Rant:. Please learn the songs, darn it

[oldrocker]

I'm in the process of looking for a new band, and someone contacted me that's in need of a bassist for his cover band. He said they play "Allman Brothers, Hendrix, Clapton, ZZ Top, etc." I took a hard pass. I can't imagine trying to get them to update their setlist.

Throw in some Stones, Skynyrd and CCR and I'd be right there. That's fun stuff to play - with the right players,

 

[baileyboy]

My 2 cents: If you are not gigging with them, leave. If you are gigging with them, stay with them until you find another band that does their homework. Very frustrating, I know.

 

[74hc]

I consistently learn songs if I'm paid to. Otherwise, no gaurantees and I'll use the sheet music if needed. Time is valuable, time is money.

 

[bikeplate]

Just lazy. Plain and simple. Find some like minded people

 

[mac10]

Anyone here care to admit being the lazy member of the band? There’s gotta be one!

 

[LBS-bass]

It’s more fun when it doesn’t suck though

Yep. This. Which is why I have to find players who care as much as I do, even when we know it's not how we're going to make our living. It has to be worth it in some way. If it ain't money, it darned well better be musically fulfilling.

 

[Evil Funk]

Ug. We've been playing these new songs all summer. We have a gig on Saturday. Dontcha think it's time your remembered the arrangements? All summer. This song is 50 years old...any time you could have made a chart...or downloaded one off the internet.

Also, we play all the other ones the same way in the same keys every time. You don't need to flip through the book before we start. You should know them by now. Plus, they are all on YouTube...we didn't write them.

And drummer, don't play fills over the lyrics. We've already discussed this.

I put in my own prep time and always feel I play like crap because I'm too busy managing the madness when folks cant recall the key or arrangements.

OK. rant over. Nothing new here.

I put in as much prep time as i can. However, i'm new in the band. My singer gave me the names of 100 songs to learn and 4 weeks deadline until my first show with them. I got to practice with the guitar player only, 4 times total, and most of those 2 hour practices was him showing me that what i learned was useless. A third of the songs were going to be in different keys than as recorded on the album, and that they had changed many of the parts and intros. Half the songs i had never even heard before. That made remembering the arrangements difficult.

Finally met the drummer at my first show, and found out he was in the same boat as me. New, given little time to learn anything, and he didn't get anyone to practice with.

It was the singer's band, and apparently he lost the bass player and drummer at the same time. He just wanted his band put back together ASAP as he had 7 shows lined up in August (the band gets $800-1000 a night and he didn't want to miss the $$)

Wanna know the hardest thing for me was? In the first set of the first show with them, the singer decides to play 4 songs not on that list that i had never even heard of. I said i didn't know them, he said he'd tell me what key they were in, and tell the drummer if it was a slow beat or fast. Me and the drummer just shrugged. Thankfully we were both experienced enough to know how to make it work in a situation like that.

Btw... we received no set list, we were told that the singer will pick whatever songs he wants to play at whatever time he wants to play them.

So yeah, i agree with you about preparedness. But it isn't always so cut and dry.

 

[Manticore]

I'm sorry, but there is no time to even try to work with those that can't or won't be prepared. If someone shows up unprepared once, shame on them. If they show up unprepared more than once, shame on me for wasting time on them.

 

[LBS-bass]

I put in as much prep time as i can. However, i'm new in the band. My singer gave me the names of 100 songs to learn and 4 weeks deadline until my first show with them. I got to practice with the guitar player only, 4 times total, and most of those 2 hour practices was him showing me that what i learned was useless. A third of the songs were going to be in different keys than as recorded on the album, and that they had changed many of the parts and intros. Half the songs i had never even heard before. That made remembering the arrangements difficult.

Finally met the drummer at my first show, and found out he was in the same boat as me. New, given little time to learn anything, and he didn't get anyone to practice with.

It was the singer's band, and apparently he lost the bass player and drummer at the same time. He just wanted his band put back together ASAP as he had 7 shows lined up in August (the band gets $800-1000 a night and he didn't want to miss the $$)

Wanna know the hardest thing for me was? In the first set of the first show with them, the singer decides to play 4 songs not on that list that i had never even heard of. I said i didn't know them, he said he'd tell me what key they were in, and tell the drummer if it was a slow beat or fast. Me and the drummer just shrugged. Thankfully we were both experienced enough to know how to make it work in a situation like that.

Btw... we received no set list, we were told that the singer will pick whatever songs he wants to play at whatever time he wants to play them.

So yeah, i agree with you about preparedness. But it isn't always so cut and dry.

This bandleader is an idiot who should have cancelled these shows and stopped booking until he had his house in order. That's pretty cut and dried in my book.

 

[Tad]

I feel your pain. I make sure I've listened a few times to the songs (that probably counts for 80% of my 'practicing') and have played through our setlist at least twice. Between bass playing and singing leads on some and hvox on most of the remainders, I'm certainly not perfect. But I show up prepared. Almost always; life sometimes gets in the way.

It sounds like we both wonder if others ever pick up their instruments between rehearsals. I've been pretty sure some of my bandmates leave theirs in their cars until the next rehearsal or gig.


That's true in my case, and likely with many (most?) here. Still, any group endeavor in which you give at least 95% whilst others are around 50% quickly loses much of its attraction. Worse yet, it will likely negatively affect your skills/motivation.

If that happens, I bail. I did so from 2 bands in the past 2 years due much more to lack of effort than lack of talent. I can put up with the latter to some degree, but the former is inexcusable. Life is too short to play with people who are half-assing it. Find others who are more motivated; they're out there.

Good luck! Let us know what happens.

There are a few issues at play here:

Are you playing for you or for them, or for some other reason? This is an internal vs. an external locus of control consideration.

Do you prepare and play your best because your performance is more important to you than you perceive theres’ to be? Is how well they prepare a major component of your motivation to prepare?

Are their differential reasons/motivations for preparation vs. lack thereof that are more significant to them than you acknowledge? Why might that be? (i.e. y’all want to practice on the night or night after my daughter’s volleyball/basketball games are?)

How many opportunities to play with others are available to you? I’m aware that geography has a significant impact on this.

After weighing these factors and possibly others, only you can decide if the issues that you perceive are problematic enough to impact what effort or not you want invest from your time in practicing, rehearsing, and otherwise preparing to play with this group.

You are the only one that can decide whether or not it is worth it to you.

 

[Kipp Harrington]

I think it really comes down to the fact that some of us have a passion for music and some don’t. I have been learning a ton of songs lately and there are some I really don’t care for. However, I want to be the best I can be when called upon. I’ve also discovered that some of the songs I never cared for are much more interesting after I have learned the bass line(s).

 

[Moose22]

This bandleader is an idiot who should have cancelled these shows and stopped booking until he had his house in order. That's pretty cut and dried in my book.

Or make it work. Why 100 songs? Why no guidance?

If you REALLY want to keep the gigs, how many songs does it take to get through a night? Start there. 25 songs maybe? 30? No way it's 100. Unless it's all 1:40 Ramones songs string into a medley.

That's more doable. Give GUIDANCE on things like keys and things you do differently than what you're covering. Stick to your setlist. Add a few songs every gig.

4 weeks with extra effort is plenty of time for 25 songs. As long as the singer/BL makes the effort.

And I think that's kind of what this thread's bitching is all about. Not making any effort is just discourteous to the folks you're playing with. It's OK for an informal jam, but if you're charging $1000 to play I can throw out the word unprofessional.

 

[Gianni "Orlandez" Orlati]

It is. I just felt like blowing off some steam.

The bass player (not me) is usually the least prepared but has the best ear and can fake it. That’s the problem. He literally NEVER listens to the music ahead of time, afterward or anything else. Some we’ve played for a long time he doesn’t know the names.

We started this as a jam and he joined to meet people. He’s a super guy but blues is not his genre. But still for the good of the rest of us, listen to this stuff in the car or something. He’s a great guy doesn’t drink or create issues. Brings the PA (I have one, we rehearse at my house). Just doesn’t know the tunes. All summer we’ve spent on one 3:00 song. Arg.

... just my 2 cents .. may it be the case that he doesn't like that tune or the genre it belongs to? Sometimes this is the problem, and, unfortunately, it can't be easily solved I guess

 

[Stranger Danger]

Yep. This. Which is why I have to find players who care as much as I do, even when we know it's not how we're going to make our living. It has to be worth it in some way. If it ain't money, it darned well better be musically fulfilling.

The 3 requirements: good money, good music and good hang. It needs to be 2/3 minimum

 

[3Liter]

... just my 2 cents .. may it be the case that he doesn't like that tune or the genre it belongs to? Sometimes this is the problem, and, unfortunately, it can't be easily solved I guess

This was my mistake all along. He lives close by and was looking to meet people as a bass player. He's a professional musician during the day (solo guitar) and a very nice guy, but just very lazy (busy?) when it comes to this. He's new to any genre that's not his own, but you'd think the group dynamic would force you to WANT to know the material a little better. Especially as we've been playing some of these tunes for a long time.

I've let the problem go on too long without having a "conversation" with him, outright firing him or blowing up the band. We don't gig that much, he brings the PA and sweats all that, so I let it ride and come to the internet to complain.

 

[Pete Greenfield]

take a deep breath...and lower your expectations: it's a hobby for everyone involved, right?

You are absolutely right, in my case at least. I'm going to recite it in my head next time I'm faced with 'how does that bit go?' I play with some amazing people, love the bands I'm in and it's a lot more enjoyable if you take a limited amount of rough with the smooth. Thanks for the post

 

[ZAR14]

What really irritates me is when you are scheduled for an Audition, asked to lean X amount of songs and when you're at the Audition the band goes off in a completely different direction, throwing out random songs.
The Audition basically turns into a "Jam Session".
Why ask someone to take the time to learn particular songs if you're not going to play them...

 

[Gianni "Orlandez" Orlati]

What really irritates me is when you are scheduled for an Audition, asked to lean X amount of songs and when you're at the Audition the band goes off in a completely different direction, throwing out random songs.
The Audition basically turns into a "Jam Session".
Why ask someone to take the time to learn particular songs if you're not going to play them...

... the best is when you are invited for a job interview by an employer looking for a specific profile and, when you are there, you discover, by what the HR guys ask you, that they haven't got a precise idea about what they are looking for, or, worse, that there was a mistake in the candidates pre-qualification/selection procedure

 

[friskinator]

Throw in some Stones, Skynyrd and CCR and I'd be right there. That's fun stuff to play - with the right players,

I'm sure it could be for the right bassist, but it's just not for me. And if the band is committed to that genre, it's definitely going to limit bookings.

 

[dr doofie]

Anyone here care to admit being the lazy member of the band? There’s gotta be one!

I’ll get back to you ...