because I won't be reading any more of this trainwreck.

Leigh

LMAO

 

[nonsqtr]

Let's see, I had the benefit of a private education, after the sixth grade. I can definitely relate to the "separationism" and "exclusivity" aspect of that education. It was a great education, as far as it went, but there came a time in my life when I found I had to expand my horizons. Mainly, in the "social" sphere. I had to discover what "real" people were all about. Not that private school kids aren't "real", but let's say they're "privileged" in many ways, and the gestalt of the private school (at least the one I went to) was very different than the gestalt of the man on the street. In my case, I had to immerse myself in the streets of New York for a year, to figure out how to deal with people "at large". It was a very painful time in my life. On the other hand, my education granted me coping skills that lots of people don't have, without which I'd probably be dead right now.

I find the whole "private school" thing to be a two edged sword. On the one hand, the "academic" education is definitely superior here in the US, there's no question about that as far as I can tell. The public school system is into the "lowest common denominator" thing these days, which IMO is entirely wrong headed and counterproductive. On the other hand, a public school education tends to emphasize one's social skills, much more so that being in a privileged environment. That's kinda the balance, and the tradeoff, IME. Personally, I would "prefer" my kids to have the academic background "first", before they have to deal with all the bullsh*t that goes on "in real life". But that's just me, certainly people will have varying opinions around that. IMO, a late bloomer is better than not having enough fertilizer.

I'm noticing the poll is coming down on the side of the public school system. That's actually encouraging, in a way. So, here's a question for the parents in the audience. Have you ever exercised your right as a citizen, to sit in on a "live" public school classroom? Anyone can do it, all you have to do is walk into the principal's office, show your driver's license (so they can make sure you're not a sex offender or something), and choose a classroom that you want to observe. It's especially interesting if you visit an inner city school, that's a real heads-up for a lot of people.

 

[jkritchey]

<snip> On the one hand, the "academic" education is definitely superior here in the US, there's no question about that as far as I can tell. The public school system is into the "lowest common denominator" thing these days, which IMO is entirely wrong headed and counterproductive.

I will grant you this broad generalization on one condition: that we agree it is not cause and effect. In other words, you don't receive a good education because you went to private school, and you didn't receive a bad education because you went to public school.

A good education is often a result of the level of attention paid by the parents of the student. To the extent that private schools are the result of uber parental involvement in their childs' education, it often succeeds at a higher rate. But where that same level of parental involvement exists in public schools, the difference between the two is negligible, if not inverse.

Granted one advantage of Private schools: there is less chance of classroom disruption, which to me is issue number one in all schools. Apathy is issue number 2...

 

[Gia]

I will grant you this broad generalization on one condition: that we agree it is not cause and effect. In other words, you don't receive a good education because you went to private school, and you didn't receive a bad education because you went to public school.

A good education is often a result of the level of attention paid by the parents of the student. To the extent that private schools are the result of uber parental involvement in their childs' education, it often succeeds at a higher rate. But where that same level of parental involvement exists in public schools, the difference between the two is negligible, if not inverse.

Granted one advantage of Private schools: there is less chance of classroom disruption, which to me is issue number one in all schools. Apathy is issue number 2...

IMO apathy of students is lower in private schools because they know their parents are paying in some cases a small fortune to keep them in school.

 

[jkritchey]

IMO apathy of students is lower in private schools because they know their parents are paying in some cases a small fortune to keep them in school.

I agree that apathy is lower, but not that it's because of the money issue. My experience with teens (having two in the house) leads me to beleive that money issues like that are taken for granted. I think the apathy is lower because such kids have been raised in an environment where academic achievement is an expectation.

 

[Toasted]

Do you really believe those who were educated at state schools are jealous of you?

Not in the general, but in the particular

 

[mike_v_s]

if it was a choice between my kids going to school with generally well behaved and confident children, with generally a will to learn and be educated...and sending my kids to a school where the majority may be well behaved and want to learn, but there is a small contigency who go to school because they HAVE to, and are extremely disruptive, often violent and threatening...i will choose the former.

I'd argue that a child's presence at a private institution has more to do with their parent's will than the child's will to learn. Affluence has no bearing on this other than the choice of institution.

While your age may make you more aware of what element you are trying to separate your future offspring from in your age group, your age also makes you unable to fully understand what impact, if any, exposure to the "undesirables" will have on your child's tolerances, predjudices, and ability to interact with others from differing backgrounds. Those last three characteristics are what people are referring to when they talk about real world experience. Everything you need to learn is not taught in a classroom.

Mike

 

[jazzbo]

I went to a private high school, (for Christians, although I'm not Christian). My mother worked two jobs and my father worked a lot of overtime to afford it for my sister and myself. We have never been rich. I appreciate very sincerely, the sacrifices they made for us, as going to a private school opened a lot of doors.

 

[Toasted]

I echo exactly the sentiments of jazzbo. My situation was very similar, except i attended a secular school.

I was sent to private school to precipitate a wider range of 'choices' in life - and I genuinely believe that attending private school has allowed me to take choices that i wouldnt have been able to take, attending state school.

 

[nonsqtr]

Yes, agreed. Ditto the above two posts.

 

[mike_v_s]

I echo exactly the sentiments of jazzbo. My situation was very similar, except i attended a secular school.

I was sent to private school to precipitate a wider range of 'choices' in life - and I genuinely believe that attending private school has allowed me to take choices that i wouldnt have been able to take, attending state school.

(no sarcasm intended) What choices were available to you that would not be available to another?


Mike

 

[Toasted]

I was able to chose to take A-levels that I couldnt have taken in the local state system.

I genuinely believe that I achieved higher results because I attended private school.

I had my choice of higher education institution, and degree. It was upto me which Univeristy that i wanted to go to - it wasn't dictated by my results.

 

[nonsqtr]

Yes, agreed again. The reality in today's University admission process, is that certain high schools are favored over others. I, for one, had a choice between five Ivy League universities, some of the best in the country, and I firmly believe that such a choice would not have been available to me, had I come from a public high school. The "bar" on private "college prep" type schools, is widely recognized to be very much higher than the "bar" in the public school system. So, a child with outstanding grades in the public school system, hardly stands a chance against a child with even "decent" grades in a "college prep" type private school. Like it or not, that's still the reality in today's world. I suppose it depends on where you're trying to go with your education. If an Ivy League university isn't important to you, then there's no point in spending all that money for a private education. On the other hand, if that "is" important to you, then the chances of attending MIT or Yale or Princeton, coming from a public high school, are practically nil. You can visit any of their web sites, to see what their admissions practices are like, and what the demographics are, in terms of secondary schools, of the kids they admit. They make "exceptions", based on outstanding accomplishment (but it has to be "really spectacular", and sometimes they have to fulfill racial quotas, that kind of thing), but by and large, if you want the benefit of that kind of education, you'd better start "early". I know parents that have recognized the reality of this situation, that start their kids along that path "really early", like in kindergarten or something. It pays off, trust me on that. There's a "system" in our educational system, that needs to be worked, if you want to keep the opportunities open for your kids. Also, there's the "career goal" thing. In my case, I wanted to be an engineer, and at the time I was going to school, there was a massive shortage of good engineers. These days, the same could probably be said for doctors (but not lawyers).

 

[groovit]

I've had all of my schooling at as private a school as you can attend: my dining room Because of being homeschooled, I am graduating a year early, taking two college classes, and generally getting ready for life-after-school. Needless to say, I like it

 

[jrthebassguy]

I've been to public school all of my life...however, where I live, public schools (especially high schools) are actually better than majority of private schools in the area. Better funding, programs, etc. And I seemed to turn out ok.

Of course, college is a completely different thing.

 

[bmc]

Yes, agreed again. The reality in today's University admission process, is that certain high schools are favored over others. I, for one, had a choice between five Ivy League universities, some of the best in the country, and I firmly believe that such a choice would not have been available to me, had I come from a public high school. The "bar" on private "college prep" type schools, is widely recognized to be very much higher than the "bar" in the public school system. So, a child with outstanding grades in the public school system, hardly stands a chance against a child with even "decent" grades in a "college prep" type private school. Like it or not, that's still the reality in today's world. I suppose it depends on where you're trying to go with your education. If an Ivy League university isn't important to you, then there's no point in spending all that money for a private education. On the other hand, if that "is" important to you, then the chances of attending MIT or Yale or Princeton, coming from a public high school, are practically nil. You can visit any of their web sites, to see what their admissions practices are like, and what the demographics are, in terms of secondary schools, of the kids they admit. They make "exceptions", based on outstanding accomplishment (but it has to be "really spectacular", and sometimes they have to fulfill racial quotas, that kind of thing), but by and large, if you want the benefit of that kind of education, you'd better start "early". I know parents that have recognized the reality of this situation, that start their kids along that path "really early", like in kindergarten or something. It pays off, trust me on that. There's a "system" in our educational system, that needs to be worked, if you want to keep the opportunities open for your kids. Also, there's the "career goal" thing. In my case, I wanted to be an engineer, and at the time I was going to school, there was a massive shortage of good engineers. These days, the same could probably be said for doctors (but not lawyers).

That's a very good post. It's the way my wife and I both see it. We are very fortunate to be able to send our kids to the school they attend. I'm not rich. I drive and 18 year old car. And it's 3:30am as I am coming home from a gig to help pay for it all. It's all about my two lovely teenage daughters that I keep waiting to turn into terrorists, but they just keep making prouder by the day.

Good post.

 

[mike_v_s]

I genuinely believe that I achieved higher results because I attended private school.

So I should call the school and credit them with your achievement? "Hey, thanks, if it wasn't for you he'd still have trouble figuring out which end of the keyboard is up"

I'd say that your personal achievement is a result of your hard work. I'd also go as far as to say that I believe you'd have gotten the same results no matter where you went to school. Take credit where it is due.

Mike

 

[bmc]

I'd say that your personal achievement is a result of your hard work. I'd also go as far as to say that I believe you'd have gotten the same results no matter where you went to school. Take credit where it is due.

Mike

You're absolutely right.

 

[SomecallmeTim]

So, a child with outstanding grades in the public school system, hardly stands a chance against a child with even "decent" grades in a "college prep" type private school. Like it or not, that's still the reality in today's world. I suppose it depends on where you're trying to go with your education. If an Ivy League university isn't important to you, then there's no point in spending all that money for a private education. On the other hand, if that "is" important to you, then the chances of attending MIT or Yale or Princeton, coming from a public high school, are practically nil.

I think that's the most logical reason to send kids to private school. Sometimes Ivy League schools look to outstanding public school students to try to diversify a little, but for the most part, they give little to those students in terms of scholarship money. I'm a product of public schools, but I applied to Yale and Brown as a bit of a goof, and to my surprise I got in to each. The catch was they gave me so little financial help that I wouldn't have been able to afford a single semester. I'd imagine that students coming out of a school system that the Ivy League considers "better" receive more financial aid from the Universities.