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Rack preamps with EQ: what's out there?

#21
Wasnex said:
If you can let go of the rack mount requirement, you may find one of the 2-channel Grace preamps meets your needs. https://gracedesign.com/products/instrument-preamplifiers The Felix is over your budget.

Another company to consider is Headway: Pre-amps – Headway Music Audio

Also Radial: PZ-Pro - Radial Engineering

These three pedal based preamp are really intended for acoustic instruments.
Click to expand...
I've got a Grace Felix and it's pretty fantastic. It sounds really great with my electric basses. I'm actually using it on my electric rig this month for a musical I'm doing. I had started with a tube preamp/DI but I was getting some interference (I'm pretty sure the stage lights are sharing the circuit with my stuff and causing the problem) so I switched to the Felix and it's been flawless.
 
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#23
Wasnex said:
I have run rack rigs. I am not necessarily opposed to the idea, but I think your vision may be a bit misguided. Your must haves have no mention of your artistic vision (the type of sound you want). The range of possible tones a preamp can produce depends on how it is voiced and how the EQ section operates, which can vary widely. For me the sound is usually the primary justification.

The current preamp rack preamp I thought of that meets the must haves is a Jule Monique. The "new price" is double your budget. This is a mono preamp, so it will not meet you channel switching requirements. Shop

I own the version of Monique with a built in 700W amp. It's a fabulous piece of kit. However some people love the way it sounds and some don't.

I am not familiar with Helix or other modeler options. However I know they are versatile. Even if a modeler rack is one channel, you should be able to run a reverse ABY to switch instruments and then select patches custom tuned for whatever instrument and sound you want. My guess is this option will best meet your needs.

My last touring rig was rack based. The front end of the rig was an Ashly MX508 rack mixer. This mixer is over your budget, but there are plenty of options that cost less. Some even have High Z inputs on a couple of channels. I chose this route to facilitate switching between fretted bass guitar, upright bass with a pickup, and electric upright bass. This MX508 does not have instrument level inputs. I used Shure A95U line matching transformers so I could plug into the mic inputs. This gave me gain and EQ for each bass. Also the mixer had a button to select between line and mic inputs. This line selector effectively served as a mute switch.

If you can let go of the rack mount requirement, you may find one of the 2-channel Grace preamps meets your needs. https://gracedesign.com/products/instrument-preamplifiers The Felix is over your budget.

Another company to consider is Headway: Pre-amps – Headway Music Audio

Also Radial: PZ-Pro - Radial Engineering

These three pedal based preamp are really intended for acoustic instruments.

I used to fantasize about certain rack preamps. Two I still think about from time to time are the Kern IP777 and Midas XL42. These are rare and long out of production and I have passed up reasonable deals on both.
Click to expand...
Grace Moxi seems to have great features (including 2 channels), and it costs 649 € in Europe (at least in France). But it's not rack mounted. It looks like a simplified version of Felix, it probably sounds great.
 
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#24
Jack said:
Rack stuff is just out of fashion which is a real shame. If you're into cleaner, more versatile sounds then don't discount channel strips. I had a rig once where I was aiming for one channel of a good PA and I had a Presonus Studio Channel that was amazing. Everything from Behringer to Millennia Media. The other thing to think about is that you could get a rack Helix for about 900 if you wanted to go used. Just sayin' :D
Click to expand...
This is something I hadn't thought of. I've checked the Presonus and it is also reasonably priced. Without getting into crazy expensive stuff like Neve and the like, what would be a step up from the Presonus?

I also read that bass-dedicated preamps usually have a more usable EQ while with general use channel strips that might not necessarily be the case?
 
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#27
Wasnex said:
I have run rack rigs. I am not necessarily opposed to the idea, but I think your vision may be a bit misguided. Your must haves have no mention of your artistic vision (the type of sound you want). The range of possible tones a preamp can produce depends on how it is voiced and how the EQ section operates, which can vary widely. For me the sound is usually the primary justification.

The current preamp rack preamp I thought of that meets the must haves is a Jule Monique. The "new price" is double your budget. This is a mono preamp, so it will not meet you channel switching requirements. Shop

I own the version of Monique with a built in 700W amp. It's a fabulous piece of kit. However some people love the way it sounds and some don't.

I am not familiar with Helix or other modeler options. However I know they are versatile. Even if a modeler rack is one channel, you should be able to run a reverse ABY to switch instruments and then select patches custom tuned for whatever instrument and sound you want. My guess is this option will best meet your needs.

My last touring rig was rack based. The front end of the rig was an Ashly MX508 rack mixer. This mixer is over your budget, but there are plenty of options that cost less. Some even have High Z inputs on a couple of channels. I chose this route to facilitate switching between fretted bass guitar, upright bass with a pickup, and electric upright bass. This MX508 does not have instrument level inputs. I used Shure A95U line matching transformers so I could plug into the mic inputs. This gave me gain and EQ for each bass. Also the mixer had a button to select between line and mic inputs. This line selector effectively served as a mute switch.

If you can let go of the rack mount requirement, you may find one of the 2-channel Grace preamps meets your needs. https://gracedesign.com/products/instrument-preamplifiers The Felix is over your budget.

Another company to consider is Headway: Pre-amps – Headway Music Audio

Also Radial: PZ-Pro - Radial Engineering

These three pedal based preamp are really intended for acoustic instruments.

I used to fantasize about certain rack preamps. Two I still think about from time to time are the Kern IP777 and Midas XL42. These are rare and long out of production and I have passed up reasonable deals on both.
Click to expand...
Hey thanks for the extensive reply, and I hadn't considered a mixer as an alternative to a 2 channel pre, but it sounds quite smart.

When it comes to the type of sound that I'm looking for, I tried to give some examples of the genres I play but I'm sure any preamp will have their own color... then it's a matter of having a good EQ to shape my sound, I think.

I'm also aware that I wouldn't be able to try many of the preamps that have been suggested in this thread, especially the pricier ones so I will need to go for something that's more mainstream for which I can at least read some reviews and possibly listen to some demos.
 
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#28
gtirard said:
I think my 3 suggestions meet all "must have" needs, including the budget limit.
Click to expand...
Sorry, I was looking at the good to have... ie 2 channel w/ 2 inputs. I also thought that a graphic eq was part of this wants/needs, but don't see it now.
 
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#29
Much as I hate to say it rack preamp setups seem to have gone the way of the dodo bird in favor of pedal preamps/modelers...buuut that being said I will never get rid of my rack gear! This is my current setup approaching 20 years old.

The SansAmp RPM is what I have, the RBI is still made. The GED 2112 preamp is basically the RPM with some upgraded features. All have either 1/4" or XLR for the preamp channel and the bypass channel. A simple passive XLR splitter would give you FOH and Power Amp, unless the power amp has a "through" jack to provide the split/pass.

Your good to have to switch between two basses with different gains, you could use a SonicCake Portal (OBN Mixer Clone) to adjust each bass so the volume is the same going into the preamp input. There are other external options to achieve this function. A graphic or parametric EQ rack unit there are a bunch available. Even a 31 band while overkill for bass offers the highest flexibility.

Not sure what the availability is in Europe, but I'm sure you have options.

Best of luck.

20230109_163944.jpg
 
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#30
Rack shelf, zip ties, any of the good pedal preamps that fit your description other than form factor. If you are willing to use 2U for your preamp, then any of the nice bass heads that have an effects out. I know it's not exactly what you asked for, but given the limited options, just trying to open up the playing field a little bit.
 
#31
xiaoma said:
This is something I hadn't thought of. I've checked the Presonus and it is also reasonably priced. Without getting into crazy expensive stuff like Neve and the like, what would be a step up from the Presonus?

I also read that bass-dedicated preamps usually have a more usable EQ while with general use channel strips that might not necessarily be the case?
Click to expand...
With regards to upgrades I'm afraid I can't help too much, I moved to floorboards and powered cabinets. I do know that I have liked the Neve-inspired stuff when I have been in studios before. Not exactly a hot take there, but the hype is indeed justified and they sound great on bass.

With regards to eq, maybe an argument can be made either way. Often, bass-specific eqs are designed to flatter a bass, you get the 'right' frequencies and curves. With studio channel strips you tend to get more, less specific eq. Even the Presonus has 2 semi-parametric bands and one fully parametric band, something not overly common on a bass amp. It's an eq with much more choice and scope.
 
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#35
#36
There's a Demeter VTBP-201 in the classifieds for US$450. It's in California, so shipping/customs will add to that. I tried a VTBP-201S recently (basically the same, just in a 1U rack unit). If you're looking for clean, you'd love it. I'm not sure about the output level, though.

I like a little more tube character - I have an Arkham Zephyr, which is a different kind of awesome. The EQ is a lot more flexible than you might think - read up on it on the Arkham website. Plenty of output level. It records well (the engineer preferred it over an RNDI track recorded alongside it). They're pricey new, and scarce used.

Someone mentioned the SVP-Pro. I have (essentially) one of those with a built-in power amp (also known as the SVT-3Pro head ;)). It definitely has an Ampeg vibe, I like the way it thickens up when the gain is cranked, but it can be run clean too. Switch the graphic EQ on or off to accommodate two basses with different voicing. These show up used from time to time - you might find the whole amp cheaper than the preamp!

Consider pedal preamps? I recently bought a Sushi Box FX pedal, the Underground Accelerator. It's a single-tube, "inspired" by the Alembic F-2B (which was a tweaked version of a Fender Showman preamp). It can be run clean or pushed into mild overdrive that I really like. That's permanently on my small pedalboard and will probably be joined by another Sushi pedal, since I almost always have two basses (fretted and fretless) at a gig. These are inexpensive compared to the rack units, you could probably buy two, plus a switch box, small pedalboard and power supply within your budget (but again there's that European upcharge).
 
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#37
#38
rickdog said:
Someone mentioned the SVP-Pro. I have (essentially) one of those with a built-in power amp (also known as the SVT-3Pro head ;)). It definitely has an Ampeg vibe, I like the way it thickens up when the gain is cranked, but it can be run clean too. Switch the graphic EQ on or off to accommodate two basses with different voicing. These show up used from time to time - you might find the whole amp cheaper than the preamp!
Click to expand...
The SVP Pro is one of those I'm considering, but I haven't been able to find a 2nd hand one yet.

Francis Hylton (Incognito) uses an SVT-4 Pro - I think - and an Ampeg fridge live, and I like his tone.
 
#39
BBE BMax Bass Preamp with Sonic Maximizer

High-quality bass preamp/processor
Useful in the studio and in demanding live applications
Class A/B front end emulates classic tube preamp
Electronically-balanced DI output
Quasi-parametric mid-range EQ with 12db of boost or cut between 250 to 1000hz
Single-knob soft-knee optical compressor
Inputs for both passive pickup and active pickup instruments
1meg ohm input impedance
Ground lift switch
Balanced XLR and 1/4" TRS Outputs
Military-spec circuit boards
Extra thick, extra wide circuit board traces for unequaled electron flow
1% metal film resistors throughout
Solid 1/4" thick aluminum extrusion front panel for extreme ruggedness
 

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