• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

setting up the ultimate bass synth :D

#23
When I need to trig Softsynths, I only play 12th fret and up or use a Piccolo strung bass.

I GASing for a 6 string bass for that reason , upper register trackin.

That's why I absolutly love the VB99 , the tracking is almost perfect without any latency whatsoever down to the lowB.
The synths sounds are somewhat limited (you have to tweek) but it does it perfectly.
 
#24
I had a good experience with pitch-to-control-voltage on that Korg X-911, but as everyone has stated you have to adapt to it - play in the middle to upper register only, play cleanly/precisely, and prepare the input signal (preamp, comp, bandpass filter, etc...). Those were my expectations going in, however, as I appreciate that at least one cycle of a waveform needs to be analyzed in order to derive frequency. This takes time, and there's no getting around physics. With a low note on bass you have a longer wavelength, and as a result it requires more time to perform that pitch-to-cv or pitch-to-midi process. That's why piccolo basses are a good idea for this, and why Hagstrom (Patch 2000) and Steve Chick went the way of fret sensor technology (Peavey Midibass, Industrial Radio, et al.)

My best tracking bass synth is this: :)

DSCF0003.jpg


That era of the Roland GR stuff didn't do pitch conversion, but rather processed the actual sound from hex or quad pickup into a single waveform that feeds the remainder of the synth. Limited sounds, but very expressive and playable - and sounds very much like a synth! I had a G-88 bass for a while too, and that thing played pretty nice in the lower register (and that was using it with the GR-100 and GR-300... never did get a GR-33b)

I haven't tried the VG* stuff yet, but would like to. I have a box that converts those old 24-pin Roland guitars to the newer 13-pin standard. Love those guitars - still have the strat-version also.
 
#26
chromium said:
There is no doubt a Roland system is the better value, and a different animal really. It is worth noting that bass-processing is not the primary driver behind why I have a modular system . But since it's here...
DonKartofflo said:
yeah that's really also my point. I really like the axon bass to midi and how it tracks like a friggin bloodhound. but ive seen demos of the rs-35, and i must say it tracks incredibly and on the other hand, i just have to connect a dark time sequencer or some keyboard and a midi-cv interface and I'm ready to go techno all over the place :D :D
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Sounds like you have the right idea about modular synth. I might not opt to go that route just for doing bass pitch-to-cv, but if you have an interest in exploring beyond that (seems like you do), then you will probably enjoy it. There is some interesting signal processing potential available there. Here's another half baked example I dug up of that - just some screwing around... This is Alembic bass -> F2B preamp -> DBX166 -> Synthesizers.com instrument interface (q118) -> Bode Frequency Shifter (COTK 1630) -> Buchla-clone lopass gate (Cynthia QLPG):

http://www.hillscloud.com/music/GalaxiasChaosBlues.mp3

The frequency shifter gives that atonal effect, sort of ring-mod-esque... but different. That thing is fantastic used more subtly to process drums, put into feedback loops to animate sounds, etc... (there are versions of all these modules for Eurorack, btw)

Older shot of my synth with the Bode module:
DSCF0173-1.jpg


The guitar was also whacked up with the modular too, with a fast-clocked sequencer controlling the filter cutoff. A midi-to-CV device/module will help with sync'ing the sequencers and other modulators to the track tempo from a DAW.

I'd recommend Invalid Link Removed for some info/research on the products you mention in your original post, as well as the rs35. There are a number of threads discussing ways to prep an input signal for the rs35, its limitations, and some polarized opinions of that unit. That place has a very active buy/sell/trade area as well, and Eurorack can often be found for 60-70% of new prices there (lots of EU members there also). Great way to audition modules and have an exit strategy in the event you don't click with something...

Look forward to hearing your experience with this!
 
#27
JehuJava said:
What guitar is that, chromium? Did you have to mod it for that connection?

I've heard from previous tb posts that the Kieth mcmillan pitch to midi box was much better than the axon fwiw.
Click to expand...

Hey - that one is a Roland G-808 (guitar) connected to a GR-300 (the blue synth unit). Its all stock (big old 24-pin connector hooks the guitar up to the floor unit), but also pretty old - circa 1981. I'm a real freak for the old Roland gear, but I also don't gig this stuff (my bass rig is very traditional in contrast), and I repair old synths and tape echos as a hobby. Not sure I'd want to depend on anyone for that given the cost and horror stories... and old synths do break down (I've picked up most of my stuff in poor states of repair).

Here's my Roland G-505 with the GR-100 "synth" (not really a synth.. more of a hex-fuzz, comp/sustainer, envelope filter, and chorus):

DSCF0043.jpg



Here's a shot of the G-88 bass (now sold - liked it, but the guitars do the job just fine) with friends:

DSCF0084.jpg
 
#28
chromium said:
That era of the Roland GR stuff didn't do pitch conversion, but rather processed the actual sound from hex or quad pickup into a single waveform that feeds the remainder of the synth. Limited sounds, but very expressive and playable - and sounds very much like a synth!
Click to expand...

That's true again of the VB99.
Roland calls it COSM , it process the analog signal of the 6 pickups , that's why the latency is so low.
No pitch to MIDI involved.

Chromium , looks like you know your Roland stuff , I say that for other people who might not know about the VB99.
Very nice collection !
 
#31
fokof said:
Their guitars were made by Ibanez with the Roland sticker on it.
Click to expand...

Yep - made in the Fujigen Gakki factory like Ibanez and Greco of that era. Good stuff. The "GR" on the headstock stood for Greco-Roland.

DSCF0037a.jpg



I have an Ibanez ST-980 8-string from that same era, and its definitely cut of the same cloth

DSCF0044a.jpg




JehuJava said:
Wow...amazing collection, chromes! Seriously!! I wanna say Roland's demise was merging with Boss. I never knew Roland made instruments to connect to their gear. Awesome!
Click to expand...

Thanks! I love those old Roland guitars. Really sweet players, IMO.
 
#32
Okay damn that macmillan stringport is also a nice lil box...
But I'm sticking with the rs-35 since i really love the modular setup (I have just discovered that theres a modular version of my dreamfuzz, the malekko B:assmaster :O).
My Idea (and both my local electrohead and the guys at schneidersladen.de (german synthstore) found it pretty nice) is to run the bass signal into the external input module, then into a buffered multiple, from there one way into the mfb filter, to filter it down all the way and another one straight into the mixer. then from the mfb into the rs-35 and from there into the analogue solutions osc-sub (I'm getting this vco instead of the mfb osc-02 cause i prefer the british sound of the analogue solutions vco) and from there into the mixer. The mixed signal then into the multimode filter and from there into the vca :)
I know that tracking below the low A sgonna be tough but i really hope the rs-35 will manage that, but if not i wouldn't be too disappointed cause i really play my bass most of the time on the upper three strings :)
Furthermore I'm not really worried about the overall tracking, because from what i've seen, the rs-35 is really really accurate and fast :D

Here are two vids of the rs-35 which i find pretty nice:

Synthesizer External Processor Analogue Systems RS35 Radiohead synth solo - YouTube

NAMM 2009 - Analogue Systems guitar synth w/ Blues Saraceno - YouTube
 
#35
I too have been on a lifetime quest to find a sound that i cant quite achieve with stompbox pedals. Wether or not i ever find that sound tho,.. I must say that I have come across some cool pedals that have really killer sounds that do a superb job of synth-esque sounds. Im guessin you've looked at EHX gear,..if you've gone as far as you have in the thread I just read you've taken it a cpl steps further than I have. Despite the fact that the EHX Micro-bass synth doesnt do what I wish i could,. it does atleast do alot more than most stomp boxes could dream of. I have a synth/envelope filter sound I can get on my Garage Band recordings but i cant get my bass to do that sound thru my amp with my gear.

How can i get a sample sound from GarageBand to be the effect I want in realtime playing? Any suggestions?
 
#36
if you want to go the way of using a notebook i would consider having a look on a rubbish looking software audio2midi. even if the look tells you it can not work - i used it two years ago gigging live - got a latency of 5ms (maximum) with handling polyphony with my fender jazz bass and an epiphone thunderbird.

roughly my setup was a quadcore pc, rme fireface soundcard, audio2midi, ableton live with vst instruments like moog synth, kontakt sampler, mellotron,... i switched sounds with a behringer fcb1010 floorboard which also allowed me to change parameters in realtime using the pedals.

did about 20 gigs with this setup and for me it worked out nicely.
 
#38
amos said:
edit: chromium: were you using the rs35 on this track? I read about your signal path, didn't see a pitch to cv in there.
Click to expand...

There's no pitch-to-cv going on there - that one was just the direct bass signal being mangled by the modular synth's frequency shifter, and then sent out in stereo through a couple of lopass gates (filters w/their freq controlled by led+photoresistors; have kind of an "acoustic" nature to them). I used an envelope follower in the synth to control the frequency of the lopass gates based on my playing dynamics.

Thought I'd post those clips since DonK seemed to be heading down the modular synth path - just to show that you can do some pretty stragne stuff to a bass signal without having to necessarily resort to pitch-to-cv, deal with tracking issues, and so on.
 
#39
johndough247 said:
Has anyone here used the midi bass mentioned in an earlier post?
Click to expand...

I owned a Peavey Cyberbass once, which basically uses the same system.
It does track great, but it has - due to the pickup system - some issues: no bendings, hammer ons/offs and/or glissandos are being picked up.
So, you have to (at least I had to) seriously change your way of playing, if you want to make the step to this midi system. This is also the reason why I sold it after having and virtually not playing it for ~2 years.

Br, Matthias
 
#40
schafhalter said:
I owned a Peavey Cyberbass once, which basically uses the same system.
It does track great, but it has - due to the pickup system - some issues: no bendings, hammer ons/offs and/or glissandos are being picked up.
So, you have to (at least I had to) seriously change your way of playing, if you want to make the step to this midi system. This is also the reason why I sold it after having and virtually not playing it for ~2 years.

Br, Matthias
Click to expand...

Industrial radio picked up where Peavey left.
Not sure it's perfect as far as catching playing subtilities but I think they upped the standards since your Peavey.

I plan on ordering one of these in 2012 depending on the tax return damage !
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back