Probably a stupid question... earphones direct into active bass?

[Squid-TEGH]

I was fooling around and wondered if anything useful would happen when I plugged my earphones (sony MDR-XD200) directly into my bass, with the active pre-amp turned on.

To my surprise, I do actually hear the bass in the earphones. It doesn't sound amazing (actually it doesn't sound very good at all), though I don't know whether that's cos my "trick" is ill-advised, or because I'm just not very good yet.

I don't hear of folks plugging their phones direct into their bass though. I know that usually they plug into the amp instead.
But I haven't got one yet. £350 takes a few weeks of saving .

Can I get away with doing this for a while?

 

[13lues]

If it helps you hear yourself practice. Go with it.

 

[ArtechnikA]

...Usually they plug into the amp instead.
But I haven't got one yet. £350 takes a few weeks of saving.
Can I get away with doing this for a while?

Won't hurt anything.
But an functionally adequate headphone practice amp shouldn't set you back more than $20-50...

 

[mambo4]

An active bass's pre amp will produce a line level signal, which is audible but not optimal for headphones.

from this Invalid Link Removed

Line level outputs .. are intended to drive loads that have a high input impedance. They are typically optimized for very low noise and low distortion when used with high impedance loads.

Headphone outputs ... are intended to drive the lower impedances presented by headphones . They are optimized for being able to drive higher current and for delivering reasonable distortion and noise with low impedance loads.

Line level outputs usually do poorly when driving headphones because their higher source impedance will not properly damp the driver at low frequencies and they can suffer from high frequency rollof when loaded with significant capacitance.

 

[Squid-TEGH]

Is it the case too that the sound I get direct from the bass isn't the "final" sound? That its tone will be substantially changedby the amplifier itself?

 

[ArtechnikA]

Is it the case too that the sound I get direct from the bass isn't the "final" sound? That its tone will be substantially changed by the amplifier itself?

Maybe.
For sure, there's that impedance-mismatch issue so what you're hearing from headphones direct isn't likely to be much like an amp, with its high-impedance input, will hear.
Some people like to run the amp's EQ relatively flat and mostly uncolored; some boost or cut different frequencies to their taste.
Cabinets will impart a voicing, some more extreme than others.
This is one reason why many studio and live performers bypass the cabinet and send a signal via DI. This can be pre- or post-EQ, depending on the amp and possibly its settings.
And if you're using any effects, for sure they'll affect the tone as well.

 

[Camaro]

Is it the case too that the sound I get direct from the bass isn't the "final" sound? That its tone will be substantially changedby the amplifier itself?

Depends on the Amp design, some are more "coloring" then others. Tube Amps in particular are supposed to influence the sound in a pleasant way.

However I think you are misunderstanding something here, the problem of plugging a Headphone into a line level is that the headphone speakers are improperly driven by the signal, not the lag of an amp per se.
You can build an Line to Headphone level converter without a amp( in the "bass amp" sense).

 

[Squid-TEGH]

Depends on the Amp design, some are more "coloring" then others. Tube Amps in particular are supposed to influence the sound in a pleasant way.

However I think you are misunderstanding something here, the problem of plugging a Headphone into a line level is that the headphone speakers are improperly driven by the signal, not the lag of an amp per se.
You can build an Line to Headphone level converter without a amp( in the "bass amp" sense).

I understood that the speakers weren't properly driven by the signal, but I thought an amp would compensate for that, wouldn't it?
All I need to do is buy my amp and plug some headphones in. Or better yet, buy my amp and not plug some headphones .

Maybe.

I think that's what I was getting at. I think the bass would probably sound better through an amp .

This is one reason why many studio and live performers bypass the cabinet and send a signal via DI. This can be pre- or post-EQ, depending on the amp and possibly its settings.
And if you're using any effects, for sure they'll affect the tone as well.

So they plug the guitar into one of those rackmount doohickeys which works its magic and then outputs it to all the cabinets?

 

[ArtechnikA]

Pretty sure this discussion should be someplace besides 'General Instruction' -- Amps, maybe...

So they plug the guitar into one of those rackmount doohickeys which works its magic and then outputs it to all the cabinets?

No.
For this part of the discussion, you really should be reading some of the stickies in Amps and Live Sound...
It's a huge topic and even a good summary is too long to type here...

A 'lot' of sound coloration comes from the cab. Some people like that. If you're playing live, with just the amp, this is the sound you get. If you're recording, you'll need to use a microphone at the cabinet to get that sound. But if you're recording, or playing a large venue with a PA, there's another, arguably better way to get the signal out - sending a balanced DI (Direct Input or sometimes Direct Injection) signal.

There's a lot of great information on sound reinforcement already posted here for the finding.

In the meanwhile, I'd recommend getting a nice headphone amp to really get a feeling for what your instrument sounds like, and what you can do with the onboard tone controls and technique. Keep on saving your money for a big amp.

I've got a big rig, and a smaller backup/acoustic gig rig, and 90% of my practice is with good headphones into a small recording interface. YMMV...

 

[Squid-TEGH]

Pretty sure this discussion should be someplace besides 'General Instruction' -- Amps, maybe...
No.
For this part of the discussion, you really should be reading some of the stickies in Amps and Live Sound...
It's a huge topic and even a good summary is too long to type here...

A 'lot' of sound coloration comes from the cab. Some people like that. If you're playing live, with just the amp, this is the sound you get. If you're recording, you'll need to use a microphone at the cabinet to get that sound. But if you're recording, or playing a large venue with a PA, there's another, arguably better way to get the signal out - sending a balanced DI (Direct Input or sometimes Direct Injection) signal.

There's a lot of great information on sound reinforcement already posted here for the finding.

In the meanwhile, I'd recommend getting a nice headphone amp to really get a feeling for what your instrument sounds like, and what you can do with the onboard tone controls and technique. Keep on saving your money for a big amp.

I've got a big rig, and a smaller backup/acoustic gig rig, and 90% of my practice is with good headphones into a small recording interface. YMMV...

Thanks. I'll look through the stickies. I'm glad you managed to answer another question which I had wondered, which is "without an amp, how do I know what my bass actually sounds like".

I might get a small headphone amp, but it'd delay me being able to afford the big one.
Still, looks like I've got some reading to do . I never really looked into amp/cab configurations because it's less of an immediate concern than learning to ply. But it'll be good knowledge to have .

 

[JTE]

Also consider this. Most active instruments use a tip/ring/sleeve output jack. The tip the output. The ring gets shorted to the sleeve to complete the circuit and power the preamp, but that only works when you use a mono plug. Headphones use a T/R/S plug, but both tip and ring are signal (left and right). I suspect your preamp isn't on at all, or just very little bleed due to the relatively low impedance of your phones.

 

[Camaro]

I understood that the speakers weren't properly driven by the signal, but I thought an amp would compensate for that, wouldn't it?

"Compensate" is the wrong word, IMO. It converts it. An converter could convert it without Amplification. And a amp _could_ amplify it without conversation.

It's an extra feature of your amp to have a Headphone out. Early ones didn't have that.
Link Removed

I think the bass would probably sound better through an amp .

I think you want to justify G.A.S. (Gear Acquisition Syndrome)

 

[Squid-TEGH]

Ah. Didn't know that. I'm beginning to understand why amps are expensive .

As for the GAS, come on, don't tell me the Amp's not sexay .

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

 

[ArtechnikA]

Ah. Didn't know that. I'm beginning to understand why amps are expensive.

You seem to be looking at combos. So that's an amp -and- an integrated speaker cabinet.
Good sound does not come cheap - it just doesn't. Unfortunately, sometimes, bad sound doesn't come cheap - you must shop carefully.
But you have to know this: musical instruments will always be high-margin products because no one _needs_ a musical instrument.

As for the GAS, come on, don't tell me the Amp's not sexay .
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

I'll go as far as 'cute' ...

This is your thread, not mine, but if you're curious, here's my "big" rig: Rigs of Doom; Part 4 | Page 27 | TalkBass.com

 

[ddnidd1]

An active bass's pre amp will produce a line level signal,

Even though you have an onboard preamp, its not putting out line level.

 

[Squid-TEGH]

You seem to be looking at combos. So that's an amp -and- an integrated speaker cabinet.
Good sound does not come cheap - it just doesn't. Unfortunately, sometimes, bad sound doesn't come cheap - you must shop carefully.
But you have to know this: musical instruments will always be high-margin products because no one _needs_ a musical instrument.

Yes. I have neither the money nor the space for a 4x10" and a seperate head amp, for example

I'll go as far as 'cute' ...

This is your thread, not mine, but if you're curious, here's my "big" rig: Rigs of Doom; Part 4 | Page 27 | TalkBass.com

That is quite sparkly. But money aside, I don't currently have the space for something like that .

Even though you have an onboard preamp, its not putting out line level.

Active just soups up the output a little, right?

 

[bfields]

I'd recommend getting a nice headphone amp

Any specific recommendations? I have this little Vox (Vox AP2BS), which is convenient, but the hiss is pretty loud.

 

[ArtechnikA]

That is quite sparkly. But money aside, I don't currently have the space for something like that.

I understand. But my "little" rig is a GK micro head and a 1x12. I've started with a loud-ish prog band with 2 distorted extended-range guitars, keys, and drummer -- and it's loud enough for practice (350W into 8 Ohms) with the cab on a stand. Mind you, these are not "volume wars" guys and they understand practice-room levels and dynamics.

250W into a 15 should do well for you as long as anyone you're playing with gets that "stupid loud" is not appropriate for practice.

Active just soups up the output a little, right?

It's a little more complicated. There are -some- passive basses with higher output levels than -some- active basses. It's about more than output level. "Mostly" it's about having a buffered output level that is not as susceptible to cable-loading effects. It also tends to free you from the interactions of volume knob and tone knob, makes it a lot easier to have multi-band EQ onboard, and blend multiple pickups without them interacting.

 

[ddnidd1]

I
It's a little more complicated. There are -some- passive basses with higher output levels than -some- active basses. It's about more than output level. "Mostly" it's about having a buffered output level that is not as susceptible to cable-loading effects. It also tends to free you from the interactions of volume knob and tone knob, makes it a lot easier to have multi-band EQ onboard, and blend multiple pickups without them interacting.

+1

 

[vmabus]

If you could find some high-impedence mono headphones, it would work better, but a headphone amp would probably be cheaper:
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]