Rosewood/Maple Finger Boards - Tone difference?

[Fuzzbass]

Seriously, sometimes the differences are nuanced, while other times it's pretty dramatic. If you've never noticed basses sounding different, that's you, not the instrument. It happens quite frequently.

99% of the audience can't tell a Hofner from an Alembic with ears alone, but 99% of us bassists can. So, the issue is: *Why* does bass X sound different from bass Y?

The answer is usually electronics, but we're talkin' fingerboards. The majority of us believe that when a maple board bass sounds brighter than a rosewood board bass, it's because of the fingerboard (for the purpose of this post, all basses are fretted). So... what's the explanation when a rosewood board bass sounds brighter than a maple board one? (It happens often... if you've never heard it, then it's you, not the instruments. ) Ohhhh, if rosewood board is brighter, then something *besides* the fingerboard is at play. But if "all else is equal", what then? A warp in the space-time continuum?

Short answer: it's the inconsistency of wood. All the tap testing in the world can't eliminate that inconsistency. I've noticed differences in tone from identical basses strung with identical string sets. Ken Smith said he's noticed differences between identical basses built with wood taken from the very same planks.


The logical conclusion is to listen with your ears, not your eyes. Ok, this doesn't apply when you can't try before you buy: in that case, go with your opinion, or that of your luthier. But most of us who have placed a custom order or built a parts bass will testify that actual results often vary from expected. It's not chemistry or math: there are many possible results for A + B + C, regardless of the skill of the manufacturer or quality of materials.

 

[jobo4]

The logical conclusion is to listen with your ears, not your eyes. Ok, this doesn't apply when you can't try before you buy: in that case, go with your opinion, or that of your luthier. But most of us who have placed a custom order or built a parts bass will testify that actual results often vary from expected. It's not chemistry or math: there are many possible results for A + B + C, regardless of the skill of the manufacturer or quality of materials.

+1

 

[savit260]

I think after 25+ years of playing countless basses, you can find some common characteristics in certain woods and combinations. Same with strings, speakers, etc. I think we can all agree that S/S's are brighter sounding than pure Nickles. This difference is more pronounced than the difference between fingerboard materials on otherwise identicle basses of the same consturction. Can the average person in the audience hear the difference? Probably not.

I do know that some people just can't hear certain things. I was once trying to explain how to get better fuel mileage by listening to the turbocharger, to an ex girlfriend. No matter how hard she tried, she just couldn't hear it. Does the fact that she couldn't hear the difference between the turbo spooled up or spooled down, mean that there's no difference in sound?

Pretty much the same thing here.

 

[Fretless5verfan]

I think after 25+ years of playing countless basses, you can find some common characteristics in certain woods and combinations. Same with strings, speakers, etc. I think we can all agree that S/S's are brighter sounding than pure Nickles. This difference is more pronounced than the difference between fingerboard materials on otherwise identicle basses of the same consturction. Can the average person in the audience hear the difference? Probably not.

I do know that some people just can't hear certain things. I was once trying to explain how to get better fuel mileage by listening to the turbocharger, to an ex girlfriend. No matter how hard she tried, she just couldn't hear it. Does the fact that she couldn't hear the difference between the turbo spooled up or spooled down, mean that there's no difference in sound?

Pretty much the same thing here.

Very interesting analogy! I tried to do the same thing with a friend who isn't a car nut....he couldn't hear the turbo either.

 

[savit260]

Very interesting analogy! I tried to do the same thing with a friend who isn't a car nut....he couldn't hear the turbo either.

So according to some of the logic here, since HE couldn't hear the turbo, it must sound the same as the naturaly aspirated version, and the only reason you can hear it, is because you've seen it under the hood.

 

[jobo4]

Whatever helps you sleep at night.

 

[jobo4]

So according to some of the logic here, since HE couldn't hear the turbo, it must sound the same as the naturaly aspirated version, and the only reason you can hear it, is because you've seen it under the hood.

So two non-car nuts can't hear the turbo difference. So we must not be bass afficianados.

Thanks for the hack inference.

 

[Fuzzbass]

I think after 25+ years of playing countless basses,

You're an old phart, too?

you can find some common characteristics in certain woods and combinations. Same with strings, speakers, etc. I think we can all agree that S/S's are brighter sounding than pure Nickles.

I would argue that these differences are statistical, and not absolute. In other words, they are generalities. I've heard nickel strings that were brighter than s/s. Speakers: I've heard punchy fifteens, and woofly tens. IME certain body woods *tend* to produce certain tones, but also IME there's plenty of overlap between species.

I do know that some people just can't hear certain things.

It's also true that some people hear what they expect to hear.

Puts this discussion in perspective: there is no hard scientific data that I'm aware of... it's all opinion. Do some opinions carry more weight than others? Sure, but you can find highly experienced luthiers who disagree about any phase of bass building, including the tonal contribution of fingerboard wood on a fretted bass.

 

[Fretless5verfan]

So two non-car nuts can't hear the turbo difference. So we must not be bass afficianados.

Thanks for the hack inference.

Whoa, reign in the defensive horse there cochise. Nobody's insulting anyone. We're merely pointing out the fact that is someone doesn't detect something it doesn't mean it's not there. Relax

 

[jobo4]

It's also true that some people hear what they expect to hear.

Puts this discussion in perspective: there is no hard scientific data that I'm aware of... it's all opinion. Do some opinions carry more weight than others? Sure, but you can find highly experienced luthiers who disagree about any phase of bass building, including the tonal contribution of fingerboard wood on a fretted bass.

+1. I love this guy.

 

[KJung]

These are always fun threads, and nobody ever really agrees.

With my research background in statistics and experimental design, I pretty much totally discount most comments regarding one particular component of a bass made by players who don't take other differences into account.

Until you hold all the other components constant, it's really impossible to assess the impact of a particular component ACROSS basses. So, many people that swear maple boards are 'brighter' have usually played those boards on basses with dense ash bodies, strung with SS strings, etc. Most RW boards seem to be on Alder basses. When you add different pickups, strings, pickup placement, fingerboard thickness, fret size, bridge, preamp, neck wood density, body wood, body wood density, neck joint design (bolt on), size of tone block (neck through), etc., etc., etc., etc., it's pretty hard to support these general statements.

For gosh sakes, I have two basses made by the same manufacturer with the same body woods, hardware, neck woods, preamp, strings, pickups, etc., etc.... and they sound VERY different.

So, IMO, most of this disagreement about whether you can hear differences in the board material is probably based on honest differences.... many maple board basses sound bright... some RW board basses sound brighter, etc., etc., etc.

 

[Fuzzbass]

Whoa, reign in the defensive horse there cochise. Nobody's insulting anyone. We're merely pointing out the fact that is someone doesn't detect something it doesn't mean it's not there. Relax

To be fair, "you can't hear the difference" is an ad hominem argument. I mean, I'd hate for this discussion to devolve into

A. "You can't tell the difference!"
B. "You're imagining the difference!"

 

[jobo4]

Whoa, reign in the defensive horse there cochise. Nobody's insulting anyone. We're merely pointing out the fact that is someone doesn't detect something it doesn't mean it's not there. Relax

Thats a defensive taxidermied Clydesdale pony, to quote my previous post.

 

[Fretless5verfan]

To be fair, "you can't hear the difference" is an ad hominem argument. I mean, I'd hate for this discussion to devolve into

A. "You can't tell the difference!"
B. "You're imagining the difference!"

It hasn't already?

Thats a defensive taxidermied Clydesdale pony, to quote my previous post.

Hah! Good one

 

[StarMountainKid]

Is the difference in the sound of fingerboard wood more pronounced in fretless basses? I have a LightWave fretless with maple fingerboard I played for a few months. Then I polyurethaned the fingerboard, and now the sound is definitely brighter. So, it seems fingerboards can make a difference in tone.

In fact, it almost completely cured the dead spot (C on the G string). I'm still curious about dead spots. If my fretless can have one, must not be the frets. The two Fender Jazz basses I've owned had the same dead spot in the same place.
Guess that's for a different thread, though.

 

[savit260]

You're an old phart, too?

Yup, I sure am!! Doesn't seem to be hurtin' me any though!!

Ha Just checked your profile Fuzzbass. Looks like you've got few years on me! The 25+ is just with fretted instruments. Throw in Keys and add 9 more years. I started real young.

Just noticed your Avatar. That's too funny!

 

[Fuzzbass]

Is the difference in the sound of fingerboard wood more pronounced in fretless basses? I have a LightWave fretless with maple fingerboard I played for a few months. Then I polyurethaned the fingerboard, and now the sound is definitely brighter. So, it seems fingerboards can make a difference in tone.

I believe most of us are assuming this discussion involves fretted fingerboards.

When it comes to fretless: in my limited experience I'd say that maple boards are generally brighter... but is that because of the wood, or because a maple board is usually finished whereas a rosewood board usually isn't?

 

[lug]

I believe most of us are assuming this discussion involves fretted fingerboards.

When it comes to fretless: in my limited experience I'd say that maple boards are generally brighter... but is that because of the wood, or because a maple board is usually finished whereas a rosewood board usually isn't?

Rosewood is more porous so some of the higher frequencies, being a smaller wavelength, fall into the pores of rosewood and get lost whilst a tight packed grain like maple bounces them all back into the string. That's my story and I'm sticking to it!

 

[Fuzzbass]

Rosewood is more porous so some of the higher frequencies, being a smaller wavelength, fall into the pores of rosewood and get lost whilst a tight packed grain like maple bounces them all back into the string. That's my story and I'm sticking to it!

That's one of the better stories I've heard.

 

[jzucker]

I don't care if Stradavarius himself comes back from the dead and says he made the a one off double bass out of a taxidemied Clydesdale pony, pulled cheese curd and pixie dust.

You still won't be able to tell the difference between a maple and a rosewood saddle.

Regards.

You might not but others can. This is the problem with these types of arguments and this type of politically correct logic. This is junk/pop/science.

An illustration:

A friend of my 17 year old son thinks that Jessica Simpson is just as good a vocalist as Sarah Vaughan. No matter what anyone says (and heaven forbid she should listen to someone with more experience or who is better informed), she knows that Jessica is just as good a vocalist.