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Roscoe Club

#2,801
steelin4u said:
I gotta join Funky and show you guys my 'new-to-me' Century Signature 5 I finally received today. While I was waiting for UPS to get their act together, I read almost every page in this thread. Incidentally, I feel like I 'know' several of you already. I've surmised who likes DR Sunbeams, and many of the aftermarket preamp faves (Demeter pre with Roscoe Barts, Aggie/Aggie, etc.).

This is a great looking bass! I've very impressed with the carved top, and the workmanship on the neck (maple/Chechen/purpleheart/Chechen/maple with maple and cherry stringers). The spalted purpleheart fingerboard is just sick, to me at least. I'm super excited to get this set up to my tastes and take this bass out.

My first sound impression after changing it to new stainless steel strings and giving it a setup, however, is that this bass lacks the 'sparkling' highs that I've enjoyed on my other basses (I had 3 Carvins and 3 Warwicks, sold 2 wicks to finance this Roscoe). I tried lowering the pickups a little, with no distinct change in high end response (it obviously lowered the overall output, but frequency response stayed pretty even). I've found I have to dime the treble knob and then back it off to about 9.5/10 to get the high treble I'm used to with my single coil and split single coil basses. I'm using a GB shuttle 9.0 into a GB 12 with tweeter, and my amp setting typically produce plenty of smooth jazz-like highs. This bass has the Roscoe Barts and 18v bart 3-band preamp.

Is this lack of high end inherent in the Roscoe Bart dual coil pups/Bart pre? Any suggestions? I figured the hi-fi Shuttle with brand new Stainless Steel strings would be the ticket to the highs I'm used to. I guess the last thing to mess with is the trim pot on the back...maybe I can back that off to open up the high end. All suggestions, jokes, wise-a** comments and 'welcomes' are, well, welcome!

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Well, I can't remember or tell from the photos if that is an ash or cedar body - if it's cedar, it will tend toward "fat/warm" more than ash, naturally.

Either way, the first thing I'd change, if the sound is a bit dark for you, is the pickups - our custom wound pickups are a bit compressed, fat, and a bit on the darker side. I love 'em, but I can also hear what you're hearing - and if you're coming from a single coil background, it won't be exactly what you're used to. I think the CB pickups or the DCB's will be more to your liking. The preamp can be helpful as well, I like the Demeter just fine, but also think the OBP-3 may be a good choice, if the pickups don't do the trick (I'd start with the pickups, myself).
 
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#2,802
Gard said:
Well, I can't remember or tell from the photos if that is an ash or cedar body - if it's cedar, it will tend toward "fat/warm" more than ash, naturally.

Either way, the first thing I'd change, if the sound is a bit dark for you, is the pickups - our custom wound pickups are a bit compressed, fat, and a bit on the darker side. I love 'em, but I can also hear what you're hearing - and if you're coming from a single coil background, it won't be exactly what you're used to. I think the CB pickups or the DCB's will be more to your liking. The preamp can be helpful as well, I like the Demeter just fine, but also think the OBP-3 may be a good choice, if the pickups don't do the trick (I'd start with the pickups, myself).
Click to expand...
+1 to this. My pick would be Aguilar DCBs and OBP-1 but the pickups alone might get you there depending on the tone you're after.
 
#2,803
If all else fails and you want to go back to that single coil sizzle you can get some Aguilar Super Singles or Nordstrand Big Singles. The only thing with those though is that Roscoe uses a six string sized pickup for their five strings. You would have to specify that when ordering.

For me, I just bump a little treble to get the mids to make a little more sense if you get the meaning. All of my Roscoes are ash bodied so, they inherently have a little more high end. Its why I've decided to use mahogany or walnut on a future MM build. Those pickups don't need any help being bright!
 
#2,804
Jeff Moote said:
+1 to this. My pick would be Aguilar DCBs and OBP-1 but the pickups alone might get you there depending on the tone you're after.
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+1 to Jeff's +1. If you're a single coil guy, you probably won't find your sound with the Bartolini dual coils. I like Jeff's combination of the Aguilar pickups and preamp. The Nordstrands also create a lot of top end for the tone too.
 
#2,806
Gard said:
Well, I can't remember or tell from the photos if that is an ash or cedar body - if it's cedar, it will tend toward "fat/warm" more than ash, naturally.

Either way, the first thing I'd change, if the sound is a bit dark for you, is the pickups - our custom wound pickups are a bit compressed, fat, and a bit on the darker side. I love 'em, but I can also hear what you're hearing - and if you're coming from a single coil background, it won't be exactly what you're used to. I think the CB pickups or the DCB's will be more to your liking. The preamp can be helpful as well, I like the Demeter just fine, but also think the OBP-3 may be a good choice, if the pickups don't do the trick (I'd start with the pickups, myself).
Click to expand...

Gard,

This one is in fact an Ash body. The tone from the dual coil barts in this Century is reminiscent of my Warwick $$ with both MM pups set to serial output (which makes sense, I think). I never use that switch position on the Wick, really.

I must have grown very accustomed to my single coil basses! I really do like the sizzle I pull out of my 2 fretted Carvins, of which one has a maple body and neck (yep, all maple) with J/MM, the other is an ash body with 5-pc maple neck with JJ in soapbar housing. Snap and sizzle all over the place with no treble boost at all. I guess I should be looking at getting single coil pups into this Roscoe at some point. I'm going to rehearse and try some performances with it first. I've tried Nordy big splits and big singles and liked them (with an OBP-3)...maybe I'll end up going in the big split/bart pre direction.

Aggie/Aggie sounds like it might be a bit aggressive for me, especially the DCB, another dual coil. Am I wrong about that (Armybass)? I bet it may give me a little more high treble definition. I like a slightly 'mid scooped', compressed, polite tone with some >10kHz sizzle. Aren't most of these great descriptors for Bart single coils, or single coils in general? I don't want to replicate tone that I already have, but my ear wants it to be in the ballpark of what I have.
 
#2,807
Ryan L. said:
I ordered a Nordstrand 3 band preamp to put in my Century J now too. Figured I would give it a try with the Nordstrand single coils to see if it gets me where I want to be with it. (Actually, I just wanted to try something new/different. ......)
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Have you had a chance to drop in the Nord preamp?
 
#2,808
steelin4u said:
Gard,

This one is in fact an Ash body. The tone from the dual coil barts in this Century is reminiscent of my Warwick $$ with both MM pups set to serial output (which makes sense, I think). I never use that switch position on the Wick, really.

I must have grown very accustomed to my single coil basses! I really do like the sizzle I pull out of my 2 fretted Carvins, of which one has a maple body and neck (yep, all maple) with J/MM, the other is an ash body with 5-pc maple neck with JJ in soapbar housing. Snap and sizzle all over the place with no treble boost at all. I guess I should be looking at getting single coil pups into this Roscoe at some point. I'm going to rehearse and try some performances with it first. I've tried Nordy big splits and big singles and liked them (with an OBP-3)...maybe I'll end up going in the big split/bart pre direction.

Aggie/Aggie sounds like it might be a bit aggressive for me, especially the DCB, another dual coil. Am I wrong about that (Armybass)? I bet it may give me a little more high treble definition. I like a slightly 'mid scooped', compressed, polite tone with some >10kHz sizzle. Aren't most of these great descriptors for Bart single coils, or single coils in general? I don't want to replicate tone that I already have, but my ear wants it to be in the ballpark of what I have.
Click to expand...

Notdstrand big splits should work really well for those goals, or delano soaps like i had in my LG.
 
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#2,813
Well the Demeter on-board preamp finally arrived the other day and I won't go into all the details here but I will state that the preamp arrived with substitute potentiometers and after pulling the Bart out of my Roscoe I discovered that the threaded shaft of the pots wasn't long enough to extend through the control cavity to enable the installation of a nut and washer. They were panel mount pots which are designed to be installed in thin metal or plastic panels. Fortunately I had a dozen of so of the older style 100 ohm pots that I removed from other Demeter preamps (to install the concentric pot for the treble and bass controls) so I rewired the preamp. I also had to round up an EMG 25K potentiometer to replace the volume control. That being said James is quite aware now that he doesn't need to build his preamps using the new pots, although he's not totally convinced that purchasing the qty. (to make them affordable) of the former pots is a good idea since he doesn't think he's going to be doing business for another 15 years (due to age and potential retirement). He told me yesterday that did find enough of the former style pots laying around to build up another 4-5 preamps (I wish he had found them prior to building mine) but after that the availability of his on-board preamp might be in question. Get one while you can!;)

All that being said, the preamp sounds phenomenal in my mahogany/koa Roscoe LG-3005. I wanted to be pissed off after all the issues and aggravation of the install but after hearing it I can't doing anything but smile!:D
As good as this bass sounded with the Bart/Roscoe Bart combo it sounds so much better with the Demeter/Roscoe Bart combo. All harshness is gone. With the EQ controls run fairly hot, I'd describe the sound differences as:

  1. The highs are no longer harsh and dull (super clear and glassy now).
  2. The mid's are no longer nasal and bordering on honky (smooth and musical now).
  3. The bass is no longer boomy (smooth and tight now).
I guess the best way to describe it is the same way most of us old time Roscoeheads did back when we first installed the Demeter preamps in our Roscoe's:

"It sounds like someone took a blanket off of my speaker cabinet. The tones just open up."
​
I'll try to record some sound clips over the nest few days but unfortunately they typically don't capture the differences that you hear live with your ears.
 
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#2,814
armybass said:
I love Roscoes with the stock Barts but I love them with aguilars too. I also agree with Aggy pups and pres together. THe DCB's are unbeatable.
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Two of the golden pairings seems to be the Demeter pre/Roscoe Barts and Aggie OBP-3/DCB. With my mahogany/wenge SKB3005, I found the Roscoe Barts a bit too compressed and dark with the Aggie OBP-3. The Demeter preamp I had wasn't in very good shape so I opted to swap out the Barts for a pair of Aggie DCB's. They sound great together with a good mix of punch, growl, and clarity. Good articulation and harmonics, present mids but not nasal, and warm, not sterile.
 
#2,819
That bass is THE one. I could have no other basses, and never miss a beat, so to speak. In 4 years, I've put thousands of hours on her, and hundreds of gigs. It quite simply WORKS. And she's not half bad looking, either.

Jeff, yeah, I dropped Nordy NJ5S pickups into it. Still the Bart pre though.
 
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#2,820
Jon, that does look amazing!

Speaking of pickup swap-out, if anybody has a set of P4-sized pickups they aren't using (other than Roscoe Barts), I'd love to try something more hi-fi and less mid-forward. I'm ready to try or buy!

I was talking with Chris H at bestbassgear and he said that the Nordy big series of pups (even custom spacing ones) have to have an effective total spacing of 70mm over each pickup, otherwise they won't work. With the hipshot bridge adjusted all the way out, I'm measuring 71.2mm over the bridge and 68.3mm over the neck. So, custom Nordys are out for me according to him (I could have sworn someone else used them on an 18.3mm bridge Roscoe...).

Any other P4 brighter pickup suggestions? I guess I would be open to the Aggie DCBs, but I'm not convinced I'll get the bright, single-ish tone I'm after.

Thanks in advance to the roscoehead community for helping me 'set up' this bass in my tonal style...I want this to be a 'forever' bass for me like that beaut is for Jon!
 

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