Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
ProCo Rat for Bass? Yes or No.
- Thread starter FunkyFever
- Start date
You could always just get a Locust Star when they go onsale Friday and be done with it.
I bought a 1991 Turbo Rat off Reverb today. It was pretty cheap so I'm going to try modding. Also, scored a EH Switchblade pro to mess with blending.
Both coming Friday. Woohoo!
Both coming Friday. Woohoo!
Last edited:
I also bought a TC Mojomojo this week and it came today. I didn't expect much from it and I am really pleasantly surprised. Sounds pretty good as a mild overdrive but this is thru headphnes on my home practice setup.
Will check it out tomorrow at rehearsal. I have the Rat and blender pedal coming as well. Going to be quite distracted lol.
Last edited:
If you want more bass response out of a RAT, just increase the capacitance in the filter circuit.
The 47 ohm resistor with the 2.2uF capacitor dampens frequencies below1.5kilohertz by 20dB
The 560 ohm resistor with the 4.7uF capacitor dampens frequencies below 60hZ by another 20dB
If you change the resistances you mess with the gain of the op amp in the pedal
To increase the capacitance you can just add another capacitor in parallel with the existing one, you just add the values up to get the total uF.
Add another 2.2uF across the existing 2.2uF and you get 4.4 uF in total.
I would try another 10uF across the 4.7uF and 2.2uF across the 2.2uFto start with.
The best way is to put a switch in so you can add the extra capacitance when you want it.
The 47 ohm resistor with the 2.2uF capacitor dampens frequencies below1.5kilohertz by 20dB
The 560 ohm resistor with the 4.7uF capacitor dampens frequencies below 60hZ by another 20dB
If you change the resistances you mess with the gain of the op amp in the pedal
To increase the capacitance you can just add another capacitor in parallel with the existing one, you just add the values up to get the total uF.
Add another 2.2uF across the existing 2.2uF and you get 4.4 uF in total.
I would try another 10uF across the 4.7uF and 2.2uF across the 2.2uFto start with.
The best way is to put a switch in so you can add the extra capacitance when you want it.
What Tassieviking said!
Below is a mod that uses caps and resistors in such a way as to retain the stock RATio *hah!* RATio, that was good eh? in the filter section, so the gain doesn't change like it does with the Reutz mod. Therefore it should retain the essence of the rodent pedal, while also retaining more bass.
The guy who makes them is a bassplayer and a member here on TB.
I think the Blower Box was made for bass. What's interesting is the BB doesn't mess with the high-pass filter section (TTBOMK), which is where most mods try to retain bass, but instead cranks up the values of the coupling capacitors: ex input cap stock is 22n, BB's is 100n...
Congrats!
I've heard the Reutz mod neuters the "Rat" essence. If you want the RAT sound with more bass, check out the Bass Boost mod by GGBB. He worked out few different ways to change the values in the HPF section of the Rat. Marcus Effects chose GGBB's method #2 and drew up an easy to follow switch diagram:
The little schematic in the Marcus' diagram above is from GGBB, one of his other methods separates the caps to two switches for a bit more versatility but I think the one Marcus chose is a good way to go... The above mod should retain the distinctive Rat sound and give you more bass, to boot.
You could combine this with other mods, of course, to get the most versatility.
For the clipping diodes, my planned mod is to have a switch that goes ORIG STOCK / TURBO / FAT ie 1n914 / red LEDs / BS170 & BATxx (41?)
The more recent "stock" Rats come with 1n4148 rather than 1n914. The LEDs is of course the Turbo, and the Fat Rat has asymmetrical clipping owing to its use of mismatched clipping diodes.
I'm also planning on socketing all the key caps (in/out/couplers) to further experiment with bass retention.
Online clips I couldn't tell the diff between the original 308 chip and whatever they're using now, but I went ahead and got some 308 chips anyway. I may try the other chip at some point.
With this build, I'm aiming to get a good bass response using as close to the original circuit as possible. Later on I'll go for an all-bells-&-whistles-included version.
So, 3-in-1 Rat that retains bass by incorporating 2 switches, and maybe include the Blower Box's coupler cap values, too!.
Below is a mod that uses caps and resistors in such a way as to retain the stock RATio *hah!* RATio, that was good eh? in the filter section, so the gain doesn't change like it does with the Reutz mod. Therefore it should retain the essence of the rodent pedal, while also retaining more bass.
The guy who makes them is a bassplayer and a member here on TB.
I think the Blower Box was made for bass. What's interesting is the BB doesn't mess with the high-pass filter section (TTBOMK), which is where most mods try to retain bass, but instead cranks up the values of the coupling capacitors: ex input cap stock is 22n, BB's is 100n...
Congrats!
I've heard the Reutz mod neuters the "Rat" essence. If you want the RAT sound with more bass, check out the Bass Boost mod by GGBB. He worked out few different ways to change the values in the HPF section of the Rat. Marcus Effects chose GGBB's method #2 and drew up an easy to follow switch diagram:
The little schematic in the Marcus' diagram above is from GGBB, one of his other methods separates the caps to two switches for a bit more versatility but I think the one Marcus chose is a good way to go... The above mod should retain the distinctive Rat sound and give you more bass, to boot.
You could combine this with other mods, of course, to get the most versatility.
For the clipping diodes, my planned mod is to have a switch that goes ORIG STOCK / TURBO / FAT ie 1n914 / red LEDs / BS170 & BATxx (41?)
The more recent "stock" Rats come with 1n4148 rather than 1n914. The LEDs is of course the Turbo, and the Fat Rat has asymmetrical clipping owing to its use of mismatched clipping diodes.
I'm also planning on socketing all the key caps (in/out/couplers) to further experiment with bass retention.
Online clips I couldn't tell the diff between the original 308 chip and whatever they're using now, but I went ahead and got some 308 chips anyway. I may try the other chip at some point.
With this build, I'm aiming to get a good bass response using as close to the original circuit as possible. Later on I'll go for an all-bells-&-whistles-included version.
So, 3-in-1 Rat that retains bass by incorporating 2 switches, and maybe include the Blower Box's coupler cap values, too!.
I just had a quick look at the RAT circuit on Electrosmash, they say that the 560 ohm resistor with the 4.7uF in series attenuates frequencies below 60Hz by 20dB.
The 47 ohm resistor with the 2.2uF capacitor attenuates frequencies below 1539 Hz by 20 dB.
The Juggernaut BASS RAT uses 220 ohm with 47uF to attenuate the signals below 15Hz only.
If you place 220uF across the 2.2uF capacitor it will change it from 1539hZ to 15Hz, then you would attenuate signals below 60Hz by 20dB and below 15Hz by 40dB I think. But I could be wrong.
I am just building a RAT SOLO copy for my daughter and I think I will have to fit a switch to add 220uF across the 2.2uF as she has both Tele and BASS she plays with. The SOLO I am making will have a 6 position switch for the 3 SOLO as well as RAT, TURBO RAT and You Dirty RAT on it.
The 47 ohm resistor with the 2.2uF capacitor attenuates frequencies below 1539 Hz by 20 dB.
The Juggernaut BASS RAT uses 220 ohm with 47uF to attenuate the signals below 15Hz only.
If you place 220uF across the 2.2uF capacitor it will change it from 1539hZ to 15Hz, then you would attenuate signals below 60Hz by 20dB and below 15Hz by 40dB I think. But I could be wrong.
I am just building a RAT SOLO copy for my daughter and I think I will have to fit a switch to add 220uF across the 2.2uF as she has both Tele and BASS she plays with. The SOLO I am making will have a 6 position switch for the 3 SOLO as well as RAT, TURBO RAT and You Dirty RAT on it.
Coz we're talking about Rats on bass. I got the Blue Colander Tremond and did a demo of it. I'm actually loving it for crunchy low gain stuff as I also have the Doppel for fuzz.
This is from 1994 :
As far as I know it's a 70's P-bass, into a Rat, into a 70's SVT.
No idea what mic's were used, or what ratio of clean DI is mixed in.
To be honest, in the early 90's I wasn't a fan of the Rat at all - not even on guitar.
I subsequently realised that the reason I struggled to get along with them on bass, was primarily because it just wasn't suited to the particular band I was in at that point, and secondly because every time I'd used one, it was with a Sting Ray.
I still find that an aggressive Sting Ray, and a Rat can be unbearably harsh (and if you dare let that Rat unleash it's full force, you can blast the paint clean off moving vehicles).
However, I do really love a Rat with a passive bass, and in a suitable musical context.
In recent years, if there hasn't been a Rat knocking around the studio, I've used either the Massey plug-in, or the version that can be purchased in the Amplitube plug-in.
I also bought one of those no-brainer cheap Mosky knock-offs, just to have a hardware version to hand. It's a lot of fun, and retains the low end better than most other versions (that don't include a blend control). But it is stupidly small, and consequently can't operate on battery power.
Still, at about $15 - $20 it's a worthwhile experiment, to see how you get along.
As far as I know it's a 70's P-bass, into a Rat, into a 70's SVT.
No idea what mic's were used, or what ratio of clean DI is mixed in.
To be honest, in the early 90's I wasn't a fan of the Rat at all - not even on guitar.
I subsequently realised that the reason I struggled to get along with them on bass, was primarily because it just wasn't suited to the particular band I was in at that point, and secondly because every time I'd used one, it was with a Sting Ray.
I still find that an aggressive Sting Ray, and a Rat can be unbearably harsh (and if you dare let that Rat unleash it's full force, you can blast the paint clean off moving vehicles).
However, I do really love a Rat with a passive bass, and in a suitable musical context.
In recent years, if there hasn't been a Rat knocking around the studio, I've used either the Massey plug-in, or the version that can be purchased in the Amplitube plug-in.
I also bought one of those no-brainer cheap Mosky knock-offs, just to have a hardware version to hand. It's a lot of fun, and retains the low end better than most other versions (that don't include a blend control). But it is stupidly small, and consequently can't operate on battery power.
Still, at about $15 - $20 it's a worthwhile experiment, to see how you get along.
Yeah, Mosky sounds great and it's real sturdy for something that costs 20 bucks. And has an lm308. Switch feels really nice, knobs are tight and feel nice to use. Everyone should own one.
Beware of the led on it though, that thing burns retinas. Had to coat mine with some dark nail polish.
Beware of the led on it though, that thing burns retinas. Had to coat mine with some dark nail polish.
How’s does the mosky do in the “keep my lows please” department??
My fav is the MXR m85 (for rat variant circuit)....., in a band setting it is a killer. And I’ve had my share of dirt that has come and hone over the last 20 years.
I never tried M85 but I would imagine it's better. That being said, I don't feel like I need any extreme low boosting with Mosky, it retains lows fine. It has a switch where you can flip it between two modes, on Turbo it retains a lot of lows. On "vintage" setting, not so much.
The rat circuit does a pretty good job of maintaining lows but it benefits heavily from an EQ that can boost the 100hz and under range for a bit more heft. A clean blend looper with a cheap rat clone and cheap graphic EQ would get the job done. Something like a Damnation Loop Blender with a cheap mini rat and graphic EQ would sound plenty huge.
100% correct, but by that point, just get a Rat Clone/Variant that has a built in clean blend and/or bass adjusted EQ.
Between the 3 pedals you need to get to that point, you've spent enough $$ to buy one, and used up 3x as much pedal board real estate and power supply outputs to get there.
Candidates-
Broughton Locust Star
IdiotBox Blower Box
Dunwich/Magic Volt Thrower
MXR-85
Fuzzrocious Cat Tail/Rat Tail
Source Audio AfterShock
