Scales: do you practice the lowest position with the most open strings?

[SunByrne]

When I warm up before I practice I play a few scales and yes, I usually play the lowest E minor using three open strings. I think it's a good exercise to try to get the fretted notes to sound as similar in tone as possible to the open ones.

 

[stringthrough]

Unless there is a valid reason to play notes on an open string, i.e. lowest E note, I stay away from them as do most pros. Why? . . . . .

1) They are harder to control - muting; instead of 2 hands sharing the duty, the left hand (for righties) is less effective
2) They sound a bit different than fretted notes - A note played over a plastic or bone "fret" sounds different than one played over metallic fret

That said, upright and fretless players use open strings more than players playing fretted basses because it helps them more accurately intone notes played higher up the neck.

 

[dkelley]

Take the key of C for example:

• I can play in open position and take advantage of the open D and G
• I can start on the third fret of the A string
• I can start on the eighth fret of the E string

But they each sound a little different. Open strings don’t allow for the normal muting you get when you fret. Third fret sounds the most natural to me. Eighth fret has an unnaturally high sound – – not very bass like at all.

That's why I have always avoided them. I also avoid them as a holdover from being a classical violinist first and foremost, so open strings can't get vibrato to really sing.

But yea, depending on the bass, open strings can soudn amazing. I try to own/play basses who's open strings sound about the same as fretted notes.

The open string scales are critical... you should practice them and be aware of what the possibilities are.

 

[Nev375]

The determining factor on whether or not to use open strings should have to do with tone. Does the note sound better on the open or 5th fret in the context of the song?

You gotta practice both to be able to use both.

 

[MVE]

Good question. The use of open strings is invaluable. In my early days (which was the early 70s for me) of learning, my instructor had me using strict OFPF over the 1st four frets and open strings, playing all of the available notes of the arpeggios following the Circle of 4ths. Granted, I concentrated more or arpeggios than scales, but the desired learning objective was the same; the ability to incorporate open strings in my playing without getting lost. The use of open strings allows you to efficiently change positions and are really great to use as passing notes. I've been doing it a long time and even today, when I'm just sitting around noodling, I'll run thru that exercise. I'd like to see more open string exercises by those who teach on YT.

I have been playing for 30 years and NEVER use open strings.
But your response has inspired me to start giving it a try. Thanks

 

[matthewbrown]

There are many melodic motifs that you can play most easily using open strings, and the open strings allow hammer-ons and pull-offs as an articulation that you can't otherwise get. Think of all those lead guitar solos you've heard that use this technique. This is especially useful for slapping and tapping, but also for walking lines.

 

[brianrost]

Yes, I do practice the lowest positions using open strings. On the DB it's a necessity, on BG it's a skill worth having.

 

[obimark]

Open strings are good at times. A lot of rock songs use open A and E as a pedal.

 

[SunByrne]

Open strings are good at times. A lot of rock songs use open A and E as a pedal.

Indeed. Talking Heads “Psycho Killer” make heavy use of the open A. Drives me crazy when I see people play it on E5. Watch any live performance; Tina always plays it on open A.

 

[steve_rolfeca]

Lots of good info already provided.

One further thought, passed on to me by studio heavy Dave Fields, when he was my instructor in college:

• Just as plucking closer or further from the bridge varies your tone and attack, the same applies to your fretting hand:
  
  • You get brighter, more aggressive tones closer to the nut.
  • Compared to the open G on the first string, every other G on your bass that sounds in the that octave is going to be a little darker and rounder.
  • The same applies to every other note on the instrument.
• At the end of the day, for maximum grunt, play as close to the nut as you can, even if it complicates your fingering a bit.
  
• For rounder tones, move the part up the fretboard, and onto the lower strings.

 

[Wasnex]

Unless there is a valid reason to play notes on an open string, i.e. lowest E note, I stay away from them as do most pros. Why? . . . . .

1) They are harder to control - muting; instead of 2 hands sharing the duty, the left hand (for righties) is less effective
2) They sound a bit different than fretted notes - A note played over a plastic or bone "fret" sounds different than one played over metallic fret

That said, upright and fretless players use open strings more than players playing fretted basses because it helps them more accurately intone notes played higher up the neck.

I started on upright, so I learned a different approach that uses opens strings. This is not just about intonation, it's also somewhat about the strength needed to play the instrument, and how to efficiently get around the finger board. Of course, when one is playing with a vibrato or tempering a pitch, one cannot rely on open strings. So when necessary, and upright player will avoid open strings as well.

I developed nuanced muting techniques that allowed me to apply the necessary after touch to the open strings, so I don't really feel #1 is all the relevant.

The significance of #2 varies somewhat with the material of the nut, bridge construction, string type, and how fresh the strings are IMHO. The open strings stand out as particularly garish on only one of my basses, and that instrument has a brass nut. My assumption is a brass nut is going to be the worst case, because a finger on a fretted string will dampen the sound somewhat.

For the rest of my instruments with non-metal nuts, I don't think it's as big of a deal as you are making it out to be. Rather the sound gets progressively darker from the open string as you fret towards the 5th fret, which would be the note you would fret in place of the next higher open string. So for example, 5th fret G (on D string) will be darker than 1st fret G# ( on G string), and open G will be brighter that 1st fret G#. Either way your dealing with a subtle color change, but in the mix it's generally not significant enough to cause any problems.

To be honest, I don't really think about whether I play a note with an open string or closed, I just play. I tend to prefer the stringy sound I get from playing closer to the nut, rather than the thick sound some people prefer from playing in higher neck positions. In other words, I might prefer the brighter sound of 1st fret G# (G string) over the darker 6th fret G# (D string).

For the record I play a 6-string Yamaha TRB6P and like a full range sound.

Also I was a touring pro for about 25 years, and the last couple of times I did recording projects, the engineer was really complimentary to how clean and controlled my playing was.

 

[nnnnnn]

• I can start on the third fret of the A string
• I can start on the eighth fret of the E string

But they each sound a little different. Open strings don’t allow for the normal muting you get when you fret. Third fret sounds the most natural to me. Eighth fret has an unnaturally high sound – – not very bass like at all.

I've never heard anyone describe C on the E string as high or not bass-like before, especially when compared to the same pitched note played on a thinner string.

Normally playing the C on the E string gives the note less treble than playing the same C at the 3rd fret of the A string. Or speaking more generally, normally all notes sound less bright (which is often perceived as more bassy) when moved to the adjacent thicker string.

 

[JW56789]

Often, you must play 'down there' to do what needs doing. So yes, it's part of the scales to work on.

 

[KenD]

I was wondering something about practicing scales: how important is it to practice scales in the very lowest position, the one where you'll be playing multiple notes on open strings? It seems like I rarely see pros playing in this position, but I may be mistaken. Thoughts?

Fretless players use open strings all the time as an intonation reference on the fly. I have read that Jamerson, being originally a double bass player, transferred that over to his playing on the PBass.

 

[MichelD]

I do it all the time. Much of the time. Sometimes all the time.

 

[Nephilymbass]

I was wondering something about practicing scales: how important is it to practice scales in the very lowest position, the one where you'll be playing multiple notes on open strings? It seems like I rarely see pros playing in this position, but I may be mistaken. Thoughts?

I think it’s more important to be able to play scales 5th fret and below. But that said once you can play them reasonably well it’s also good to know them all over the neck because I know for me I actually use different fingerings in different octaves. For example take B major. B, C#, D#, E, F#, G#, A#, B. When I play B major starting on open low b on a 5 string I start by playing open b , middle finger on the 2nd fret, and pinky finger on the 4th fret. But when I play the same scale in higher octaves I use very different fingerings. For example I’ll start by playing b with my middle finger, then c# with my pinky and D# on the next string with my index finger.

 

[jassthebass]

Generally speaking after something is learnt in every key - I practice arps & scales using roots in C, G, E & F.
For me this encompasses all fretted & open 'shapes.

Practicing in E right after F (or vice versa) is a brain twister tho'

Slaterz!

 

[boombloom]

I never used open strings until I took up the upright back in '94. I thought open strings were hard to control and slowed me down. Worse than that they were something else I had to learn. Now I think they're another essential tool and I use them at times. They bring out different chord shapes, scales and ideas.

 

[Papageno]

As I play (mostly) DB and also fretless BG, open strings are essential for me in order to:
1. anchor the intonation
2. give the left hand a little bit of rest (especially on DB)
3. make shifts easier.

The different tone of the open string (brighter) is something that one can master (to some extent) with appropriate right hand technique (by using more flesh, one can somehow compensate the tone difference). This is very dependent on note duration (a note of very short duration that is muted immediatly will be much more tolerant of tone difference than a long held note).

On an acoustic instrument (DB., ABG), the unplayed open strings contribute very much to a fuller resonant sound, due to sympathetic resonance. That's why they should not be muted; it's just the opposit of electric BG.

 

[obimark]

Indeed. Talking Heads “Psycho Killer” make heavy use of the open A. Drives me crazy when I see people play it on E5. Watch any live performance; Tina always plays it on open A.

Exactly and Tool made an entire career out of playing open D drones (detuned and regular D). I also have seen Geddy use open strings live MUCH more then I thought he did.