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Single Malt Scotch!

#861
Shoot me down for saying this, but my only 'issue' with Bowmore these days is that they're foreign owned and these days they're mass producers, so they've lost a lot of the 'specialness' that you'll find in a lot of smaller distilleries in Scotland.

No doubts they make a good drop, but for me I like a wee bit of character in my whisky if I'm going to drop serious 'cash' on it.

Sub $75 and it's much of a muchness(!) lots of decent stuff there, but go 'large' particularly with some of the smaller distilleries, which are getting harder to find and you'll get the reward.

Discuss......or not!
 
#862
Thunderitter said:
Shoot me down for saying this, but my only 'issue' with Bowmore these days is that they're foreign owned and these days they're mass producers, so they've lost a lot of the 'specialness' that you'll find in a lot of smaller distilleries in Scotland.
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You must drink lots of Edradour, then, and not drink any: Balvenie, Macallan, Glenlivet, Glenmorangie, Glenfiddich, Glen Grant, etc, etc, etc.


To me, a whisky is its taste, pure and simple. I like to read about where it comes from, but if Laphroaig were suddenly sold to BP, and nothing about the recipe changed, I would still drink it and count it among my favorites.

EDIT - I've tried Edradour's Rum Cask malt, which is probably one of the lowest-volume malts under 15 years old. Edradour is operated by three people, and the Rum Cask was a fraction of their output one year. It was good. But it wasn't any better just because it was exclusive.
 
#863
Eric Cioe said:
You must drink lots of Edradour, then, and not drink any: Balvenie, Macallan, Glenlivet, Glenmorangie, Glenfiddich, Glen Grant, etc, etc, etc.


To me, a whisky is its taste, pure and simple. I like to read about where it comes from, but if Laphroaig were suddenly sold to BP, and nothing about the recipe changed, I would still drink it and count it among my favorites.
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But I think the focus of his comment was that the recipe DID change. He said:

"and these days they're mass producers"

I was assuming he was indicating that meant the whisky was being made different than it was before, and that's how it lost some of its "specialness".

No?
 
#864
Eric Cioe said:
You must drink lots of Edradour, then, and not drink any: Balvenie, Macallan, Glenlivet, Glenmorangie, Glenfiddich, Glen Grant, etc, etc, etc.


To me, a whisky is its taste, pure and simple. I like to read about where it comes from, but if Laphroaig were suddenly sold to BP, and nothing about the recipe changed, I would still drink it and count it among my favorites.

EDIT - I've tried Edradour's Rum Cask malt, which is probably one of the lowest-volume malts under 15 years old. Edradour is operated by three people, and the Rum Cask was a fraction of their output one year. It was good. But it wasn't any better just because it was exclusive.
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You got me, I'm on fire and augering in, but you missed an important point of what I said; the words 'foreign owned'. There are plenty of whiskies out there to buy and savour that are Scottish run and owned. (and for the record I'm not an Edraour drinker!)

Buying a Whisky that's owned by a Japanese mass producer takes some of the magic out the experience for me. Sure they've brought a new level of constancy to the product, but for me Morrison Bowmore was producing more 'interesting' stuff before they were bought, these days it would seem to be headed solely for the Japanese and duty-free markets, lots of blended no age spirit, good but leaves me missing something. Of course I can't knock them for wanting to make a profit, but once I'm up over $75-$100 I'll buy something else and preferably Scottish owned - and I'm Scotsman living in the US before you ask!

EDIT - Just read Vic's post and I've touched on that point above.
 
#865
Vic said:
But I think the focus of his comment was that the recipe DID change. He said:

"and these days they're mass producers"

I was assuming he was indicating that meant the whisky was being made different than it was before, and that's how it lost some of its "specialness".

No?
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But that's not often the case. Distilleries don't change the shape or size of their stills to create more volume, they add more identical stills. The only thing to worry about is what strand of barley is being used, but that changes year to year based on crop, and has little or nothing to do with who owns it. Some years there just isn't enough Golden Promise, say, but it's not like any distillery is going to not make whisky that year because they haven't got their preferred barley.

I think that thunderritter's point is that mentally he enjoys it less because it's foreign-owned, not that the taste is different. To me, that's missing the point, but we've all got our opinions.

EDIT - And they aren't Japanese mass-producers. They are Japanese companies owning the distillery, maybe expanding it a bit, and probably trying to come up with new expressions they think will sell. It's not like once Bowmore changed hands they started brewing the stuff in huge warehouses and came out with a flavorless spirit like vodka.
 
#866
Eric Cioe said:
...I think that thunderritter's point is that mentally he enjoys it less because it's foreign-owned, not that the taste is different...
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But that's not what he said. He commented that the product DID change... at least that's the way I read this part of his post...

Thunderitter said:
...for me Morrison Bowmore was producing more 'interesting' stuff before they were bought, these days it would seem to be headed solely for the Japanese and duty-free markets, lots of blended no age spirit, good but leaves me missing something...
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#867
Vic's right, IMHO the character of the Whisky has changed, particularly over the last 10 years or so. In particular the taste of their lower priced whiskies has changed IMHO. I'm not missing the point, but I respect you thoughts on the matter.

In most cases you don't add stills to increase production (it's whisky not bourbon!) you just work the stills more throughout the year! To do that you may need to sub contract malting and mashing. The real key to volume and age is barrel management, some of which is down to the physical characteristics of the spirit (that's where the distillery manager earns his money) and the other is how much of a certain age of whisky you use. Single Malt does not mean single barrel! You're average bottle of X year old whisky is a blend of several whiskies (as I throw the cat amongst the pigeons!) all from one distillery of course, as is the case in a Single Malt and the age is set on the age of the youngest whisky in the mix.

...finally in comparison to how Morrison originally ran their distilleries the Japanese do now mass produce. A lot of the process is now done away from the original distillery (malting, bottling, storage, etc.) I'm not saying one is better, except I'm a bit of an old romantic, particularly when it comes down to something as 'simple' as whisky.

....at the end of the day the ownership issue is a bit like buying an American made Toyota or the like and for me I'd rather have a Ford!
 
#869
zachoff said:
I normally drink Bowmore Legend because it's cheap and tastes good. If I want to spend more on a special bottle I'll get Ardbeg or Macallan or Laphroiag or Talisker or whatever strikes my fancy at the time. BL is purely a cost:benefit purchase for me. :D
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I've been looking for a bottle of that locally, but so far, no soap. I have an idea I'll like it, and the price is definitely right! Could be a good "well drink" for me... no special situation needed, just want a nice simple dram. :)

Edit: Just found a bottle! $30.50. :)
 
#870
Tried some of the Legend last night, and I must say, it's a nice drink. Shopper's Vineyard claims Michael Jackson gave it a 9/10 in the mag, but I find that a little hard to believe. Most folks rate it well above average, but mention it's not very complex and the finish is short. I agree with this, but I also like that about it.

If this were a $100 bottle of scotch, I'd probably be looking for something with a lot more going on, but for a "regular drinker" class of scotch, it's wonderful, IMHO. I love how "simply tasty" it is. Sometimes I like a drink that's flavorful, yet right down the middle of the fairway like this and recovers quickly for another sip.

IMHO, recommended.
 
#874
beggar98 said:
Yikes- You'll need the drinks more than I will!
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I've got a pretty fair Scotch stash at home so I'll survive, though I'll be hitting it pretty hard once I've got all the I-s dotted and the T-s crossed.

If you're in town for the weekend, be sure to check out the Whisky Shop on Sutter Street while you're here. It's a pretty good Temple of Whisky. Don't bring the visa card with the big limit on it though...
 
#875
Well, Whiskey Fest was absolutely awesome. Highlights were the Balvenie 21yr Port Wood (amazing, but at $200/bottle well out of my price range) and the Glenrothes 1994, which at only $60/bottle is more my speed. Way too many great whiskeys there to remember them all. Anyone who is a fan of scotch, bourbon or Irish, I highly recommend attending one of these.
 
#877
tombowlus said:
Wow, folks! I just received an e-mail link to a phenomenal offer, and felt that I had to share it with my bass-playing, whisky-drinking brethren!

Invalid Link Removed :eek:

It appears that this may be replacing the 15-yr, btw.

Tom.
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I nabbed one of these myself. Couldn't pass it up.

BTW, regarding replacing the 15, here's the comment they had posted about that... kinda' interesting...

"Will you prefer the new 18 year old to the 15 year old it is replacing? That depends. I enjoy the balance and subtle complexity of flavors with the 15 year old, but I also like the enhanced richness, mouth-coating creaminess of the 18 year old. The higher strength (and no chill-filtering) of the 18 is certainly a bonus"
 
#878
Vic said:
I nabbed one of these myself. Couldn't pass it up.

BTW, regarding replacing the 15, here's the comment they had posted about that... kinda' interesting...

"Will you prefer the new 18 year old to the 15 year old it is replacing? That depends. I enjoy the balance and subtle complexity of flavors with the 15 year old, but I also like the enhanced richness, mouth-coating creaminess of the 18 year old. The higher strength (and no chill-filtering) of the 18 is certainly a bonus"
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Yup, that's right, folks. Vic and Tom, who have been tag-teaming for years to give bass players GAS, are now moving on to the realm of SAS (scotch acquisition syndrome). :D
 

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