Refusing to play at places where smoking is allowed

[bassfran]

I don't like hearing rap music being played.
Should we pass a law banning it?

Yep.


(Sorry to quote you out of context, Nort- I had to go for the lulz )

 

[Lee H]

Ok, all this about rights and the owner's right to run his business and all sounds really good. I will bet it sounds absolutely fabulous to those who like to beat their chests about freedom, especially when it supports their own interests


But here is a fact that even those cannot deny. The moking ban, in CA was NOT passed to protect those who choose to dine or drink at one place or another

It was passed to protect the servers, buss people, hostesses, and bouncers, who did not have the option of going to a non smoking establishment. It was made to protect them from selfish and discourteous individuals who thought of their own habit and had no consideration for the health of others. It was passed to keep greedy owners from sacrificing employee health to better their own profit margin...


Once again, I emphasize... If smokers had considered the effect on others and the repercussions of their actions, these bans never would have happened. If smokers had considered others instead of their own habit first and foremost, there never would have been cause for the bans... No matter how you twist it, the smoking restrictions were reactionary to inconsiderate individuals abusing the health of others for their own pleasure

 

[nortonrider]

Don't want to work in a smoking establishment,
DON'T WORK IN A SMOKING ESTABLISHMENT!

yes...... it really is that simple!

 

[jmattbassplaya]

Are you guys really arguing about smoking in places? Why does one side have to completely win out? Right now we have some places that allow smoking, and some places that don't. Everyone wins this way, so why argue about it further?

 

[Smallmouth_Bass]

Spade, you seem fine with people telling other people what to do, so how would you like it if one of the things in your life were outlawed because some people don't agree with it? What if they outlawed your favourite food because it casues cancer, because LOTS of stuff causes cancer? Are you still going to support that ban? It is safer for everybody, right?

If you let one group of people's rights get squashed, whose next? Because it certainly won't stop with smokers, they are already attempting to outlaw junk food, obesity is a FAR larger epidemic than smoking. I would march right to parliament hill for french fries! People have the right to freedom, whether you like their lifestyle or not.

If people have bad habits that don't affect others, then I have no problems with it because it's their bad habit. However, with smoking, there is no option but to affect the others around them. That's the main problem.

If you were a raging alcoholic, that wouldn't affect me provided you weren't obnoxious and in my face or puking in my vicinity. However, get behind the wheel and I have a problem with that because it is no longer your problem (or bad habit) and it becomes everyone else's.

 

[Fergie Fulton]

Smoking.....rights to do it..........freedom of choice........rights not to suffer others choices.......rights not to suffer others use........why should my health suffer for the actions of others........why should children suffer because of the actions of others.......if others are doing it and I am not then I have no choice...why should the actions of others affect me?

Pollution.....rights to do it..........freedom of choice........rights not to suffer others choices.......rights not to suffer others use........why should my health suffer for the actions of others........why should children suffer because of the actions of others.......if others are doing it and I am not then I have no choice...why should the actions of others affect me?

Noise.....rights to do it..........freedom of choice........rights not to suffer others choices.......rights not to suffer others use........why should my health suffer for the actions of others........why should children suffer because of the actions of others.......if others are doing it and I am not then I have no choice...why should the actions of others affect me?

Politics.....rights to do it..........freedom of choice........rights not to suffer others choices.......rights not to suffer others use........why should my health suffer for the actions of others........why should children suffer because of the actions of others.......if others are doing it and I am not then I have no choice...why should the actions of others affect me?

Religion.....rights to do it..........freedom of choice........rights not to suffer others choices.......rights not to suffer others use........why should my health suffer for the actions of others........why should children suffer because of the actions of others.......if others are doing it and I am not then I have no choice...why should the actions of others affect me?

Anything really that can have a focus put on it and thought through to a single conclusion.....rights to do it..........freedom of choice........rights not to suffer others choices.......rights not to suffer others use........why should my health suffer for the actions of others........why should children suffer because of the actions of others.......if others are doing it and I am not then I have no choice...why should the actions of others affect me?

 

[Floyd Eye]

Again, depends on where you're located. I'd really need to go out of my way to find a venue that allowed smoking in the first place, so saying that I'm unwilling to play at smoking venues would be a moot point.

Almost every band in the last decade has smoked outside.

My only deal-breaker is cats because I'm deathy allergic. That one really holds me back.

That's probably true. I guess in STL we are not as "Progressive". Of all the places we play I can only think of one that is non smoking. If the OP has a medical reason for refusing a gig, no sane person could fault him for that.

 

[Floyd Eye]

How is smoking an unalienable right, a heritage, a disability, a necessity, etc? Smokers act as if they're fighting for something as righteous as religious freedom, but it's not. That's not political, that's just common sense. Only smokers see it otherwise.

This is no different if you substitute alcohol, trans fat, every recreational drug ( including coffee and ALL caffeine) ??

I am a smoker and though I tend to be pretty aware of people not wanting to be around it and I try to not force my habit on anyone else, it is quite a stretch to posit that it is not my right to consume a perfectly legal product. To remove tobacco from the list of things I have the right to abuse you need to first outlaw it. Well, technically you need to first use propaganda to radically change the general opinion of it, THEN outlaw it, but this has been fairly effectively done already. Rules for radicals ( or progressives) are pretty effective I'd say, however, you still must follow the rules. Rules are rules.

Back to the original topic. Here is a similar ( only reversed), true scenario.

As I said earlier, here in STL we are not nearly as progressive as the sophisticated folks out on the coasts and while certain little townships have their bans on indoor smoking, by and large it is left to the owners of the establishment as to whether or not they want to expose their patrons to the deadly 2nd hand smoke. Most likely due to the fact that smokers rarely become "Regulars" in non smoking bars, the majority of them have opted not to ban smoking.

There is however one bar that my band plays regularly that did just that. Now I am a smoker and a fairly heavy one, particularly if I am having some beers. When this establishment went non smoking, I instantly became less enthusiastic about playing there. Not so much because I couldn't wait an hour to go outside between sets and grab a smoke, but because it makes it tougher for a band to draw well. Most of my friends and most of our fan base are smokers. Getting them to travel from our area out to this bar with regularity is somewhat challenging already. Add to it that now they have to go outside to smoke and it becomes problematic. Nevertheless, I did not decide to "refuse" to play there. The draw at this particular bar did drop and while we still thoroughly enjoy playing there, it is consistently our smallest audience. Add to it the fact that this place has an outdoor beer garden where people can smoke and they usually leave the door open so these people can hear the music, which has on 2 occasions resulted in police coming to tell the owner that the music was too loud and it becomes really problematic. So now this place has several strikes against it. I can't smoke. Our draw suffers because our people can't smoke and we have to deal with cops. Nevertheless, we play there once a month, with none of us refusing perfectly good income because of the inconvenience.

I do not regularly hang out in bars. I pretty much only go there to play, but I think if I did hang out in bars I would only hang out in bars that allowed smoking and I believe that people who did not wish to be around smoke/smokers should limit their bar experience to establishments that do not allow smoking.

Just my own small, meaningless opinion.

 

[Stormer]

a bar should smell of stale smoke and beer...
its much better than body odour, farts and feet....disgusting.

 

[spade2you]

If people have bad habits that don't affect others, then I have no problems with it because it's their bad habit. However, with smoking, there is no option but to affect the others around them. That's the main problem.

If you were a raging alcoholic, that wouldn't affect me provided you weren't obnoxious and in my face or puking in my vicinity. However, get behind the wheel and I have a problem with that because it is no longer your problem (or bad habit) and it becomes everyone else's.

There are laws in place if one's drinking gets out of hand.

 

[spade2you]

Don't want to work in a smoking establishment,
DON'T WORK IN A SMOKING ESTABLISHMENT!

yes...... it really is that simple!

Not everyone has the ability to hand pick their job. Some have to settle for what they can get. Not everyone works at a bar because they want to or enjoy it. In case you haven't noticed, there's this unemployment thing going on in the US.

Ok, all this about rights and the owner's right to run his business and all sounds really good. I will bet it sounds absolutely fabulous to those who like to beat their chests about freedom, especially when it supports their own interests


But here is a fact that even those cannot deny. The moking ban, in CA was NOT passed to protect those who choose to dine or drink at one place or another

It was passed to protect the servers, buss people, hostesses, and bouncers, who did not have the option of going to a non smoking establishment. It was made to protect them from selfish and discourteous individuals who thought of their own habit and had no consideration for the health of others. It was passed to keep greedy owners from sacrificing employee health to better their own profit margin...


Once again, I emphasize... If smokers had considered the effect on others and the repercussions of their actions, these bans never would have happened. If smokers had considered others instead of their own habit first and foremost, there never would have been cause for the bans... No matter how you twist it, the smoking restrictions were reactionary to inconsiderate individuals abusing the health of others for their own pleasure

Bingo.

 

[nortonrider]

Not everyone has the ability to hand pick their job. Some have to settle for what they can get.

That's a load of crap and you know it!

How many jobs have you been "forced" to work?
yeah, I thought so.

 

[Smallmouth_Bass]

There are laws in place if one's drinking gets out of hand.

And now a lot of places have non-smoking laws too. My guess is that it is just a matter of time before it becomes law in most of North America and Europe so I have a feeling that this will be a non-issue before long, just a way of life.

Anyone have a picture of a P-Bass or something to lighten the mood!

 

[punkjazzben]

I'm a classical liberal. You can do what you want, just don't harm or coerce other people. People here are claiming the 'right' to smoke wherever they want, but seem to forget the immense harm it can do to others. The effects of passive smoking are a matter of scientific consensus. So, I don't care if you smoke... Really, I don't care at all what you do privately. But don't force your tobacco smoke on other people in public places - that, my friends, is a true violation of rights.

 

[Willie Dizon]

To sonicland-I can totally relate to your situation since my lead singer has asthma and can't play any smoke tolerant gigs. If you were auditioning for my band you would be welcomed! I for one refuse to play smoking allowed gigs because I don't want to bring home second hand smoke to my children and wife. I am not willing to compromise when it comes to the safety and health of my family.Period,end of conversation!

 

[nortonrider]

Are / Were you people ever really Forced against your will to go into a smokey bar and party if you didn't want to?

 

[spade2you]

That's a load of crap and you know it!

How many jobs have you been "forced" to work?
yeah, I thought so.

My oh my, and I've been told I lack empathy for other people. I have no doubt you think you're winning, but you just stuck a blade in your cause.

Let's be honest, most full time lifers who work at a bar don't exactly have lots of job options, especially in today's conditions.

I am currently forced to work at my job because saturation has destroyed my market. My only choices are to suck it up, relocate and sell my house at a substantial loss, or start over and get a new job field (at a substantial pay cut). With many near retirement workers losing almost all of their retirement, the retirement cycle stopped just as schools started spitting out entirely too many of us. I'm lucky I got hired when I did because the market conditions mean I'd be taking a pay cut for doing the same jobs. I suppose I could quit my job and no longer pay bills...

 

[BassNeo]

I worked at a place that banned smoking.
It was a welding shop.
Perfectly fine to sit all day welding with smoke and fumes coming up into your face but don't dare light a cigarette up!

I work in a welding shop, and have for years. Welding smoke is different that cigarette smoke, but if a haze does appear I put on a respirator.

In Tennessee, venues may choose if they want to allow smoking or not. Most have banned it, but some haven't. Personally, I would have no need of a musician that was so sensitive that he couldn't handle a little bit of smoke, especially without some acute medical reason to do so.

I am allergic to cigarette smoke. If I'm exposed for more than a few minutes my sinuses swell shut and my throat gets irritated to the point I can no longer sing, which is a problem as I'm the lead.

Everyone has their opinion. Mine is not smoking-friendly. Thankfully where I live smoking is banned in all indoor workplaces and public spaces where children are present.

 

[spade2you]

And now a lot of places have non-smoking laws too. My guess is that it is just a matter of time before it becomes law in most of North America and Europe so I have a feeling that this will be a non-issue before long, just a way of life.

Anyone have a picture of a P-Bass or something to lighten the mood!

I don't think we'll ever get to a full blown prohibition, there will be enough hoops and inconveniences that some just give up. Basically everyonder 40 has been told that it's bad their whole lives, so most of the desire for youngsters to smoke is simply to be a rebel. As I said earlier, if someone really likes nicotine, have a chaw!

I found it funny that my employer cracked down on smoking with regards to no longer allowing smoking locations on campus and a huge discount on insurance for non-smokers.

(This is the part where someone says, OH YEAH?! A study showed that smokers were 28.5% more productive than non-smokers!!!111)

 

[BassNeo]

That's a load of crap and you know it!

How many jobs have you been "forced" to work?
yeah, I thought so.

I'm 'forced' to work in the welding trade because my business was forced to close down in the middle of the sub-prime mortgage crash. When the bank calls all your loans, lines of credit, bounces your payroll and forces you into bankruptcy, you do what you must to pay the bills and put food in the mouths of your children.

If I had the choice I would still be in business or better yet, I'd go back to school and do what I should have done, been a lawyer to stand up for the rights of people to say dumb stuff like this.