Setting Volume Level

[frsbdg]

First off, I'm a complete beginner with performing live. Our band has so far only played local open mic nights - we just played one last night at a club we'd never played before. The backline was an Ampeg head with what appeared to be a 4x10 cabinet. The amp wasn't mic'd so I assume it was direct input to the PA. When I plugged in, it felt a bit too loud so I dialed back my volume a bit. Once we started playing though, I found myself really plucking the hell out of the strings to hear myself in the mix. In hindsight, I probably should have turned up my volume and played normally. I'm assuming the sound guy set my volume to match the other players, but don't know for sure.

The sense I get is that the sound coming out of the amp is primarily for my benefit, and the audience mostly hears what comes from the PA. If I have that right, I welcome suggestions on how to set my volume so that I can hear myself in the mix without whaling on the strings.

Thanks!

 

[s0c9]

There's no hard/fast/simple rule... being able to figure out how loud you need to be on stage is something that comes with practice and experience.
In your case, with backline provided (if you're not the first band up), take a look at settings on the amp.. if the volume is set at a specific level, leave it where it is.. unless it's blowing your ears off.

FWIW - since you didn't specify venue size, no mic on the cab doesn't mean the amp is DI'd to the PA.
That's why they call it backline.. it produces enough volume for the venue.
It might be that the 4x10 is the ONLY bass source in the house..
Another guide on volume is to ask someone you know in the audience (BEFORE you go on stage) to let you know if you need to turn up or down.
Since no-one beat you up over the volume, you were probably fine!

 

[bigboy_78]

I've found that when you first plug in it sounds stupid loud, but once the drummer starts you realise it wasn't so bad.

 

[EastCoastThump]

If you play a bunch with the same band at the same venues, you develop a feel for where to set the bass amp's volume.

When you play with multiple bands, it can vary from band to band (and venue to venue). If I'm not sure about the stage volume during sound check, I'll usually set the stage rig volume against the kick drum once the wedges and FOH are up. If necessary, I'll pull stage level back down once we get past line check and into the sound check's shake-out song.

 

[TedH]

Simple sound check for the rhythm section is to have the drummer lay down a standard beat (ie kick, snare, hi hat) and just play something to that. Someone knowledgeable should be about 20ft away and tell you if its balanced.

As for the amp level vs your bass volume, that gets interesting, especially at an open mic night where people are bringing active and passive basses, active basses with dead pre-amp batteries, etc. The quick sound check should help you determine gain and volume levels, and ideally in such a setting, the amp levels would be up a bit, and the players would adjust the volume on their guitar, not the amp itself. In theory.

 

[Downunderwonder]

Depends how big the room is. In a bar with less than 200 capacity there aren't many rock bands that need PA support for bass or drums aside from the kick. Assuming there's bass amp enough to keep up with the unamped drums.

 

[hrodbert696]

Yeah, like people have said, a lot of situations are possible. Sometimes you're on your own and your amp is your whole sound. Other times it's just for stage volume and there's a sound guy taking a DI and you're just in his hands. In an open mic situation you don't really get to sound check so trust the sound guy if there is one, otherwise best you can tell from where you are. If the band doesn't have a sound guy and is running its own board from the stage, the important thing is to get someone out in the house listening to the mix, at least from time to time. In my band, the guitarist runs the board and sets levels, then when he comes up on stage to set his own I go out (I've got a wireless) for a final check.

 

[ga_edwards]

Simple sound check for the rhythm section is to have the drummer lay down a standard beat (ie kick, snare, hi hat) and just play something to that. Someone knowledgeable should be about 20ft away and tell you if its balanced.

As for the amp level vs your bass volume, that gets interesting, especially at an open mic night where people are bringing active and passive basses, active basses with dead pre-amp batteries, etc. The quick sound check should help you determine gain and volume levels, and ideally in such a setting, the amp levels would be up a bit, and the players would adjust the volume on their guitar, not the amp itself. In theory.

This +1 regarding sound checking with the drummer. I find getting the rhythm section balanced is key to getting the rest of the band mixed in. If the drums and bass are talking nicely to each other, it's relatively easy to mix everything in at sensible volumes.

If I were you, if using a shared amp at an open mic night, try leaving the master volume as is and adjust the input gain instead. With a bit of luck, it might even have a clipping light. Set this so it just lights when you attack the bass hard and you should have a volume consistent with other people using the same amp.

 

[groove pump]

When I haven't gigged for a while, I sometimes catch myself going too hard on my strings, too. I suppose my wee brain is trying to generate more volume by either fretting the strings with more pressure or getting them to wiggle with a lot more energy. It happens...

I suppose whenever you recognize that happening, just turn up a little bit so that you feel like you can play with a little more touch and not exhaust your hands. Works for me.

 

[tshapiro]

A general rule... Everyone plays louder 2 or 3 songs into the show than during sound check. So, keep that in mind when setting your volume.

 

[FuturePrimitive]

And also generally, what you hear on stage sounds nothing like what the audience is hearing. I've played gigs where the only thing I heard was the constant droning resonance of the bass drum. Seriously, everythig else was just a mash of noise, I couldn't hear myself, vocals or guitars. Talking to people afterwards though everyone said we sounded great. :-/

 

[4Mal]

A general rule... Everyone plays louder 2 or 3 songs into the show than during sound check. So, keep that in mind when setting your volume.

My band is set and forget... Once we're settled with a given room, we save the PA settings as a scene and use them the next time in. We are hawkish about managing stage volume. Lot's of vocals. You simply have to be - or rely on in ears...

Setting your level is one thing. Choosing where to stand in relation to the kick and your amp is maybe even more important. If you get that right, you don't need as much on stage. I personally locate to the left and slightly ahead of the kick. I set my level on stage based on the drums as I hear them. My amp is usually behind the floor tom and slightly left. Small rooms, I use a small rig further off to the left and point it more towards the drummer. I'll hear myself in the mains as much as the amp in that case.

We can also add kick or bass to the wedge (s) on the other side of the stage... The kick and bass in my band are always in the FOH even in low volume settings. We like that 'integrated' sound.

If there is one guiding principal for us it is to use the lowest stage volume we can and let the PA do the heavy lifting volume wise... If the noise level comes up in a room then we'll go up a notch, but we do it together.

Four years with no personnel changes makes this all a heck of a lot easier. We're all on the same page... We're also basically a three piece plus a lead singer with a keyboard and harmonica. If this were a 5 or 6 piece that's a whole other kettle of fish. More peoples can sound great but it get's less nimble and the volume level tends to come up.

 

[tshapiro]

My band is set and forget... Once we're settled with a given room, we save the PA settings as a scene and use them the next time in. We are hawkish about managing stage volume. Lot's of vocals. You simply have to be - or rely on in ears...

Setting your level is one thing. Choosing where to stand in relation to the kick and your amp is maybe even more important. If you get that right, you don't need as much on stage. I personally locate to the left and slightly ahead of the kick. I set my level on stage based on the drums as I hear them. My amp is usually behind the floor tom and slightly left. Small rooms, I use a small rig further off to the left and point it more towards the drummer. I'll hear myself in the mains as much as the amp in that case.

We can also add kick or bass to the wedge (s) on the other side of the stage... The kick and bass in my band are always in the FOH even in low volume settings. We like that 'integrated' sound.

If there is one guiding principal for us it is to use the lowest stage volume we can and let the PA do the heavy lifting volume wise... If the noise level comes up in a room then we'll go up a notch, but we do it together.

Four years with no personnel changes makes this all a heck of a lot easier. We're all on the same page... We're also basically a three piece plus a lead singer with a keyboard and harmonica. If this were a 5 or 6 piece that's a whole other kettle of fish. More peoples can sound great but it get's less nimble and the volume level tends to come up.

This was kinda of funny bc you spent most of your post saying how your groups volume doesn't go up and then in the last sentence you flip and say if it's a full band then the volume goes up ☺

 

[4Mal]

Ah you misunderstand. My point is that the more players you add, the louder it gets and the more difficult it becomes to keep everybody on the same page... For us, 4 people is a full band and being hawkish on the stage volume, and not turning up 2 or 3 songs into a set, this just isn't a problem for us.